Going Digital!

[Billfort]

Hey, I don't doubt both your glowing endorements of the new iFi Micro iDSD with iPower supply. Also, the many reviews. Is there more of an in dept review to read on any short comings? Kinda like that poor review the iFi Nano got by that UK magazine. Reason Im looking at the iFi Micro iDSD more critically is because A: I do not have any DSD files yet. I do have over a dozen HD Tracks.com albums at 24bit 192khz. and B: For a little more money I can buy a $1500 to $2000 unit used at half the price that does not support DSD.

One more thing, I do not require battery portable unit. This is strickly for my home 2 channel system.

The thing is though, DSD is the whole point (IMO). What I like about this new wave of DSD dacs is how good some of them can sound when you feed them ALL your digital in that format.

I honestly think that much of the secret-sauce here comes with using sophisticated software (HQplayer for me) on a high-power computer to do the filtering and conversion, then using a dac that is good at doing the (apparently simpler) task of doing DSD processing only - forget the PCM at the dac level.

Sure, DSD source material is pretty damn special but what these dacs (and the right software) can do with PCM conversion has led me to park a very capable PCM 'only' dac.

 

[slippers-on]

Hey, I don't doubt both your glowing endorements of the new iFi Micro iDSD with iPower supply. Also, the many reviews. Is there more of an in dept review to read on any short comings? Kinda like that poor review the iFi Nano got by that UK magazine. Reason Im looking at the iFi Micro iDSD more critically is because A: I do not have any DSD files yet. I do have over a dozen HD Tracks.com albums at 24bit 192khz. and B: For a little more money I can buy a $1500 to $2000 unit used at half the price that does not support DSD.

One more thing, I do not require battery portable unit. This is strickly for my home 2 channel system.

I for one haven't found any bad reviews on the Micro. I've been with the Micro for about 21 or 22 days. I've purchased one DSD64 file, but mostly do DSD on the fly upsampling from 44.1 or FLAC files. What I'm hearing is out classing every CDP I've heard, and I've also ripped about 4 CD to DSD 128 and the resolution is amazing.

Personally, I wouldn't spend that kind of money on a DAC that doesn't do DSD, simply because I think all things digital is headed that direction...DSD & DXD. It's just a matter of time. You may find that $2000 Used DAC out dated after a while. Early last year I had a dealer friend here in St. Louis offer me a Used Audio Note DAC for $700. I told Oscar about it at the time...and I think it's the same DAC Bilfort has. I turned him down. It would have been sitting in a corner some place due to the Micro.

My next DAC....if I decide to move on, may very we'll be the Lampizator Amber DAC, or any DAC that can be upgraded. I won't throw good money on a DAC unless it's able to do DSD and upgradable. They just simply change to soon with better technology.

Please don't let the fact the Micro can be used as a portable. In fact, I tell people it's really a Hybrid....it's a portable if need be, or you can hit the switch on the DAC from preamp to direct mode, turning it into a stationary device, and by pass the battery using the PSU. At that point it's not even using the 5v from the computers USB but from the PSU....It's a portable and a stationary DAC...mine is stationary and seems to operate like any other stationary component in my system.

As for its sound...Its a warm DAC sounding DAC, very musical, very transparent, and great insight into the music. Every neaunce...ever small detail and every other sound you've never ever understood was on the CD is heard. Intruments seems to have more separation, and it has an excellent front to back and side to side as well as top to bottom soundstage. Tone is absolutely spot on,as I belive its all due to the excellent clocks inside the DAC. Believe me you....if you got bad clocks in a DAC, you'd know it. The only thing that scared me about the iFI before I purchased was the fact they went away from what I believed was the best chip, the Sabre chip. The previous iDAC had the Sabre chip...the iDSD DAC has a Burr Brown chip. Well they are a very well respectable company as well, and I'm happy I didn't let that stop me. It's a amazing device.

