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JBL L166 Horizons

Can you guys tell me what the hole size is for the binding post? I am going to change them out for a good pair of decent 5 ways while I have all the drivers out for refinishing the cabs. Also while I have the woofer out I will check to make sure the vc is not scratchy etc. I hope it is ok though. I'm a little short on cash at the moment.
 
tarior said:
How long have you been re-coning speakers? I've been doing it since the late '90s. I'm also a fan of JBL and care enough, have the knowledge, and the professional contacts to get the job done properly.
I'm not sure where you get off saying that I, or the two aforementioned fellows, will ruin the value of the OPs speakers through incompetence or indifference.
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This isn't about whether you or any other reconer is competent.

Simply put, a pair of JBL L166 speakers with excellent original woofers / original drivers is worth more than a pair of JBL L166 speakers with aftermarket drivers/diaphragms/cones. OTOH, if the speakers have rough cabinets, non-original tweeters, no original grilles it really doesn't much matter what you put in the woofer baskets for value.

The L166 is a very good speaker, one of my favorite classic JBLs, but its value to me and other collectors is as an original, not for its ultimate SQ which will be less accurate than for example a pair of new Studio 590s or many other lesser-known used speakers. To retain their value they need to have the original parts.

Maybe you're willing to buy speakers without original parts, but if so I suspect you're not the guy who was the backup bidder on my $3,350 L100As last year, you are more likely one of those who might pay $500 for a flip. The guy who bought them, or any other of my well-preserved collection of JBLs and others is a guy who wants only original.

This is not a concept unique to JBL or to audio, there's original and there's everything else in a collectibles market.

If the OP were interested in reconing the speakers I would suggest finding a pair of baskets that are already without cones or with damaged cones to have reconed, and set these woofers aside for the later option of reuniting them with the original boxes and the best value to a collector.
 
True story. I bought a clean set of L166 speakers here on AK for a good price with non original woofers. They sat for awhile in my project pile and then found AKer was selling 4 woofers needing recone from 2 sets of different versions L65’s. These 4 woofers came with simply speakers recone kits. I reconed both sets and installed the correct woofers in my L166’s and sold the other set for virtually what I paid for both pairs.

now that was a worthy recone job.
 
Neither one
SaturationPt said:
This isn't about whether you or any other reconer is competent.

Simply put, a pair of JBL L166 speakers with excellent original woofers / original drivers is worth more than a pair of JBL L166 speakers with aftermarket drivers/diaphragms/cones. OTOH, if the speakers have rough cabinets, non-original tweeters, no original grilles it really doesn't much matter what you put in the woofer baskets for value.

The L166 is a very good speaker, one of my favorite classic JBLs, but its value to me and other collectors is as an original, not for its ultimate SQ which will be less accurate than for example a pair of new Studio 590s or many other lesser-known used speakers. To retain their value they need to have the original parts.

Maybe you're willing to buy speakers without original parts, but if so I suspect you're not the guy who was the backup bidder on my $3,350 L100As last year, you are more likely one of those who might pay $500 for a flip. The guy who bought them, or any other of my well-preserved collection of JBLs and others is a guy who wants only original.

This is not a concept unique to JBL or to audio, there's original and there's everything else in a collectibles market.

If the OP were interested in reconing the speakers I would suggest finding a pair of baskets that are already without cones or with damaged cones to have reconed, and set these woofers aside for the later option of reuniting them with the original boxes and the best value to a collector.
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A collector isn't gonna give top dollar for speakers with the woofers foamed on the wrong side, or a big wad of glue on the front of the cone. The value is already gone.
A JBL with the foam (looking at you, nolasally) on the wrong side will have a sunken suspension, and won't perform to it's full potential. Period. It will whack the mass ring on the pole piece.
I'm not even going to address the personal insult, other than to say that you don't know jack **** about me.

I buy my parts from the exact same vendor that Simply Speakers buys from, so I guess my recones are just as worthy, eh?
I reconed my 122A, and I'm glad that I did. Here is how they came to me:
DSCF2026.JPG

Original cone, cut down to accept a generic 12" surround. This was done in the 90s before proper sized surrounds were available in the aftermarket. The dust cap is also incorrect.
It could have been refoamed with the foam on the front to hide this, and an oversized DC could have also been installed. But that would be pretty hokey.
When I cut it apart, I found this:
DSC01734.JPG
DSC01735.JPG

Notice the heat damage? Notice the bubbling in the paper VC former from 30 odd years of humidity cycles? Notice the sunken and worn out spider? But hey, they worked and had original cones.
A lot of original JBLs from back in the day are in this kind of condition, I'd think "experts" like you would know this. Guess you're not such an expert after all.
The new (egdewound, just like original) VC doesn't have these problems. You tell me which you'd rather have.
The aftermarket cone was made in the same pressing plant as the ones JBL bought back in the '70. It is absolutely identical to original.
Pretty ****ed up and totally lost value now. NOT.
DSC04601.JPG
 
Wow, this needs to be nominated for the overreaction of the day.

I didn't insult you, nor did I intend to, and re-reading the post I don't even see how you could interpret it that way.

