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JBL speakers are they really that good?

Why have Levis remained popular ever since?
They tried to ditch the 501 a few decades ago but thankfully brought them back!

Me too...

But why are brand names so relatively important to us to the point of creating a following? Especially when there are other products of exact quality at a lower price. It's a cultural realism. Every manufacturer makes a few great products and allot of inferior products as a ruse to get money. Look at how many ford cars were sold in the sixties due to NASCAR.
 
I don't know what the big deal is....

Allot of people bought Kenwood racks and later replaced the speakers. JBL also made allot of great high-end speakers. So did Sony and Pioneer....
 
Me too...

But why are brand names so relatively important to us to the point of creating a following? Especially when there are other products of exact quality at a lower price. It's a cultural realism. Every manufacturer makes a few great products and allot of inferior products as a ruse to get money. Look at how many ford cars were sold in the sixties due to NASCAR.
My take is that brands become well-known based on customer experience and quality. It doesn't hurt if they get popular exposure and celebrity endorsement, but it used to be the quality came before the recognition. Take Izod shirts. My old ones say Chemise Lacoste on the label, the name of the founder of the famous polo-shirt manufacturer. Lacoste was a French tennis player know as "the crocodile" by his fans, hence famous shirt's logo. I have Lacoste shirts that are over forty-years old still in usable shape. I also have Levi 501s my mother wore when she was a young woman hunting with her father. I have Brooks Brothers shirts with my dad's monogram on them my wife and kids have been using as smocks for 30-years and they never knew my father. Most of these iconic brands branched out to offshore manufacturing and quality dropped. Now they rely on brand-name recognition to perpetuate their reputation. Notice how large the crocodile logo has gotten on Lacoste products and how huge the Polo logo has gotten as the quality has plummeted.

Levis is one of the few, in my opinion, that has maintained quality control. Most of my 501s are made in Egypt now, for whatever reason. Some are assembled in Mexico, and other places, from "U.S. made parts". I still have an unused pair from the '70s, shrink-to-fit style with paper labels still on them left from when they were discontinued and I hoarded several pair. The XXX denim is thicker but that was before pre-wash. The button fly lays flatter than the newer ones and the button holes don't need as much breaking-in as those manufactured overseas. But, in general, they feel and fit the same and wear nearly as well. And the "leather" label on the back and the rivets haven't just gotten larger like other brands. They still mean the same thing.

My vote is for Crown amps as the Levis of the audio business. I've used the same amps for decades and the newer off-shore models still garner high praise from those who should know.

:dunno:
 
My take is that brands become well-known based on customer experience and quality. It doesn't hurt if they get popular exposure and celebrity endorsement, but it used to be the quality came before the recognition. Take Izod shirts. My old ones say Chemise Lacoste on the label, the name of the founder of the famous polo-shirt manufacturer. Lacoste was a French tennis player know as "the crocodile" by his fans, hence famous shirt's logo. I have Lacoste shirts that are over forty-years old still in usable shape. I also have Levi 501s my mother wore when she was a young woman hunting with her father. I have Brooks Brothers shirts with my dad's monogram on them my wife and kids have been using as smocks for 30-years and they never knew my father. Most of these iconic brands branched out to offshore manufacturing and quality dropped. Now they rely on brand-name recognition to perpetuate their reputation. Notice how large the crocodile logo has gotten on Lacoste products and how huge the Polo logo has gotten as the quality has plummeted.

Levis is one of the few, in my opinion, that has maintained quality control. Most of my 501s are made in Egypt now, for whatever reason. Some are assembled in Mexico, and other places, from "U.S. made parts". I still have an unused pair from the '70s, shrink-to-fit style with paper labels still on them left from when they were discontinued and I hoarded several pair. The XXX denim is thicker but that was before pre-wash. The button fly lays flatter than the newer ones and the button holes don't need as much breaking-in as those manufactured overseas. But, in general, they feel and fit the same and wear nearly as well. And the "leather" label on the back and the rivets haven't just gotten larger like other brands. They still mean the same thing.

My vote is for Crown amps as the Levis of the audio business. I've used the same amps for decades and the newer off-shore models still garner high praise from those who should know.

:dunno:

Yah... I agree with you on all the above, it's hard to find good quality these days.
 
I don't disagree with you. But I do find it funny that someone has implemented just such technology and even received a patent for it:

The technology in the device you linked to was developed by Philips back in the 1990s. The patent is for using it as speaker demonstration system that "simulates the output of the selected demonstration speaker." You could use a modern LMS to do something similar by creating a series of presets.

One problem with this approach is that no one system can accurately re-create the on and off axis response, nor the dispersion pattern, of systems with different drivers. Another would be re-creating the transient response of high efficiency systems.