I've did a shootout with my TT and the Micro....I believe the Micro is giving me the same insight into music with the same or even better resolution.....both out class a CDP.

I don't have any proof, but I do believe the IDSD DAC or any good DAC is only going to be as good as the supporting gear. I have no problem hearing any of the detail and I have lots of resolution over here. I don't know that to be the case In Every system. I was reading over at Audio Asylum and have seen it on other forums where some have said they can hear any difference In DSD and PCM.

 

[Kt77]

Guys.........., listen up!.

After listening to these devices since 9:43 this morning when they were delivered, I'm talking stone cold out of the box - I'm hearing deeper into the soundstage then I hear when I owner a Sony SCD-777ES between 1994/2004, and through its replacement an Accuphase DP-65V in 2005/06 and while I had considered both of them well above average in regards to the way they played music in a very emotional manner - yet with different tones and said resolution compared to what I've been listening to today - and by all means take into account, I haven't even heard DSD through it yet, as my Mac Mini isn't due until next month as I've been trying my best to sort out everything I'd be looking for in one prior to buying it, as well as obtaining the other pieces to put around it.

But......., and it's a big one, I'd go so far as to say as I wrote Byron once again moments ago, the best $700 investment I've ever made - and I've owned ICs that cost more then these devices that weren't half as musically involving - excuse me for being so bold as to say what I'm about to say - but f€<~k a CD Player, and I'm borderline on saying that about a Turntable as well.

Billfort - Livestrong - Byron - Norman got this shite right..........., I'm hearing a truer sense of resolution - cymbal decay that's second to none ( and those of you whom are familiar with ECM recordings know how well they recorded cymbals on that label ) piano notes/strikes that linger upwards towards the Heavens and bass fingering techniques that would out Jonas Hellborg version of Little Wings on the top of anyone's demo list again as it did in the late 90s.

Once again, I don't get a single red cent for trying to express my findings on a very rare product that ticks all the boxes in such a manner, it's hard for me to want to turn in - but I must as I woke early this morning eagerly awaiting its arrival, and with eyes/mind blown from doing more reading about them as well as just caught up in a state of amazement as to the purity I'm hearing is once again very very very very rare during my times working audio retail as a buyer whom travels many foreign lands as a means of finding components that would suit our stores rather erotic clientele as far as sonics went, and I managed to hear a lot of gear during those days, in so much as I'll test some of you right now - and ask one very simple question which I more or less hinted at in my last posting - which country produced the very best sounding CD Players bar none?.



Answer - France.

Those whom know - know I'm right. As with tube gear coming from Japan, and while a few of my friends question me on why I love imported audio components so much as opposed to American made gear - it's simply because I feel many American designers lost their ways coming out of the 80s, and in 1995 had all but surrendered to greed, not musicality as we once heard/felt it - but something totally different that only appeared to those with far deeper pocket then most - and then they'd sit back and catch it from the same nations they fought against ( I'm Canadian born, so it doesn't count or matters to me ) like in the British building better sounding Turntables - the Germans in producing more accurately balanced tube gear - turntables and speakers ( which most Americans can't even understand what it is some dislike about them - it's called uncolored transparency - or lack of sugar coating ) and Japan for making some of the best sounding cables - tube components and tubes I've ever heard, and yes they beat them at their own game - they were taught by Americans and then turned around and beat them where it hurts........, their wallets.

All that to say what you long-winded olde goat?, the foreigners have beat us again - and I'm going to go out on a limb here and say..........., act fast - because when these things catch on, and they shall - prices are going to rise.

All I can end this with is, the group behind these devices are extremely talented and voiced them so right........., it hurts.

Wake the f^|k up before it's to late. There you've my truth. I'm done for now, but don't sleep on this shite..........., lest you want to waste money on the big dollar designer labels/brands that is?. You've been informed.

