Old VS. New

[dnewma04]

My plan for my system is to start with a UTurn Orbit Plus turntable. After that I'm pretty open. I'll be in a dorm room for the next year, maybe two, so I'll need something that fits there. I mainly listen to rock, but I also want something with bass power for electronic or rap. I'd like it to be pretty versatile so I could listen to whatever and it'll sound good, though. As far as budget, the cheaper the better as I just started saving for it, but I'd be willing to spend up to $1000 for the first wave and in the future I would probably upgrade (especially speakers).

Big speakers are out, larger bookshelves may suffice but we'd need to know more about the dorm room. How big of speakers do you think you can get away with? If you want deep bass and small speakers, you'll need loads of power or at the very least, a subwoofer to supplement the small speakers if you need efficiency.

You should be able to find a nice USB DAC for 100.00 or so. You could do something like "Indignia" speakers if you are up for building something on your own.

Then invest in something like a 5-6 year old Arcam/Roksan/NAD type integrated with a built in phono for 250.00 and you'll be under budget with a nice system.

 

[Andyman]

Most vintage tables with a properly installed cartridge and balanced tonearm will treat those LPs fine; they may even be better than what Grandma played them on. Lots of guys use them here.

Find yourself a nice Technics, Pioneer, or other Japanese table and it will be a great start. The Orbit looks to be a fine table, but dorm rooms can be war zones; just one roomie's buddy getting to wound up can do a lot of unintentional damage. Get something solid, but disposable. Heck, do it right and maybe you can sell it for a profit when you move on if you wish!!

FWIW, my eldest college daughter has a Pioneer SX-424 receiver, a JVC semi auto DD turntable with an Ortofon cartridge and a set of EPI 100 speakers I just upgraded her to from some mundane ElectroVoice 7Bs and it's served her fine. The only thing I've asked her to keep when she moves on was the EPIs, as they are fine speakers. The rest she can flip for whatever she gets; it'll probably be more than I paid for it..:yes:

 

[RUNN1NG EMOT]

Big speakers are out, larger bookshelves may suffice but we'd need to know more about the dorm room. How big of speakers do you think you can get away with? If you want deep bass and small speakers, you'll need loads of power or at the very least, a subwoofer to supplement the small speakers if you need efficiency.

You should be able to find a nice USB DAC for 100.00 or so. You could do something like "Indignia" speakers if you are up for building something on your own.

Then invest in something like a 5-6 year old Arcam/Roksan/NAD type integrated with a built in phono for 250.00 and you'll be under budget with a nice system.

I got a suite, so I've got quite a bit of space and if I let my roommate play his music I'm sure we could make plenty of space. The room will also be pretty much perfectly square. I think I could probably put some big speakers in if I was clever enough with arranging furniture. I also think (if I could afford it) I could make space for a sub.

 

[RUNN1NG EMOT]

Find yourself a nice Technics, Pioneer, or other Japanese table and it will be a great start. The Orbit looks to be a fine table, but dorm rooms can be war zones; just one roomie's buddy getting to wound up can do a lot of unintentional damage. Get something solid, but disposable. Heck, do it right and maybe you can sell it for a profit when you move on if you wish!!

I know Technics makes new $100 turntables, is that going to be cheaply made? I'm guessing it would be better to get a table that's $100 now that was originally more.

Most importantly, where would you shop? Ebay & Craigslist? or do I go to a store that sells used equipment. I figure once I find equipment I can check back with you guys to see what you think.

 

[matteos]

There's plenty of modern stuff, especially mass market stuff like the AVRs that break a few days outside of warranty, I see endless broken HK AVRs for sale on craigslist. OTOH the stuff I have from the 80s works great. Also if stuff goes wrong with older equipment it can be easier to troubleshoot and fix if you aren't afraid of a soldering iron... New stuff... A lot more complicated, a lot of modern gear is disposable... It's a crapshoot... A bit like cars, you may get something that is just champion or you may end up with a lemon. The more complicated something is, the more there is for it to go wrong.

You'll get the potentially best deals on craigslist by far if you have patience, are willing to drive and are willing to inspect something thoroughly - walk away if it's bad.

 

[bd1886]

I enjoy vintage the most for the reasons that this site is mostly about but in no uncertain terms if I was to just have one "music dedicated" system it would be modern.

