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Just bought a 1961 Thorens TD-124

Doing some poking around on the 'net, I found this interesting post:
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/anal...oving-thorens-td-124-mkii-38.html#post2611974

re: looking at the strobe.
My comments with regard to my obsessive strobe watching over the past few years with #2729 and the others I've had the pleasure to work on.

With regard to #2729, it has had all of the service maintenance as detailed here and also described at my website for the three TD124 refurb projects that I have detailed there:
TD124 Dept

It's late June, 2011 in the Pacific Northwest part of the United States. (I think it was 2007 when I refurbished 2729. ) Ambient temperatures in the room are around 68 deg F at the coolest and up to around 74-76 during the day.

I tend to play records on my TD124 nearly every day for at least a short period of time. But I turn the motor on when I get home from work and allow it time to warm up and get speed stable. I won't turn it off until I'm sure I'm done listening for the day.

Usually on a cold start I have a slightly slow strobe but still playable speed within a minute after switch on. I've seen it get speed stable after a few revs on a cold start. Other days it takes longer. This summer, when it gets hotter, the unit will get up to speed quicker.

Typically, when I've been playing the TD124 for long periods each day for several days in a row, I see the best cold start-up times. The deck displays its best speed pitch stability. And strobe tends to give the impression of being "locked" into 33-1/3rd rpms by an apparently un-moving strobe display.

However, if it has been several days since I've played the deck, it will be slow to come up to speed, takes more than a few seconds to get up to a playable speed, but still less than a minute. During the day, the strobe may indicate some speed drift. Drift in either direction, going slightly fast or slow. but always correctable by a very slight adjustment to the pitch control knob.

Other days, there is no speed drift. I blame it on the shaded pole motor. The E-50. In any case, as beautiful as they are, these machines are dinosaurs.

Maybe after living with an SL-1200 my expectations regarding pitch stability are too high?
 
I also find myself adjusting with each session, per the pig's experience. Not sure where your expectations are, but I find a few seconds worth of adjustment after the machine's warmed up are not an inconvenience.
 
I also find myself adjusting with each session, per the pig's experience. Not sure where your expectations are, but I find a few seconds worth of adjustment after the machine's warmed up are not an inconvenience.

No, not at all an inconvenience, and I'm glad to learn that it is normal operating procedure. But it seems that having to keep readjusting it during the session is not normal... I'll get to the bottom of this yet.

Regarding the motor, it should be pretty easy to figure out if it has been thoroughly serviced already, I just need to check if the rivets are intact or not. Will do later this evening,
 
Clean all surfaces the belt runs on with alcohol. Clean the areas for the drive wheel as well. Probably couldn't hurt.
 
Clean all surfaces the belt runs on with alcohol. Clean the areas for the drive wheel as well. Probably couldn't hurt.

Good advice, I will do that!

I had my first extended listening session with the Thorens this evening, and the speed stabilized pretty well after an hour or so. Sure, every once in a while I had adjust the pitch just a touch, but it was pretty stable overall.
 
Please don't use alcohol on rubber idler wheel or belts. It dries out the rubber.
I'm also curious of your impression of your KAB sl1200 vs. your td124. Should be interesting.
 
Please don't use alcohol on rubber idler wheel or belts. It dries out the rubber.

I have some cleaning fluid specifically made for tape machine pinch rollers that I use to clean idlers.

usrecordingmedia-store_2260_6205431.jpg


I'm also curious of your impression of your KAB sl1200 vs. your td124. Should be interesting.

Me too... in about an hour I'm going to go pick up my Fisher 400 from audiodon, so I can finally hear the Thorens through a set of speakers. It's been sounding terrific through the headphones though, very quiet.

My beloved Grado 8MR with MCZ stylus has proven to be a great match for the SME 3009 SII Improved. The arm balances with the main counterweight very close to the pivot, which I believe is optimal. The clarity and tracking is superb, and I was relieved to find that there is no Grado hum on the TD-124 MK1, possibly due to the cast iron platter acting as an electrical shield.
 
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I've enjoyed your posts on your Thorens. Did Audiodon rebuild your Fisher? I love my 500C, one of the most enjoyable audio purchases that I've made in the last 40 years.
 
I've enjoyed your posts on your Thorens. Did Audiodon rebuild your Fisher? I love my 500C, one of the most enjoyable audio purchases that I've made in the last 40 years.

Thanks! Regarding the Fisher, the previous owner had it restored by Mike Urban in Connecticut, but that was just basic maintenance. Don added same mods to the power supply to put less stress on the tubes and refined the phono stage. He also replaced some of the ailing tubes with better matched sets and generally spruced it all up. It sounds pretty freakin' amazing now.

The Thorens is also singing beautifully, now that I can fully evaluate it. The Grado on the SME tracks beautifully, and the soundstage is huge and precise. Rumble is not an issue, and after running for a while, the speed drift that I was concerned about is largely a non-issue. I am VERY happy with this set-up! :banana::banana:
 
Thanks! Regarding the Fisher, the previous owner had it restored by Mike Urban in Connecticut, but that was just basic maintenance. Don added same mods to the power supply to put less stress on the tubes and refined the phono stage. He also replaced some of the ailing tubes with better matched sets and generally spruced it all up. It sounds pretty freakin' amazing now.

