Help with hooking up a Equalizer Please

[jgscott]

I have a Yamaha model # CGQ2015A Dual Channel 2/3 octave Equalizer. On the back it has a Channel A and channel B what looks like a Phone/Mic OUTPUT jack, and a Channel A and Channel B Phone/Mic INPUT jack.

Im trying to tie it into a Yamaha RX-V1000 Receiver. And a pair of speakers to EQ them. I'm thinking I have to get a Phone/Mic male connector from Radio shack or somewhere and make 4 plugins for the 2 output females and 2 input females on the EQ. Then connect A/B output from the EQ to the left and right speaker?

Then run the other 2 A/B - Left Right to the back of the receiver with RCA plugins. Is this the right way ?

And where would I input to the receiver ? Would I go from input on the EQ to the left right speaker A connectors in the receiver amp ? Is this right ? ( I'm sure it's Not)

Also is a 2/3 octave Equalizer good ?

Here are the EQ specs - http://usa.yamaha.com/products/live_sound/processors/gq2015a/?mode=model

Here is the Yamaha RX-V1000 pdf of the rear of the Receiver-
http://www2.yamaha.co.jp/manual/pdf/av/english/re/RX-V1000.pdf

 

[Punker X]

Moving from Tuners forum to General audio. Had nothing to do with tuners...

 

[Markw]

Equalizers don't go anywhere near speaker terminals, they use tape monitor inputs and outputs.

As for the specifics, ther have been at least three "how to" threads detailing this within the past few weeks. Please check them.

Here's a good example. Terra1 gives a great diagram on page two. Ignore the diagram on page 1.

 

[Portkula]

I'm thinking I have to get a Phone/Mic male connector… and make 4 plugins for the 2 output females and 2 input females on the EQ.

Sure.

Then connect A/B output from the EQ to the left and right speaker?

Oh, no, no!

Then run the other 2 A/B - Left Right to the back of the receiver with RCA plugins. Is this the right way ?

No, no!

And where would I input to the receiver?

On the receiver, you have both to output from the receiver to the EQ by connecting the “MD/TAPE OUT (REC)” to the A/B (left-right) inputs of the EQ, and to input to the receiver from the EQ by connecting the A/B (left-right) outputs of the EQ to the “MD/TAPE IN (PLAY)” of the receiver.

Then try the following: select the “MD/TAPE” by the “INPUT MODE” on the receiver, and select the input to listen to being equalized (or not, if you by-pass the EQ by its “EQ” switch) – by the “REC OUT/ZONE2” selector (except for its “MD/TAPE” position). Play the source you wish and try the EQ’s sliders moving effects.

Also is a 2/3 octave Equalizer good ?

And why not?

 

[jgscott]

Moving from Tuners forum to General audio. Had nothing to do with tuners...

Thanks. Could not figure where to put it.

 

[Portkula]

…try the following: select the “MD/TAPE” by the “INPUT MODE” on the receiver, and select the input to listen to being equalized (or not, if you by-pass the EQ by its “EQ” switch) – by the “REC OUT/ZONE2” selector (except for its “MD/TAPE” position). Play the source you wish and try the EQ’s sliders moving effects.

And finally, what about this way to do? It failed? Or no more need to do?

 

[toddalin]

The back of the receiver should have a Preamp output and Main amp input for the L/C/R. There is probably a "jumper" linking these.

Just remove the jumpers and connect the Preamp outs to your eqs inputs and your eqs outputs to the Main amp inputs and you got it.

 

[donberry]

The back of the receiver should have a Preamp output and Main amp input for the L/C/R. There is probably a "jumper" linking these.

again, there have been quite a few threads on this. The place to put the eq is in the tape monitor, not just for convenience, but also for noise

 

[Portkula]

again, there have been quite a few threads on this. The place to put the eq is in the tape monitor, not just for convenience, but also for noise

You are quite right.

 

[toddalin]

again, there have been quite a few threads on this. The place to put the eq is in the tape monitor, not just for convenience, but also for noise

The Yamaha Owners' Manual for this very model says to do just what he wants to do just as I said to do it.

Their recommendation so...

 

[kevzep]

The back of the receiver should have a Preamp output and Main amp input for the L/C/R. There is probably a "jumper" linking these.

Just remove the jumpers and connect the Preamp outs to your eqs inputs and your eqs outputs to the Main amp inputs and you got it.

You are quite right.

The Yamaha Owners' Manual for this very model says to do just what he wants to do just as I said to do it.

Their recommendation so...

Most if not all domestic Equalizers sensitivity is -10dBu, the output of a pre-amp is in the region of +4dBV, and a power-amp will take +4dBV.....
So the pre-amp will have too much output for the EQ, and the EQ will not have enough output for the Power-amp, so you will have a gain miss-match....
You will end up driving the input of the EQ too hard to compensate for the lack of output.....this in most cases will make you system noisy.

