cfinchrist
God bless America.
I have the Marantz, and am considering the HK. Financially I would be forced to sell the Marantz to get the HK, so I'm looking for opinions, comparisons, and descriptions which could aid in my decision.
Marantz 2245 or Harman Kardon 730
- Thread starter cfinchrist
- Start date
Register to hide this ad
dspear99ca
Super Member
They are very different. The Marantz 22xx sound is warm & mellow & has been compared to tubes. The H/K sound has not a hint of warmth. It's very neutral, very detailed. Depends what speakers you're driving and, to a large extent, on personal preference.
cfinchrist
God bless America.
Interesting, some of what I've read from other people's writings go on and on about the"warm" sound of the HK.
As far as the speakers go, initially I will be driving 4 KLH Model 23's. If I got the HK and liked it however, then I could move it into the living room to drive ADS L-810's and move my Sansui G-7000 out to drive the KLH 23's in the garage. Decisions decisions.
Last edited:
dspear99ca
Super Member
The 430/730/930 is the warmest of the H/K line, before or after, but nowhere near as warm as the Marantz 22xx series. I have owned a 730 and liked it, but due to a severe attack of up-grade-itis I ditched it in favor of something a tad closer (or so I thought) to audio nirvana. Randomly I have a Marantz 2250 currently set up in my livingroom. The 730 is a nice receiver. Balanced. The power amp section is superb, the pre is okay but not great. If you REALLY want a great sound try mating the preamp section of a Marantz 1060 with the power amp section in the 730. Ahh, if only money were no object...
GuyNoir
Hallowed State
My HK 730 seems to love my L810s. It is very detailed, and reaches deep down where my other two HK's don't. I listen to a bit of the ambient genre, where there is bass down to practically sub-audibile. I hear things with the 730 that I don't hear in either my HK495i or AVR 25 MkII. I would say it outclasses both by several orders of magnitude.
Wow, tough decision. They are both excellent receivers of roughly the same power. The HK has the twin amp design which I like plus it has the extra phono input (which may or may not matter to you). The tuner is about on a par with the 2245 - not great but not bad. The phono section might be a little better in the HK 730.
The Marantz has a much better build quality, better preamp section and (IMO) a warmer overall tone quality than the HK. Plus there's the convenience of being able to plug an i-pod / portable device into the front dubbing input jack and a recorder into the front dubbing output jack.
I should mention that I owned the HK 730 and 430 twin as well as the Marantz 2230, a couple of 2270s and even a big 2330B all around the same time as my 2245. I decided to keep the 2245 and sold off all of the others. The 2245 really seems to get everything right IMO, and I think it's one of Marantz's best and most balanced receivers.
Soooo, I guess I'd stick with the 2245 and maybe pick up an HK 730 Twin down the road when an affordable one shows up. Inexpensive ones show up on craigslist (around here, anyway) fairly often because they sold tons of them through chain stores like Tech Hi-Fi in the late 70's. They were quite popular back then because they were inexpensive and pretty decent performers, and it was common to find a "package deal" with a turntable, speakers and an HK twin for a reasonable price. Personally I really like the HK 730 Twin but I think the 2245 is a notch or two above it.
The Marantz has a much better build quality, better preamp section and (IMO) a warmer overall tone quality than the HK. Plus there's the convenience of being able to plug an i-pod / portable device into the front dubbing input jack and a recorder into the front dubbing output jack.
I should mention that I owned the HK 730 and 430 twin as well as the Marantz 2230, a couple of 2270s and even a big 2330B all around the same time as my 2245. I decided to keep the 2245 and sold off all of the others. The 2245 really seems to get everything right IMO, and I think it's one of Marantz's best and most balanced receivers.
Soooo, I guess I'd stick with the 2245 and maybe pick up an HK 730 Twin down the road when an affordable one shows up. Inexpensive ones show up on craigslist (around here, anyway) fairly often because they sold tons of them through chain stores like Tech Hi-Fi in the late 70's. They were quite popular back then because they were inexpensive and pretty decent performers, and it was common to find a "package deal" with a turntable, speakers and an HK twin for a reasonable price. Personally I really like the HK 730 Twin but I think the 2245 is a notch or two above it.