The Thorens is also singing beautifully, now that I can fully evaluate it. The Grado on the SME tracks beautifully, and the soundstage is huge and precise. Rumble is not an issue, and after running for a while, the speed drift that I was concerned about is largely a non-issue. I am VERY happy with this set-up! :banana::banana:

Excellent! I was never quite satisfied with the phono section in my 500C so I'm using a Pro-ject Tube Box SE II with a pair of 1957 RCA black plates and I'm very happy with it. Love to see some pictures of the Fisher and Thorens when you have time.
 
Looking Good. :thmbsp:

Sounding even better! :yes:

I've been listening to it for the past three hours and I'm completely delighted by how good this rig sounds. At first the Thorens sounded a bit soft in the bass to me, so I added a 16 oz. platter weight and that helped enormously. Everything is dialed in to perfection.

As an aside, I previously mentioned that the Grado was not humming... now that I am listening through fairly high res speakers, I can hear that it does hum on this table. It's not very loud and I can't hear it behind the music, but it is there. So far, it is not a dealbreaker, although I may try a few other carts and see what I think.

Later on I'll probably swap in an early (flat profile) Stanton 681EE with a JICO Shibata and see how I like that. I also have a 78 stylus and D6807A light tracking conical stylus for the 681 on hand, which would come in handy for 78s and mono duty, but I'm not sure that a 681 can match the Grado's performance.
 
Interesting observations. I agree that multiple midsession adjustments are neither normal nor fun. Not sure what they could be from but definitely check the motor. If it hasn't been rebuilt and you don't feel like doing so at the moment, you can still oil both bearings. Mine didn't have an oil port so I drilled one while the motor was apart. Is it unidirectional, or random? Ie slowing down during the sessions, speeding up, or both?

I find it funny that you thought the deck was bass shy. Just goes to show that perspective counts for so much with audio. My main deck was an LP12 prior to the 124, and I was blown away by how much bass it was producing.
 
There's always tube rolling in the Fisher to change up the sound once in a while too. I have RCA black plates, Telefunken smooth plates, Bugle Boys, and Mullards that I roll in my 500C to change things up just for fun. Great set up you have, you should be set for life now.
 
Interesting observations. I agree that multiple midsession adjustments are neither normal nor fun. Not sure what they could be from but definitely check the motor.

During a listening listening session lasting a few hours last night, the speed pitch completely stabilized. :banana:

I also swapped out the humming Grado for a very early, low s/n circa1968 Stanton 681EE with a JICO Shibata. The Stanton does some things better than the Grado and vice versa, but I just couldn't live with the hum. Pity, because I really love that Grado.

With the Stanton, I have on hand special styli for playing 78s (D6827) and for my mono LPs and 45s (D6807A), so there's a benefit.
 
This is my idea of hifi heaven:

Very nice combo of some of the best vintage out there. I've had vintage pieces in the past and it always left me wanting. So this time I'm in the process of assembled an entire premium vintage system like you have done to see if it will satisfy. I'm waiting for my amp to come back from repair and I'm refinishing the speaker cabinets today, though I need to recap and rewire them. Though not to your caliber, it is remarkably similar in concept, so I hope this one will be a good one to satisfy. It consists of a '69 Dual 1019 idler driver tt, '66 McIntosh MA5100 solid state integrated amp, '76 Altec Lansing Model 1 loudspeakers acoustic suspension loudspeaker, remarkably similar in design and size as the AR 4x.
 
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Very nice combo of some of the best vintage out there. I've had vintage pieces in the past and it always left me wanting. So this time I'm in the process of assembled an entire premium vintage system like you have done to see if it will satisfy. I'm waiting for my amp to come back from repair and I'm refinishing the speaker cabinets today, though I need to recap and rewire them. Though not to your caliber, it is remarkably similar in concept, so I hope this one will be a good one to satisfy. It consists of a '69 Dual 1219 idler driver tt, '66 McIntosh MA5100 solid state integrated amp, '76 Altec Lansing Model 1 loudspeakers acoustic suspension loudspeaker, remarkably similar in design and size as the AR 4x.

Very nice!

Usually, when it comes to assembling a vintage hifi rig, often the goal has to be something other than striving for the ultimate in fine resolution, because you won't find it in stuff from the early '60s, unless we're talking megabuck McIntosh monoblocks and the like.
 
Very nice!

Usually, when it comes to assembling a vintage hifi rig, often the goal has to be something other than striving for the ultimate in fine resolution, because you won't find it in stuff from the early '60s, unless we're talking megabuck McIntosh monoblocks and the like.

This is true and I need to remind myself of that.
The Mac MA5100 is better than any vintage receiver I've had. Also I corrected a typo on previous post. The Dual is the famous 1019 (not 1219), and I'll be using it w/ Shure M91ED. The speakers weak link is their tweeter otherwise it is really involving.
I talked to my wife and we will be using it as a bookself system on a shelve system that flanks a fireplace, so it will be more of a fun system on display and to play occasional vinyl. Maybe it will satisfy.
 
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