I am a collector (of sorts), and I really don't care if aftermarket parts perform as new, better, or worse. I only buy original. I am familiar with OE vs OEM parts, and although they can be the same, there is no guarantee, and the JBL stamp on an OE one is all that interests me. People to whom I've sold feel the same way. Making the comment that you are not the guy willing to pay hansomely for speakers from my collection isn't exactly a stretch, you've posted that you don't really care and in fact prefer new. If this is the comment that offended you feel free to tell me that I'm wrong and you do pay top-dollar for all-original JBL speakers. My comments are regarding collectors of original speakers, original automobiles, etc.

It hasn't been determined whether the OP's speakers have glue on the front, or something else, nor whether it can be cleaned suitably. It very well might be something that can be cleaned. The value of his speakers? Let's take it one step at a time and not toss the cones presuming that they're un-cleanable, or have coils, formers, and spiders that resemble the damaged ones in your photos.

Try to be a bit more civil here and not overreact please.
 
SaturationPt said:
Maybe you're willing to buy speakers without original parts, but if so I suspect you're not the guy who was the backup bidder on my $3,350 L100As last year, you are more likely one of those who might pay $500 for a flip.
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You wouldn't take this as an insult? Don't lecture me about being civil.

At any rate, I'm not suggesting that the only course of action for the OP is a recone. If they work, sound good, don't have sunken spiders, and he can live with the glue on the cone, then so be it. I wouldn't try to convince him to do otherwise, and if I hope that isn't how my post(s) was inferred.
There is no way that I'm aware of to get that glue off the cone without taking paper with it.
 
tarior said:
You wouldn't take this as an insult? Don't lecture me about being civil.<<snip>>
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No, I would not. I was simply trying to interpret what you have been posting, and I think it's a fair assumption. Regardless, if you are offended I apologize, I in no way intended it to be taken as an insult and drive you to swearing and anger, my bad.
 
Good morning. Today I started the disassembly of my speakers. I had a little trouble getting the woofer out, other than that it went smoothly. Just the one speaker so far. The VCs on the speakers seem fine. However, I noticed that they have deleted the woofer inductor, which doesn't make me too happy, why would they do that? I will have to go ask them if by chance they have it laying around somewhere. The rest of the crossover appears to be stock with original capacitors. I did notice during playback or at least it seemed to crackle a little bit from this speaker, that is why I started with this one to check the VCs. Could that be the original caps?
I have said that I wanted to put some 5-way binding post in them, but I see no way to do that without enlarging the holes, which I really did not want to do. If I want 5-ways is that my only option? Without the obvious option of just making do with the old ones.

edit: The second speaker was not any better, the inductor is also missing and one of the screw holes was damaged. Despite the PO saying it was a local speaker pro, I do not think that guy is all that pro.
Nonetheless, now to make them pretty again. That is glue all around the edge of the cone on the woofers from probably as you guys said, where it was on the front of the cone and was redid properly, other than that it looks fine.
 
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Those look like nice stands.
IIRC, the inductor delete is factory. When I rebuilt, or actually built all new, crossovers for mine, I ordered parts from looking at the schematic. But I ended up copying what was in the box, and I'm pretty sure that I didn't use the inductors that I ordered.
I could swear that I had a thread with pics on the crossover build, but darn if I can find it.
Don't be afraid to open up the holes for better terminals. You'll be glad that you did.
 
tarior said:
Those look like nice stands.
IIRC, the inductor delete is factory. When I rebuilt, or actually built all new, crossovers for mine, I ordered parts from looking at the schematic. But I ended up copying what was in the box, and I'm pretty sure that I didn't use the inductors that I ordered.
I could swear that I had a thread with pics on the crossover build, but darn if I can find it.
Don't be afraid to open up the holes for better terminals. You'll be glad that you did.
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I was thinking of taking the original crossovers out to save them and making copies also, I have seen pics of speakers where the inductors were in place, I wonder why they would delete them? Also is the black on the front and back of the cabs just paint or some kind of coating? My cabs are looking good, but the difference in shade is still there. So was there a lot of mismatch in pairs of speakers. As for my speakers, the serial number is only 2 apart. Sorry I have so many questions.
Thanks, everyone for helping out.

edit: I just realized that the back of the woofers does not have the aquaplas on them, I think maybe they reconed them also? Is that going to affect the sound?
 
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Not all 122A had Aquaplas. Some have a steel ring glued to the top of the voice coil to give them the correct mass and Fs.
As for mine, I inherited them from the original owner, a good friend of mine, who bought them new in 1976. I got the original shipping cartons and all.
I chucked the old crossovers and terminals in the scrap bin and built all new ones. They were over 40 years old, and due for replacement. I guarantee that I could sell my speakers for what any other pair are going for today.
These aren't Paragons or Hartsfields. Some improvements are perfectly OK.
 
So after looking at my woofers a little closer yesterday, I discovered that one of the speakers had a different glue on the center cap and the glue had lots of tiny little bubbles. So I pressed down with equal pressure on the woofer and the voice coil is rubbing :( I expect that just means the woofers need reconing.
Is there any recone kit you guys suggest or should I just let the guy who is going to do the recone get the kit?
 
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