Listening to a 2245 right now. But, also looking at it. I just think old Saul got the esthetics of appearance perfect. I know this is personal and many out there do not like the Marantz look, but I grew up with this being the top of the line in town and so it stuck with me. The tuner on this model is really superb... pulls in stuff others don't. All with a twenty foot long speaker wire serving as the FM antenna.
cfinchrist
God bless America.
Thanks for the input everyone. That gives me more to think about. Perhaps patience and penny saving (not two of my strengths) are in order.
hatrack71
distracted by everything
Dude, I feel completely different about the 730 but I primarily use horn speakers. By far the most liquid and warm receiver in that price/power range I have EVER heard. Better than the 2252, 881, 551, AU-5900, AU-7900, 2230, SX-750, and basically anything else SS I owned in that price/power range and vintage. The H/K literally redefines what stereo separation is. It gives a very similar soundstage to my best tube stuff with almost no graininess. IMHO. Horns are very revealing due to their high sensitivity. This is just MY experience with the 730. It is an amazing little piece! It has actually been on par w/ some $1000+ tube rigs in my collection. I had a 730 for about a month and gave it to a friend who really needed a good little receiver. It is his daily driver and sounds so sweet through his Large Advents. I believe the 730 to be the best value, along with the 430 in audio today!!!!!! I'm not kidding. I can't think of an easier way $$ to get the same sound with TOTL loudspeakers. I totally disagree that the build quality on the Marantz and other units is better. Just because it has a pretty face doesn't mean it has a real dual mono power supply. I mean c'mon!
Last edited:
oldenuff
Active Member
The H/K sound has not a hint of warmth. [/QUOTE ????...I would either have that H/K checked out, or my ears...
tubeboob
Super Member
Without doubt, the H/K 330, 430, 730, 930 series of audio receivers are the closest I have heard a solid state piece emulate the sound of tubes. They are simply superb!
I find the Marantz Receivers slightly less tube sounding, and more solid state in their sound reproduction.
Your choice will be a matter of taste, as I could live happily with either, but if I had to choose, I would go the H/K way with it's dual power supply and primo warm tube sound. And I love the vintage look of the H/K a little more as well.
Can't lose either way!!
Cheers
I find the Marantz Receivers slightly less tube sounding, and more solid state in their sound reproduction.
Your choice will be a matter of taste, as I could live happily with either, but if I had to choose, I would go the H/K way with it's dual power supply and primo warm tube sound. And I love the vintage look of the H/K a little more as well.
Can't lose either way!!
Cheers
hatrack71
distracted by everything
The H/K sound has not a hint of warmth. [/QUOTE ????...I would either have that H/K checked out, or my ears...
That is the other thing I was going to suggest. To have the unit put back to spec. There has to something wrong with that 730. I mean the 730 is night and day difference to most SS in that time. A definite step up. I think audiophools get caught up and distracted by pretty blue lights and shiny silver faces. I know I do but that is collecting for a different reason. The 730 is a real daily performer. Just look at the power supply as compared to the competitors of the day. If you put a blind over both of them in a listening test, I predict the 730 will win every time. :yes:730 owners know what I mean- EASE, accuracy, plenty of warmth without exaggeration.:yes:
Oh and please take no offense, this is only my opinion.
Last edited:
cfinchrist
God bless America.
Now to throw a wrench in things, I also have a Sansui 6060 and I have not yet been able to do any direct comparisons with the Marantz 2245, but I suspect the results will vary depending on which speakers I use. So many 40 ish watt per channel beauties to choose from, but I think as soon as I am able I will pick up a HK 730 and then do a shoot out.
I am not referring to the looks, and the aesthetics have nothing to do with the build quality at all IMO. I am referring to the unit on a component level based on my experience of working on them.
The dual transformer power supply and separate amps are nice, but the quality of the switches and components used in the HK are not of the same quality as the Marantz units. The jack strip on the back of the HK is very flimsy, for example, and easily broken. The contacts used in the buttons and switches in the HK are also notorious for corroding very quickly and needing repeated cleaning out at short intervals to remain functional. I like the HK receivers, but the build quality does not compare to the Marantz units based on what I have experienced.