They design the EQ's to match the sensitivity of Tape monitor/ Noise reduction adapters/inputs and record outputs because there are many amplifiers/receiver which dont have pre out and main inputs, and most people want to use the EQ over all their inputs, the Tape monitor is the best way to facilitate this.....Their sensitivity is different from a pre-amp input and output......

This subject has been raised and discussed many many times, and it seems obvious to me.....
The sensitivity of my G-9000 is 1.5VRMS
The output of the G-9000 pre-amp is 1.5RMS (+6dBu)..
All you have to do is look up the specs of the EQ to find out.....
Professional EQ's are different however and will not work very well in the Tape Monitor because pro EQ's are generally +4dbV
+4dbV= +6dBu = 1.5VRMS.........common amplifier sensitivities....
The other Standard is 0.775VRMS= 0dBu = -2.2dbV.......FWIW....

 

[kevzep]

Just had a look at the Equalizer the OP is using, which obviously nobody else did, the EQ is a professional EQ and looking at the specs it can be used between the pre-amp/power-amp, its rated at +4db, I assume its dbV, so YES you CAN and it will work just fine.......

 

[toddalin]

Well having a couple of the Yamaha 31-band pro eqs and a big Yamaha receiver, I can point to reasons why the OP would NOT WANT TO USE THE TAPE LOOP.

First off, the tape loop only monitors the source physically selected at the receiver. IOW, if the user wants to switch from television to CD, he has to physically get up and walk over to the receiver to switch the tape monitor to CD. The tape source does not change with the listening source selected.

Next, the tape monitor outputs will only output from analog sources. If the receiver is doing the converting from digital to analog, nothing (or noise) comes out the tape outs.

So, just maybe Yamaha knew what they were doing when they recommended using the pre-out/main in for eqs.

 

[kevzep]

Well having a couple of the Yamaha 31-band pro eqs and a big Yamaha receiver, I can point to reasons why the OP would NOT WANT TO USE THE TAPE LOOP.

First off, the tape loop only monitors the source physically selected at the receiver. IOW, if the user wants to switch from television to CD, he has to physically get up and walk over to the receiver to switch the tape monitor to CD. The tape source does not change with the listening source selected.

Next, the tape monitor outputs will only output from analog sources. If the receiver is doing the converting from digital to analog, nothing (or noise) comes out the tape outs.

So, just maybe Yamaha knew what they were doing when they recommended using the pre-out/main in for eqs.

In the nicest possible way, I think you are missing the point.......
Some of the members here were posting based on the EQ being a domestic model.....and my post about sensitivity and gain still applies.
Sensitivity and gain above everything else including convenience and being clever about how how want to configure the system must reign supreme...

Refer to my two posts above and you will see what I am talking about.......
My explanation is fairly generic based on older HiFi gear........a lot of discussions here are about just that, in this case it is not and thats fine....Carry on......

All you comments are void and pointless unless the gain and sensitivity of the EQ are matched to the Pre and Power-amp as I said before.....So I referenced what EQ was being used........

I was talking in my first post about about the design of domestic EQ's with regards to older 70's-80's hifi gear and the way manufactures intended EQ's to be integrated into systems......
As I just said before, this is not the case in this situation, so carry on its all good.....

Yamaha knew what they were talking about with regards to hooking a professional EQ to their systems, NOT a domestic -10dbu equalizer......you will have a sensitivity and gain miss match, and thats what some of the other members were talking about, all they had to do was to click on the OP's link to see what gear he was using, which is what I did......

I use a BSS FCS 926 (with an FCP900i and 900r, interface and remote) on my system between the pre and the active crossover, which is a professional parametric EQ..........

All the best....:thmbsp:

 

[toddalin]

In the nicest possible way, I think you are missing the point.......
All the best....:thmbsp:

In the nicest possihle way,

No actually, I think that you are all missing the point.

I read what the OP posted and what equipment he was using and looked at the manual that he provided the link to.

Having similar equipment, I posted the only logical way to connect up the equipment that was described. Everyone else was addressing a generic set-up when specifics were given.

 

[kevzep]

In the nicest possihle way,

No actually, I think that you are all missing the point.

I read what the OP posted and what equipment he was using and looked at the manual that he provided the link to.

Having similar equipment, I posted the only logical way to connect up the equipment that was described. Everyone else was addressing a generic set-up when specifics were given.

I read it too, and reposted regarding the obvious and best way to hook it up.......theres a wealth of information on this forum from a lot of well informed members, theres no need to turn this into a pissing competition....

Im sure the OP now has all the relevant information, were about done here then........

 

[jgscott]

Just had a look at the Equalizer the OP is using, which obviously nobody else did, the EQ is a professional EQ and looking at the specs it can be used between the pre-amp/power-amp, its rated at +4db, I assume its dbV, so YES you CAN and it will work just fine.......

Yes he is quite correct about this. So this is not the problem but.... there are NOT "quite a few threads on this", because I search, for my case of hooking that Yamaha Professional EQ to that RX-V1000.

Here is the problem. I can hook it to, ( SEE PDF Page 14 Indicator #4 top of Back Labled (Play) MD Tape and Rec Out. It will not EQ anything/nothing ! It does work cause I hooked it to CD then ran the CD to the EQ and it will EQ the CD player.