Because of my interests being with vintage.....my time has been spent with it mostly but when I "peek in" to quality 2ch (2.1 in reality), ridiculous to say huge strides haven't been made.
Still...if the "vintage like" is there, no lack of choices that truly perform by any standard. (Just have to appreciate it's sound, the save, having something that's inventory is starting to get spread thin globally....and it kicks butt compared to "mainstream" HT for 2ch.)

If I was young,highly mobile, preferred the modern quality of sonics to the point of exclusion,never had the space to use both.....a tight modern setup would be the only show in town.
(Both is where I'm at and wouldn't want to be without either "take".)

 

[Omegaman]

What you want is a modern daily listener system for leaving on all day and/or night.
A WAF system she can use in the living room
A Hi-end system for devoted listening time in the den
A vintage system for appreciation of audio engineering gone by
A vintage old radio to show off

An awesome gun collection - ok well optional

 

[Andyman]

I just checked CL and didn't find much as far as turntables. It looks like the renewed interest in vinyl has driven prices up to where a mundane Japanese turntable in decent condition is $100.

 

[scott1019]

I own gear from the late 70's (for admittedly aesthetic nostalgic appeal) all the way to brand new Class D amps.

Gear from different eras did things well for its time. Like for instance, my Sony TA-E1000ESD does Dolby Pro Logic better than anything modern... My Yamaha YP-B6 turntable could not be duplicated for the price I paid with anything modern. My late 70s German FM tuners have never been duplicated. It all depends on what your interests are. In general I choose source components from the "peak" of the use of that medium or at the onset as with the case of SACD.

An amp is an amp, great ones can be found from any era... and in most cases the same can be said about pre-amps/line stages.

Speakers are an entirely different anomaly, many vintage speakers outperform modern ones in terms of pure musicality. The key is finding out what kind of presentation you are looking for. Over the years there have been many different "ideas" of what something should sound like, not necessarily better sound or what sounds best to you. The materials/quality control/tolerances are certain better and have the potential for greater performance, but will certainly come at a premium.

 

[Brett a]

There's plenty of modern stuff, especially mass market stuff like the AVRs that break a few days outside of warranty, I see endless broken HK AVRs for sale on craigslist.

Right. It is vitally important to state that no one is suggesting A/V gear. The OP (and anyone like him) is best served by looking at the strictly 2-channel market for recent quality gear. Stuff like NAD, Rotel, Cambridge Audio (not to be confused with Cambridge Soundworks), Rega, Musical Fidelity, etc.etc.

Anything that was bought/sold at a typical big box store should never be considered for simple music listening IMO. That's truly landfill stuff IMO.

 

[cwall99]

Could I still go for the U Turn? I'm really paranoid about ruining records since I've got a whole box of my grandmas records that are priceless to me. If I went vintage for a turntable, what would be something I could feel safe with.

My albums survived four years in dorms (hey, it was a small, private school, and, unless your family lived in the town, you had to live on campus), and came away fine. But then, that was near the end of vinyl's golden age so most folks, at least among my friends, knew how to handle so as to, at least, not totally screw it up.

However, I always used a fully automatic turntable (not all that popular here) because I've always been too lazy to cue things up and lift up that damn arm at the end of the record.

My guess is, in college, not all your roomies or suitemates or whatever will treat your records with the care they need. Which means even worse things for a fully manual turntable. Are you relying on a bunch of drunk freshmen to exercise proper care when cueing and dropping the needle?

I wouldn't.

So you may want to re-think the U-Turn. It's gonna be a whole lot more fragile than your vinyl will be.

 

[Andyman]

Are you relying on a bunch of drunk freshmen to exercise proper care when cueing and dropping the needle?

I wouldn't.

So you may want to re-think the U-Turn. It's gonna be a whole lot more fragile than your vinyl will be.

Hide the LPs during party time and let them use their phones and computers via a stereo mini-plug to a set of male RCAs.

That's what they'll want to hear anyways...

Get a cheap one of these with a 6' length so they'll be away from your amp when swapping it about...

 

[Ken Boyd]

Find the hottest young girl you know go stereo shopping with her, listen to what she thinks is the coolest looking thing out there. Buy that, hopefully it will attract other hot girls and then who cares about the stereo!