There is also something to be said for the amp circuit layout of the Marantz - I like the output / speaker protection / start-up delay circuit with the relay much more than the direct coupled output with an inline fuse - never liked that THUMP and woofer pump on start up with the HK, and I don't know how long the fuses in an HK would take to stop the flow of current if an output fault allowed DC to pass to the speakers. Again that's an added expense and a build quality issue in my book, all aesthetics aside.
GuyNoir
Hallowed State
cfinchrist
God bless America.
2245 and 730...head to head
Thanks to a great local tech I was able to borrow an HK 730 to compare with my Marantz 2245. I could keep the one I wanted and he gets the other. I realize the Marantz is more valuable dollar wise, but I figured if the HK sounded better than it was worth more to me. I tried them both first with one CD player and set of speakers, then with the same cd player and a different set of speakers. After that I tried a different cd player with both of them. The speakers were Infinity & Philips Laboratories. The CD Players were a Sony and a Denon.
The results? I'm not telling. Just kidding. In this listening space (the garage) and with the equipment used I was very surprised to find that the Marantz was a lot better sounding to me. It was more tonally accurate. It was far less fatiguing to listen to, and sounded like I know the music sounds. It was so much better in almost every way that I couldn't believe it. I began to assume the 730 was a bad unit or something, but it had just been gone through by the tech.
I made my decision to keep the 2245 and unhooked the HK. Later that day it kept nagging at me so I did a comparison between the HK 730 and my Sansui G 7000 using my ADS L 810's. In this setting with this associated equipment, the HK made a much more respectable showing. It sounded good and did many things very well, it even challenged the much more powerful Sansui G.
I had to listen quite a while in order to decide definitively that the G 7000 was better (at least with this combination of components). The cd player used here was the Onkyo Integra DX 5500.
I'll be returning the Harman Kardon as it just didn't quite make my rotation. I can tell it is a nice unit, and with the right components can be very satisfying. Anyway these are just some observations from a fun comparison.:thmbsp:
Thanks to a great local tech I was able to borrow an HK 730 to compare with my Marantz 2245. I could keep the one I wanted and he gets the other. I realize the Marantz is more valuable dollar wise, but I figured if the HK sounded better than it was worth more to me. I tried them both first with one CD player and set of speakers, then with the same cd player and a different set of speakers. After that I tried a different cd player with both of them. The speakers were Infinity & Philips Laboratories. The CD Players were a Sony and a Denon.
The results? I'm not telling. Just kidding. In this listening space (the garage) and with the equipment used I was very surprised to find that the Marantz was a lot better sounding to me. It was more tonally accurate. It was far less fatiguing to listen to, and sounded like I know the music sounds. It was so much better in almost every way that I couldn't believe it. I began to assume the 730 was a bad unit or something, but it had just been gone through by the tech.
I made my decision to keep the 2245 and unhooked the HK. Later that day it kept nagging at me so I did a comparison between the HK 730 and my Sansui G 7000 using my ADS L 810's. In this setting with this associated equipment, the HK made a much more respectable showing. It sounded good and did many things very well, it even challenged the much more powerful Sansui G.
I had to listen quite a while in order to decide definitively that the G 7000 was better (at least with this combination of components). The cd player used here was the Onkyo Integra DX 5500.
I'll be returning the Harman Kardon as it just didn't quite make my rotation. I can tell it is a nice unit, and with the right components can be very satisfying. Anyway these are just some observations from a fun comparison.:thmbsp:
Last edited:
Cool - glad you were able to compare them before committing to one or the other. I was surprised by the sound of the 2245 too, really a fine sounding and well balanced receiver.
I'm still a big fan of the HK Twin Powered series, but after comparing them myself I came to the same conclusion and kept my 2245.
I'm still a big fan of the HK Twin Powered series, but after comparing them myself I came to the same conclusion and kept my 2245.
mcp1
Well-Known Member
HK 730 VS Marantz 2245...