In general we agree on the fundamentals, it's the difference between compression vs. conventional systems where we seem to differ. I'm not arguing that one is superior to the other, but that they are different, and that certain types of older recordings will benefit from the use of one over the other based on the monitoring system used during its creation.

Since this discussion is no longer about JBL, but compression drivers, conventional cone/domes, and their impact on the monitoring and playback process, it may be better in its own thread.

I hope everyone had a wonderful holiday weekend, and took a few moments to think about those who have sacrificed so much for our country and freedoms.
 
I don't disagree with you. But I do find it funny that someone has implemented just such technology and even received a patent for it:

Click the blue text-link for more info. Got
to wonder what they use for "reference" speakers?!
I'm trying to imagine how it goes from a QUAD 57 to a K-horn to my Fuseliers and not getting there.
Also, Can it simulate a speaker with ringing tweeters, crappy impulse response, and/ or sloppy bass as the worst examples?
 
You ask why some people pay so much for vintage loudspeakers. I fall into that category and can answer that question with one simple word - NOSTALGIA.
 
Having never heard any JBL offerings before, I was pleasantly surprised by a pair of LX44 that I refurbed recently. I actually almost kept them but just didn't have the space. Nice speakers, the older ones must be great :-)
 
Having never heard any JBL offerings before, I was pleasantly surprised by a pair of LX44 that I refurbed recently. I actually almost kept them but just didn't have the space. Nice speakers, the older ones must be great :)
Even some of the newer ones! The LX-series were okay at their price point. I have a pair of LX22 that were badged by the factory as "LX-55" for some reason. They sound fine. But you really should try to audition some of their contemporaries like the Ti series or XPLs. You won't be giving those away!
 
Despite what many say, modern speakers are better in just about every way. Although there aren't any radical new designs/types (Radialstrahlers excepted) there have been advances in materials and design.

Theil/Small calculations have reduced a lot of the art of speaker design to straight mathematics. That along with CAD and other inexpensive tools have made a tremendous difference in the design process. In todays world any "jackleg" designer has access to the same tools the pro's use.

Calling speakers vintage doesn't change that they are old and used. What new speakers aren't, is as inexpensive as old and used. Plus they're new! Even so, there are some true bargains in new speakers. The Elac line, Pioneer BS21/22 series and KEF LS50's are prime examples. And then, there's the Magnepan 30.7 which at $30K is considered to be a bargain in the high end.

My Acoustats are from the 80's. That makes them 30+. May I consider them vintage?:rolleyes:

I guess I'm a little different. I have no attachment to a bunch of gear I didn't want when it was new. I don't care when or where "whatever" was made. All that matters to me is, does it improve the sound and can I afford it.
 
I just picked up some L100T for 100$. Heck even at a grand I would have a serious hard time finding something as good but especially that holds its after sale value.. garanteed.
As for old components. Wadda ya know they are well "burnt in".. lol. Sure, age of the tweeters actually really never get old, and well actually just a few caps in tje xover changed and bam you are in like new territory. I have been to many a shop and everything is super expensive. Like why so expensive and sound often is meh to what the.. " and I have a heck of a bunch of friends who think so too. I will stick to finding bargains while I listen to a buddy's pair of shl5+ which just don't do it for me but especially considering how much they cost.
I also just like playing around and trying tons of "new" vintage stuff. Lsr32 for ex: were pretty boring.
Don't get me wrong. Advancements is a thing for sure but well old jbl is pretty darn good enough for me.. 4698b, 4412, L300(diy) , L96 and now L100T.
 
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The patent ran out on Oscar Heil's AMT tweeters. Since then everyone and their brother has come up with their own copy of the AMT. They are worlds better sounding than most dome tweeters and apparently a lot less expensive to make.

Even though they are mis-labeled Ribbon and Folded Ribbon they are neither. They're just clones of the AMT. IMO/E the "Folded Ribbon" tweeter raised the bar for a whole slew of speakers. It's now possible for modest speakers to have clear clean extended treble without any of the nasties (ringing, harshness) some domes (especially metal) seem to produce.
 
Yeh I once heard some Decca kelly ribbons on single source piano and the harmonics were so natural it was scary. I also had ESS stuff and really liked the top but the bass was useless.. forget the model though but edit: model amt 1a looks like it.
 
I have had;
L77
L99
L65
L45
L100
L55
L19
and L29's
I have sold every pair. I didn't care for them. Sometimes I wonder however, if it was the not caring for them, or the payoff I knew was coming when I sold them, that caused me to let them go. :scratch2:
I owned L100s, the full HT1THX system, a pair of L19s, and some others with mostly titanium tweeters, can't remember off the top of my head... I sold them all, never liked their sound at all.
 
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