 

[cwall99]

Hide the LPs during party time and let them use their phones and computers via a stereo mini-plug to a set of male RCAs.

That's what they'll want to hear anyways...

Get a cheap one of these with a 6' length so they'll be away from your amp when swapping it about...

Andyman makes a great point. Definitely get one of those cables. When you're partying, no one's going to do any serious listening, and that cable will work great.

Sometimes, though, a turntable will be just interesting enough to draw a lot of unwanted attention to itself (when my oldest son went to school, I let him take my Sansui G-4700 and my Mirage bookshelf speakers with him; he had the only receiver and speakers on his corridor of about 16 rooms). People were always coming in to look at it, and his roommate absolutely loved it.

Thankfully, it came away fine. But a turntable is an entirely different beast than a rectangular box with knobs and dials on it.

Be sure to slap anyone who calls your records "vinyls".

 

[RUNN1NG EMOT]

My roommate this year listens to pretty much only rap, so he probably won't mess with it too much, but I see your point. I'm thinking that for now, a moderately low priced vintage setup may be just what I need. Are there any brands or models that I should avoid when looking at vintage turntables?

 

[guest122]

Im not a fan of bsr or garrard but even they made some ok gear. Again you will have to listen and see if you like it. I own a technics sl1500 which I love and a mcs 6710 stacker for when i dont feel like changing records after every side.

 

[cwall99]

The Technics lineup is a pretty solid one. Many of them are still available. I agree with particleman re the BSR lineup, but I believe you'll find a lot of folks here who do go for the Garrard lineup.

A sleeper in there may be Sansui and Philips. You probably won't find as many of them as you would Technics, but there were some decent Sansui and Philips tables (I still use my 1981-vintage Philips AF-829 several times a week).

 

[bluesky]

I prefer older equipment. I love vintage gear. Just sounds right.

The problem is that old equipment is very old now.

Hard to find a dependable one. And getting harder every day. Anything made in 1980 or before needs a restoration, or will need one very soon. That's a given. And that cost $$$, and it still may not be 'fixed'. We all know that story.

Age is hard to beat. Total restoration? By who? Not many folks (electronic folks) know the older equipment now. It's almost like a lost art. Finding someone who really knows what they are doing. Sad, but true.

But find a vintage amp that functions as designed, and it's pure bliss...and fun.

New...is new. So it should work...'maybe'.

It should work for at least for 2 years before it starts to malfunction. Plus if you want an 'excellent' amp, or speakers, your going to have to pay for it!! Thousands and Thousands. $3000+ for an amp, etc. I hate new stuff anyway. It's all broken-brand-new right out of the box. But I do have a 'new' 2010 NAD CD player and it functions perfect. I'm really truly amazed. Something new that is 3 years old and still works right. Amazing. Maybe I just have BAD rotten luck with anything new. Yeah, I do. It's all junk.

The problem is that the older 'vintage' equipment is REALLY getting old now. Ok, it 'IS' old. Very old. Sound quality due to age and dependability of the item is the problem. It's nice if you have a tech that lives near you within driving distance. I don't. Shipping can get very expensive. Most vintage guys know that very well.

Late 80s quality gear still functions fine. At least it does for me. So far. Many companies still made quality products from '86-'87 to '89. Even Sony really. Everything went south in '91.

Just my opinion. Hope this helps.

 

[RUNN1NG EMOT]

Okay, so I've found lots of Technics on craigslist. What components are most important? Do I want to make sure it's belt driven, or look for good a good cartridge/stylus? They have quite a few direct drive Technics for ~$100.

 

[dnewma04]

It should work for at least for 2 years before it starts to malfunction. Plus if you want an 'excellent' amp, or speakers, your going to have to pay for it!! Thousands and Thousands. $3000+ for an amp, etc. I hate new stuff anyway. It's all broken-brand-new right out of the box. But I do have a 'new' 2010 NAD CD player and it functions perfect. I'm really truly amazed. Something new that is 3 years old and still works right. Amazing. Maybe I just have BAD rotten luck with anything new. Yeah, I do. It's all junk.

There are loads of quality amps/electronics that can be had much cheaper than you suggest. I think your hatred of new has intentionally kept you from looking at a lot of fine equipment.