 

[Kt77]

I for one haven't found any bad reviews on the Micro. I've been with the Micro for about 21 or 22 days. I've purchased one DSD64 file, but mostly do DSD on the fly upsampling from 44.1 or FLAC files. What I'm hearing is out classing every CDP I've heard, and I've also ripped about 4 CD to DSD 128 and the resolution is amazing.

Personally, I wouldn't spend that kind of money on a DAC that doesn't do DSD, simply because I think all things digital is headed that direction...DSD & DXD. It's just a matter of time. You may find that $2000 Used DAC out dated after a while. Early last year I had a dealer friend here in St. Louis offer me a Used Audio Note DAC for $700. I told Oscar about it at the time...and I think it's the same DAC Bilfort has. I turned him down. It would have been sitting in a corner some place due to the Micro.

My next DAC....if I decide to move on, may very we'll be the Lampizator Amber DAC, or any DAC that can be upgraded. I won't throw good money on a DAC unless it's able to do DSD and upgradable. They just simply change to soon with better technology.

Please don't let the fact the Micro can be used as a portable. In fact, I tell people it's really a Hybrid....it's a portable if need be, or you can hit the switch on the DAC from preamp to direct mode, turning it into a stationary device, and by pass the battery using the PSU. At that point it's not even using the 5v from the computers USB but from the PSU....It's a portable and a stationary DAC...mine is stationary and seems to operate like any other stationary component in my system.

As for its sound...Its a warm DAC sounding DAC, very musical, very transparent, and great insight into the music. Every neaunce...ever small detail and every other sound you've never ever understood was on the CD is heard. Intruments seems to have more separation, and it has an excellent front to back and side to side as well as top to bottom soundstage. Tone is absolutely spot on,as I belive its all due to the excellent clocks inside the DAC. Believe me you....if you got bad clocks in a DAC, you'd know it. The only thing that scared me about the iFI before I purchased was the fact they went away from what I believed was the best chip, the Sabre chip. The previous iDAC had the Sabre chip...the iDSD DAC has a Burr Brown chip. Well they are a very well respectable company as well, and I'm happy I didn't let that stop me. It's a amazing device.

I've did a shootout with my TT and the Micro....I believe the Micro is giving me the same insight into music with the same or even better resolution.....both out class a CDP.

I don't have any proof, but I do believe the IDSD DAC or any good DAC is only going to be as good as the supporting gear. I have no problem hearing any of the detail and I have lots of resolution over here. I don't know that to be the case In Every system. I was reading over at Audio Asylum and have seen it on other forums where some have said they can hear any difference In DSD and PCM.

You rocked the boat, but I've your back.

The key word is

" they can't hear ".

It has nothing to do with the technology, in so much as its implement. Some DACs simply don't do DSD justice, end of story. I couldn't help myself on that one.

Peace little Brotha.

 

[livestrong]

Boy - it is getting heavy in here! I can't wait to jump back in on the fun

 

[BenWaB3]

Hey, I don't doubt both your glowing endorements of the new iFi Micro iDSD with iPower supply. Also, the many reviews. Is there more of an in dept review to read on any short comings? Kinda like that poor review the iFi Nano got by that UK magazine. Reason Im looking at the iFi Micro iDSD more critically is because A: I do not have any DSD files yet. I do have over a dozen HD Tracks.com albums at 24bit 192khz. and B: For a little more money I can buy a $1500 to $2000 unit used at half the price that does not support DSD.

One more thing, I do not require battery portable unit. This is strickly for my home 2 channel system.

Here's 140+ pages of discussion on it:

http://www.head-fi.org/t/728236/ifi...eadphone-amp-impressions-reviews-and-comments

Along with its great approval rating they'll also point out anything they don't like about it.

 

[slippers-on]

I read through a lot of that during my research. Most of its about headphones. Lots of Nano talk as well as Micro...not much about two channel.

