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Is Vintage Audio about Poverty or Appreciation?

I think the term "quality" is inadequate. Maybe we like vintage from a technical perspective because it is over engineered. It's also more furniture grade, not as spartan and focused as modern electronics.

Otherwise as performance goes and money no object modern gear just annihilates vintage. Electronics, sources and speakers today look like Science Fiction compared to vintage. No one in his right mind would try to disprove this (I hope). I think we need some time to pass and the economy to recover a bit so we start to really appreciate what the new gear can really do for us. Its so much better its not even funny.
 
Rob41 said:
Nice gear in your sig link Zebra. I'm diggin' the groovy shag carpeting. :smoke:

Hopefully we can stay on track with this "is vintage audio about poverty or appreciation" thread. And the vintage haters :thumbsdn: don't hijack yet another thread! :scratch2:
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Rob , you are correct sir about the hi-jacking .

I guess I am like most here . I was on the modern only , but it left me cold . Whether it's poverty or appreciation , I vote appreciation for vintage . The poverty aspect ( or incredible affordability ) is just a huge bonus . :thmbsp:
 
Pandovski said:
Otherwise as performance goes and money no object modern gear just annihilates vintage. Electronics, sources and speakers today look like Science Fiction compared to vintage. No one in his right mind would try to disprove this (I hope).
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I definitely agree with you, but Im in a different boat. You see, Im addicted to SETs, and there arent many off the shelf speakers out there that will play well with such low wattage. I have to turn to DIY efforts that will usually consist of a vintage driver, as those have the right efficiency and impedance curve for SET amps. In my experience, a vintage driver using modern cabinet design techniques can definitely hang with the modern speakers.
 
I'm still a bit confused over what determines if something is Vintage or an Antique.

How old does a component have to be to fit into the Vintage category?

My main rig is close to 20 y/o so it is not new and it is not Vintage, but is it Modern?
 
Hyfi said:
I'm still a bit confused over what determines if something is Vintage or an Antique.

How old does a component have to be to fit into the Vintage category?

My main rig is close to 20 y/o so it is not new and it is not Vintage, but is it Modern?
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Probably . When I see a post like this , it reminds me not to get too hung up on labeling everything .
 
BadassBob said:
I definitely agree with you, but Im in a different boat. You see, Im addicted to SETs, and there arent many off the shelf speakers out there that will play well with such low wattage. I have to turn to DIY efforts that will usually consist of a vintage driver, as those have the right efficiency and impedance curve for SET amps. In my experience, a vintage driver using modern cabinet design techniques can definitely hang with the modern speakers.
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Tube gear and Turntable playback today just blows my mind how better it is compared when it was mainstream technology back in its day. When we say modern gear unfortunately many people imagine cheap DVD players and AVR receivers siting on BestBuy shelves and not Bel Canto, Sonus Faber, Peachtree Audio, Naim, Spendor, Kuzma etc.

And those are the mid-fi of today. Ever seen the big boys that need forklifts and knocking down walls to get in the living room?
 
zebra03 said:
Probably . When I see a post like this , it reminds me not to get too hung up on labeling everything .
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I just want to hang, without having to go dumpster diving :)

I guess in 10 more years I will join the Vintage crowd, but then they will all have Antiques and I will be behind the curve again.

I don't get too hung up on labels anyway.
 
Hyfi said:
I just want to hang, without having to go dumpster diving :)

I guess in 10 more years I will join the Vintage crowd, but then they will all have Antiques and I will be behind the curve again.

I don't get too hung up on labels anyway.
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Not behind the curve in any way . Your just hangin' with us kewl kids at AK !!
 
Hyfi said:
Whoa! I just noticed you have a Sound Valves 101. My first tube pre was a Sound Valves 101i which was great for the $599 intro price when it was released. I tried the SS model and sent it back in 3 days.

Did you ever have problems with the Power Supply? My 101i has the PS replaced 2x and that is one of the reasons they ended up going out of business. They used a bad batch of PS's in all the 101i units and had to keep replacing them under warranty.

The last time I stopped in at RHB Sound Dezign, a custom mod house in my area, they had a 101i opened up for repair....yep, the power supply had gone.

Anyway, SV units were a great entry into high end sound and a very nice pre amp. I only sold mine because the VAC fell into my lap for next to nothing.
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So far, so good. I got my SV pre amp from another AKer who already had the power supply upgraded. I lucked out. I do love it though. First pre amp Ive owned with no tone controls. It was easy enough to get used too though since I usually always kept my tome controls set at flat or very close to flat.
 
BadassBob said:
The gear made today is built to last as well, you just wont find it at the big box stores :thmbsp:. I remember when I was a kid, Fretter and Highland Appliance sold some decent stereo gear, that was of much better quality than what your average Best Buy would sell today.
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In my day, stereo was bought in Audio stores, not big box stores.
 
Pandovski said:
Otherwise as performance goes and money no object modern gear just annihilates vintage.

Its so much better its not even funny.
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Huh. What, exactly, in technical terms, makes a "high end" amplifier "sound" so much better than an older one that measures identically?
 
Pandovski said:
And those are the mid-fi of today. Ever seen the big boys that need forklifts and knocking down walls to get in the living room?
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Before they went out of business several years ago, we had one of the larger High End stores around called Soundex. I bought my first little setup from them in the 70s before they morphed into a 22 room mega store for HE.

Upstairs they had all the HT setups while all of downstairs were 2 ch rooms. Room #1 was just off of the sales desk and was always populated with the biggest baddest gear one could hope to listen to.

I got to hear the Wilson Grand Slams, JM Labs Grand Utopias, 7 foot tall Dunlaveys, all the Krell, Mark Levinson, BAT gear and more including the full Dynaudio Arbitur electronics with the big Consequence speakers.

I will probably never own any of it by choice since I could blow my retirement fund if I chose to, but it made me appreciate what is out there and just how good some of the entry level Modern gear is. Diminishing returns kicks in big time but if you have the money, the toys are all available.

Anyway, I miss spending Saturday afternoons in Room#1 spinning my own disks on the baddest setups that can be assembled.
 
Pandovski said:
modern gear just annihilates vintage. No one in his right mind would try to disprove this (I hope).
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:thumbsdn:

Sorry, I disagree with you on both counts.

1. Your first statement is your opinion.

2. I am not crazy or otherwise not in my right mind because I don't agree with your bombastic statement.

3. I will say excellent quality exists within both camps but then again, I didn't think another VS. topic was the intention of the thread.

4. My wife sometimes says I'm crazy but my shrink just keeps asking me if I think I'm crazy. :D
 
chicks said:
Huh. What, exactly, in technical terms, makes a "high end" amplifier "sound" so much better than an older one that measures identically?
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That would be a different topic for a different thread. I asked the same question to Conrad here http://www.audiokarma.org/forums/showthread.php?t=521682&page=2 since I am modest in my technical knowledge about electronics. I'm pretty sure he is the better man to answer that one.

My logical answer would be if they measure identically they will perform identically. But we can play top trumps on a separate thread where you name vintage High Ends and I'll name new ones and we will see who has the better specs. :scratch2:
 
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