I even called Yamaha Customer service and they had a Teir 2 support guy call back and he said it could not work to play all sources, which is what I want. All, FM, CD, DVD 5.1,. He said because it does not have a Tape monitor selection/Input. Someone else said to get a DBX 200 or DBX400 and do the switching with that.

Can someone look at the links I posted of the instructions on my first post, and tell me if this is true. Please . Thanks

PS: Heres the other confusing thing. I use a PS3 for my CD music player, which is connected with a Optical cable. So does this mean I can even EQ CD's playing thru the PS3 ? :sigh:

 

[Markw]

I even called Yamaha Customer service and they had a Teir 2 support guy call back and he said it could not work to play all sources, which is what I want. All, FM, CD, DVD 5.1,. He said because it does not have a Tape monitor selection/Input. Someone else said to get a DBX 200 or DBX400 and do the switching with that.

Who are we to argue with the people that made your stuff. That bolded line is the key to the equation, and was pretty much made clear in that linked thread.

Sometimes you just can't get there from here.

PS: Heres the other confusing thing. I use a PS3 for my CD music player, which is connected with a Optical cable. So does this mean I can even EQ CD's playing thru the PS3 ? :sigh:

Nope. not with an optical cable. Your EQ is analog. One would have hoped that after all the brou-ha-ha on this, tha tdfact's iportance would hav esunk in. Now,maybe if you used an analog out to the receiver but, even then, with the configuration of that EQ, it's implementation would be cumbersome and it's use would be limited to only that device.

 

[jgscott]

Who are we to argue with the people that made your stuff. That bolded line is the key to the equation, and was pretty much made clear in that linked thread.

Sometimes you just can't get there from here.

Nope. not with an optical cable. Your EQ is analog.
One would have hoped that after all the brou-ha-ha on this, tha tdfact's iportance would hav esunk in :saywhat:.
Now,maybe if you used an analog out to the receiver but, even then, with the configuration of that EQ, it's implementation would be cumbersome and it's use would be limited to only that device.

Not sure what you are saying.---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------^

1. 2 Yamaha cust serv reps admitted they had NO Idea about connecting EQ's period. To anything !

2. The Yamaha Rep was wrong about being able to connect at all, because I was able to connect that Yamaha receiver with a standalone CD player and EQ thru it ok.

3. I posted the links on my 1st post so that anyone who was "experienced with hooks ups could look and advise me how to hook it up. NOT get " generic set-up when specifics were given".

4. There are many post I read when people ask for help and post equipment info. When I don't know, I DON"T POST ANYTHING. Some should take this advise and save alot of confusion.

I'm not trying to be rude, but.... I do want to keep my thread to just the facts, on my equipment, not get a " in most cases situation".

Can someone tell me if I have a Preamp output and Main amp input, that is maybe named different on the RX-V1000 ?

Lastly Markw, I was kinda offened the way you responed, was kinda smart a _ sed to me. I always post respectfuly to others here at the forums.

 

[terra1]

1. First Markw was addressing the question about EQing ALL sources.
   
   Just getting the EQ working on the CD is not meeting all your goals.
   
   I think he was just trying to point out that you may be wasting a lot of time trying to make something work that hasn't so far. Especially if the Yamaha techs are correct that you need a tape monitor. I assume they were referring to the EQ.
   
   
2. If you want to ignore the Yamaha tip and if you think it may work, I would try the MD/Tape In and Out jacks again and make sure you have the settings correct on the Receiver and the EQ. Read the settings in the Recording tips section on how to select sources and input. I would have thought it could have been able to be hooked up to the Tape In and Out jacks and use the operating steps from the Recording instructions on how to select sources. But then, I'm just using my experience with "generic set ups."
   
   
3. I guess my question is what are you trying to accomplish sound wise with the equalizer?
   
   Has it been established you are trying to solve a specific acoustic problem or are you just trying to hook up the EQ just because you have one? How does it sound without an equalizer?
   
   One of the reasons equalizers faded from popularity was because A/V receivers already incorporated many sound fields that simulated various acoustic environments and venues. They also allowed very fine tuning of tone parameters. They often allowed you to store those settings. And they allowed connections to a subwoofer to enhance bass. You may need to add rear speakers to take advantage of the sound fields. But for most people there wasn't a demand for an equalizer because with everything else it gets too complicated.
   
   
4. Lots of people have tried to help already with little success because your facts and details have not been clear and slow in revealing themselves. It is natural for some of the early responders to assume things until you clarify them.
   
   The problem in a thread like this is we don't know exactly what you are trying or how you have the settings and connections. So unless your are more specific, sometimes it makes communications difficult, and frustrating.
   
   If you really want to use this EQ and using the Tape jacks don't work, it sounds like you're going to have to replace the RX-V1000 with something else it was intended to be used with. At least maybe something less complicated.
   
   
5. Or if you must have an equalizer, maybe get one with a Tape Monitor.