I've been using an HK 730 twin power for more than 3 months now. I found a mint condition example on the auction site by sheer dumb luck. I recently picked up a Marantz 2250B at a garage speaker sale and did an A/B test with the Dual 1219 with Shure V15 type III and Shure M91ED both original stylii. I don't make comparisons of my vintage SS with CD players or DACs, just vinyl, ATKINS/KNOPFLER Neck & Neck. Previous to the HK 730, I was using a Marantz 2245 for at least 15 years along with an HK 630 twin power. My comparison is based on my opinion that the Marantz 2250B edges out the 2245 in sound and power when going up against the HK 730, so this isn't an apples to oranges comparison considering the Marantz' 100 Watt total vs HK 730s 80 Watt total.
The Marantz 2250B really punched through the lows and held midrange nicely. Very neutral and honest sound.
Long story short; The Marantz 2250B had the power, it had the buttons, the faceplate and the blue glow.
However, most obvious to me it lacked dynamics in the output stage with much less stereo separation than showed up instantly in the A/B comparison with the HK 730. The Marantz 2250B FM section didn't impress compared to any decent NAD/PROTON or Sony FM standalone tuner. The HK 730 tuner is just adequate, not that bad. HK 730 Phono stage vs Marantz 2250B was a close call, both were very good, the Marantz edging slightly over the HK 730 in gain, but it could just be the 10 Watt power difference I was hearing. Having twin PHONO and AUX inputs is a plus on the HK 730.
Overall, I decided to let the Marantz 2250B go, its FM section was flakey on the one I had, the deciding factor between the two came down to the overall edge the HK 730 showed in pure stereo separation and sound detailing. I found the detailed tone controls on the Marantz to be overdone, the HK 730 was perfect in the flat positions. The Marantz 2250B sounded a few shades muddier, lacked separation and less treble detail. My Snell Ks are pretty bright compared to my Dynacos, so I feel my assessment is fairly accurate.
I really think it comes down to taste, in the final analysis. I find the HK 730 somewhat more appealing than the massiveness of the Marantz. As far as build quality goes, I think I have to agree with others here that the Marantz is hard to beat, but the HK 730 is no sloucher in its simplicity and elegance inside and out. This is all very subjective stuff, but I hope I've helped to thoroughly confuse this issue.
I've been using an HK 730 twin power for more than 3 months now. I found a mint condition example on the auction site by sheer dumb luck. I recently picked up a Marantz 2250B at a garage speaker sale and did an A/B test with the Dual 1219 with Shure V15 type III and Shure M91ED both original stylii. I don't make comparisons of my vintage SS with CD players or DACs, just vinyl, ATKINS/KNOPFLER Neck & Neck. Previous to the HK 730, I was using a Marantz 2245 for at least 15 years along with an HK 630 twin power. My comparison is based on my opinion that the Marantz 2250B edges out the 2245 in sound and power when going up against the HK 730, so this isn't an apples to oranges comparison considering the Marantz' 100 Watt total vs HK 730s 80 Watt total.
The Marantz 2250B really punched through the lows and held midrange nicely. Very neutral and honest sound.
Long story short; The Marantz 2250B had the power, it had the buttons, the faceplate and the blue glow.
However, most obvious to me it lacked dynamics in the output stage with much less stereo separation than showed up instantly in the A/B comparison with the HK 730. The Marantz 2250B FM section didn't impress compared to any decent NAD/PROTON or Sony FM standalone tuner. The HK 730 tuner is just adequate, not that bad. HK 730 Phono stage vs Marantz 2250B was a close call, both were very good, the Marantz edging slightly over the HK 730 in gain, but it could just be the 10 Watt power difference I was hearing. Having twin PHONO and AUX inputs is a plus on the HK 730.
Overall, I decided to let the Marantz 2250B go, its FM section was flakey on the one I had, the deciding factor between the two came down to the overall edge the HK 730 showed in pure stereo separation and sound detailing. I found the detailed tone controls on the Marantz to be overdone, the HK 730 was perfect in the flat positions. The Marantz 2250B sounded a few shades muddier, lacked separation and less treble detail. My Snell Ks are pretty bright compared to my Dynacos, so I feel my assessment is fairly accurate.
I really think it comes down to taste, in the final analysis. I find the HK 730 somewhat more appealing than the massiveness of the Marantz. As far as build quality goes, I think I have to agree with others here that the Marantz is hard to beat, but the HK 730 is no sloucher in its simplicity and elegance inside and out. This is all very subjective stuff, but I hope I've helped to thoroughly confuse this issue.