 

[StylinLP]

Woa, you guys sure did respond to my question! Thanks for all that. Im ready to bite the bullet. The only thing that has me hesitant is the fact I have not read a full balanced unbiased review yet. Just short and sweet "Its amazing" reviews. It seems to me after reading many reviews of other DACS and also the iFi Nano that this DAC should have some sort of lack in bottom end weight, or full stage dept just because of the fact the unit is so small with no overbuilt power supplies and descreet analog output stage...Like how the Lampizator Amber DAC or any other $2000+ DACS are described in reviews. Example: Seventeen linear power supplies power various sections of the DAC-12 DSD, including a dedicated toroidal supply for the DSD section.

Slippers-on in your opinion what sound benfit do you think you will hear if you did upgrade to the Lampizator Amber DAC?

 

[Lee Harvey]

Woa, you guys sure did respond to my question! Thanks for all that. Im ready to bite the bullet. The only thing that has me hesitant is the fact I have not read a full balanced unbiased review yet. Just short and sweet "Its amazing" reviews. It seems to me after reading many reviews of other DACS and also the iFi Nano that this DAC should have some sort of lack in bottom end weight, or full stage dept just because of the fact the unit is so small with no overbuilt power supplies and descreet analog output stage...Like how the Lampizator Amber DAC or any other $2000+ DACS are described in reviews. Example: Seventeen linear power supplies power various sections of the DAC-12 DSD, including a dedicated toroidal supply for the DSD section.

Slippers-on in your opinion what sound benfit do you think you will hear if you did upgrade to the Lampizator Amber DAC?

Stylin, for best results using the iDSD Micro you want to use the iFI USB power supply with it. The iFI guys figured out that they could make a quieter power supply than what they could get out of Lithium Ion batteries. Its a 5 volt system so you don't really need huge transformers to supply that kind of voltage and current. Actually the USB PS uses a 9 volt wall wort to supply the power it uses to put out enough clean 5 volt current to power the iDSD.

Vinnie Rossi of Red Wine audio uses Lithium Ion batteries in the Red Wine gear but on his new Signature line he is using the new ultra capacitors for a power supply. Which he gets cleaner power for his new LIO amp. http://vinnierossi.com/

There are newer, better ways to skin a cat these days when it comes to power supplies for audio gear.

 

[slippers-on]

Woa, you guys sure did respond to my question! Thanks for all that. Im ready to bite the bullet. The only thing that has me hesitant is the fact I have not read a full balanced unbiased review yet. Just short and sweet "Its amazing" reviews. It seems to me after reading many reviews of other DACS and also the iFi Nano that this DAC should have some sort of lack in bottom end weight, or full stage dept just because of the fact the unit is so small with no overbuilt power supplies and descreet analog output stage...Like how the Lampizator Amber DAC or any other $2000+ DACS are described in reviews. Example: Seventeen linear power supplies power various sections of the DAC-12 DSD, including a dedicated toroidal supply for the DSD section.

Slippers-on in your opinion what sound benfit do you think you will hear if you did upgrade to the Lampizator Amber DAC?

Hi StylinLP!...

Let me put it to you like this. One of my audio buds here in St. Louis has Nelson Pass amp and preamp, $11k...Mark Levinson CDP, $15k.....Revel F52 speakers, $9k, and all cables and power cords are Clarus Audio cables, about $5-7k. Clearaudio Performance TT $3k. lots of sound there.

He was at my house 2 weeks ago listening to my DAC. You see my gear list in my signature. When we turned our attention to the Micro after listening to vinyl for a few hours, his first words were "WOW". A few days later he told a mutual friend, "it doesn't perform like a budget DAC...you get lots of sound". It's not lacking in bass or full stage depth. Every one in the reviews aren't fibbing to you...this thing is one of those amazing products that don't come around that often.

The most expensive DACs I've heard where over the course of a few weeks and in the same system. The first where the PSAudio Direct Stream in a shootout with the Lampizator Level 5. There was trade offs in those two DACs but the owner sold the PSAudio DS and kept the Level 5. He then traded it In For the Level 7. After a while he had to send it to Poland to the factory to have it checked out for some strange noise and was given the Amber DAC until he got his back from Poland. All 4 of those DACs are worthy of their calling with the Level 7 being the best one as it should retailing at $10k.


It's a bit hard to speculate having not had the Amber in my system, but perhaps The sound difference would probably be a richer sound coming from the tubes in the Amber DAC it's self. Maybe a more extended sound stage, even greater seperation and greater resolution, and even perhaps the ability to see into the sound stage a bit more? But who knows.....the iFI Micro with PSU is $700 compared to the Amber including DSD $2k. I really don't think it's a $1300 difference in sound, but perhaps the Lampizator name and the ability to upgrade it?

All I can tell you is , Every DAC I mentioned in this posting can do DSD...but it's an option on the Amber, not standard. And all the DACs sound great with the 3 different brand names having trade offs....all of them are great.

 

[Billfort]

There are newer, better ways to skin a cat these days when it comes to power supplies for audio gear.

There certainly are - and it makes a difference IMO. I was a little concerned when getting the Concero HD as it uses USB power so is somewhat at the mercy of what is feeding it - and since that's usually a computer switching PS...well, certainly not optimal.

I started using an Ethernet connected, wall wort powered streaming device to get that noisy computer way out of the room which ends up being a great way to utilize a linear, regulated supply for both the streamer and the dac. This B&K unit has good specs (WAY better than a PC supply), no cooling fan and was a $60 grab off the used market.

DSD and HQplayer were a huge improvement in my system but the streamer, PS and Wireworld USB cable (not shown in this pic) all contributed some towards and very nice digital front end that gives my vinyl a run (sometimes...).

 

[slippers-on]

Bill....is your system connected to a whole house network or just its own network with computer and external drives in another room being streamed via Ethernet to the Concero?

 

[Billfort]

Concero/streamer Ethernet to the main router which also has the player PC and NAS plugged into it. The rest of the network is plugged into another switch and my in-room remote control laptop is wireless.

I originally had the streamer plugged into the separate switch but had problems - all worked fine when all the audio stuff was into the same router/switch. I've read that it's possible to wire the streamer direct to the player PC but then you'd need another NIC or wireless to get to the NAS...It works well now so I'm done messing with it.

 

[slippers-on]

Concero/streamer Ethernet to the main router which also has the player PC and NAS plugged into it. The rest of the network is plugged into another switch and my in-room remote control laptop is wireless.

I originally had the streamer plugged into the separate switch but had problems - all worked fine when all the audio stuff was into the same router/switch. I've read that it's possible to wire the streamer direct to the player PC but then you'd need another NIC or wireless to get to the NAS...It works well now so I'm done messing with it.

Seems simple enough....does it require a high bandwidth rate to function smoothly?

 

[StylinLP]

Hey, I just found this on Stereophile website. My Melody i2a3 tube intergrated amp has balanced inputs. This looks like a prefect fit with descrete analog outputs with no OpAmps in the signal path.

iFi iDSD Mini DAC
http://www.stereophile.com/content/ifi-idsd-mini-dac

AMR's iFi line starts dinky with the iDSD Nano, gets slightly larger with the iDAC line and then tops out (as far as size goes) with the new iFi iDSD Mini DAC.
Still not large by normal component standards, the Mini, which was shown in prototype form at the show, handles a wide range of digital sources including up to 24/384 PCM, DSD, Double DSD and DXD. Also included on the back is a full range of input jacks, with a volume control and headphone jack on the front.

Inside, there is aptX Bluetooth streaming, 4 Burr Brown DACs, and 4 filters set by the user. Retail price will be under $1,000 and it should arrive sometime this quarter according to the distributor, Avatar Acoustics.[Quote\]

 

[Kt77]

Hey, I just found this on Stereophile website. My Meldody i2a3 tube intergrated amp has balanced inputs. This looks like a prefect fit with descrete analog outputs with no OpAmps in the signal path.

iFi iDSD Mini DAC
http://www.stereophile.com/content/ifi-idsd-mini-dac

AMR's iFi line starts dinky with the iDSD Nano, gets slightly larger with the iDAC line and then tops out (as far as size goes) with the new iFi iDSD Mini DAC.
Still not large by normal component standards, the Mini, which was shown in prototype form at the show, handles a wide range of digital sources including up to 24/384 PCM, DSD, Double DSD and DXD. Also included on the back is a full range of input jacks, with a volume control and headphone jack on the front.

Inside, there is aptX Bluetooth streaming, 4 Burr Brown DACs, and 4 filters set by the user. Retail price will be under $1,000 and it should arrive sometime this quarter according to the distributor, Avatar Acoustics.[Quote\]

All I can say is - that if what I'm hearing over the course of the last 2 days can be used as a barometer.........., the Mini is certainly going on my list of must owns later on in the year.

The iDSD Micro DAC is highly musical to the point, I've already sold 7 of my friends on buying their own based upon what I hear - how's that for trust.........

 

[slippers-on]

Hey, I just found this on Stereophile website. My Melody i2a3 tube intergrated amp has balanced inputs. This looks like a prefect fit with descrete analog outputs with no OpAmps in the signal path.

iFi iDSD Mini DAC
http://www.stereophile.com/content/ifi-idsd-mini-dac

AMR's iFi line starts dinky with the iDSD Nano, gets slightly larger with the iDAC line and then tops out (as far as size goes) with the new iFi iDSD Mini DAC.
Still not large by normal component standards, the Mini, which was shown in prototype form at the show, handles a wide range of digital sources including up to 24/384 PCM, DSD, Double DSD and DXD. Also included on the back is a full range of input jacks, with a volume control and headphone jack on the front.

Inside, there is aptX Bluetooth streaming, 4 Burr Brown DACs, and 4 filters set by the user. Retail price will be under $1,000 and it should arrive sometime this quarter according to the distributor, Avatar Acoustics.[Quote\]

Bro...with that amp you have, any one of those iFI products are going to be excellent! And they also have the vacuum tube headphone amplifier and processor "mini iTube" coming out as well.

 

[Billfort]

Seems simple enough....does it require a high bandwidth rate to function smoothly?

Don't think so - I'm using an old Netgear WDNR-3700 1G router and it's been rock solid passing DSD128 DoP using generic Cat5e cables.

I did have 1 issue with it recently though and it was all about 'wireless'. I have a PC, laptop, tablet , a couple phones, printer and my listening room control point all using wireless. For some reason, the whole wireless house-of-cards locked up recently which had no effect on the music playing, but without a control point I had to deal with it (of course the family wanted it 'dealt with' too ).

Simple conclusion for me - a wired network for NAS>player>NAA and even control point is good, relying on 'wireless', not so good.

 

[slippers-on]

Yeah...the wireless Access Points can get bogged down. All APs aren't created equal. Most time when they get finicky and stop working...a quick power cycle works. Some times, quality of the AP factors in alone with the size and how many clients are on it...but you didn't seem to have much....but yeah, a wired connection I find best as well.

 

[RH67]

Byron

I have been using a Fiio X3 for my Hi Rez playback which also uses the Burr Brown chip.

Have you had a chance to listen to the Fiio? the Fiio is also portable and you can upload Hi Rez files directly to it, no computer near the listening room. I ask because i`m wondering if they sound close to each other. The Fiio sounds great but i had always considered it as filling a gap until i could afford something which i thought would be better.

I do not want to purchase the iFi Micro iDSD Dac and find that it`s no better than the Fiio X3.

I`m new to this so i need all of the guidance that i can get, thanks.