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Old VS. New

Brett a said:
If you're like me and are really after sound quality and don't care too much about its esthetic, then the modern used market is the place to shop. A lot of terrific gear from the past decade can be had for 30-40% of it's original cost. And it's new enough to not give any headaches for at least another ten+ years generally speaking.
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I agree with Brett A regarding the wisdom of shopping for recent used equipment of good quality. It will most likely be more trouble-free than 20+ year old gear.

How important is having access to vinyl records in your current college apartment? If the answer is that you can wait until after graduation, I'd suggest storing your collection of vintage records and saving money for a better table later on. I've always been particular about how my records are handled, and I would hate to have old records that mean something to me (like your grandma's) damaged accidentally at a party. Also turntables don't fare so well when roughly handled.

If you do want something now, I don't think the idea of a sub-$100 Technics direct drive table is a terrible idea, provided it's in good working order. My first foray into vintage audio was a 1970s-era Technics SL-1500 manual table purchased in about 2000 that is still in working order. I have less experience with their older belt drive tables, but I think they'd be fine too.
 
dnewma04 said:
There are loads of quality amps/electronics that can be had much cheaper than you suggest. I think your hatred of new has intentionally kept you from looking at a lot of fine equipment.
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I've noticed he gets on that kick every once in while, claiming every single thing new is junk and breaks in less than a year, if it wasn't broken already right out of the box. I've had good luck with any modern electronics I currently have.

Maybe he hates new equipment, and it return it just hates him back...a vicious cycle that can never be broken:D
 
I do think quality control on brand new electronic equipment is pretty disappointing. I've had decent luck with lots of new audio gear, but when we decided to make the leap from CRT to LED TV about three years ago, we had to return the first Samsung TV we got because it died after about a week. We also had to exchange two Samsung Blu-ray players before getting one that worked. Both TV and Blu-ray player have since performed perfectly now for the roughly three years that we've owned them. I also had to have the laser replaced (under warranty) in a Marantz CD player I bought new back in 2003 or 2004.

I think if the OP finds modern electronic gear that is currently working, chances are it will continue to work fine for a number of years.
 
It seems that you're going to want a system with mixed new and vintage gear.

Streaming, USB, iPod digital, and computer music files all require a modern piece of gear in the front end of the system. You can fake it with a cheap cable, but then the sound quality will be based on the tiny little chips in the iPod (or whatever)... usually not a good thing.

For example, if you needed a disc player for any reason (like a college course), you can get most of the modern functions mentioned, plus a universal disc player from the lesser Oppo unit, and a used one of those is quite cheap. If you don't need to play any digital discs, you can stick with a TT and something like a Marantz NA-7004. If you don't use any digital media, the TT alone will obviously work.

After the modern digital front end or TT, you can use vintage or new for amplification and speakers, depending on budget and other requirements.

I'd skip the focus on new vs old, figure out your needs, then ask here for the cheapest way to meet them.
 
Negotiableterms said:
I'd skip the focus on new vs old, figure out your needs, then ask here for the cheapest way to meet them.
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Yep.

But FWIW, and I've gone down this road before, college stereos ain't what they used to be and my daughter's system is the ONLY rig I've seen visiting her and her friends, plus at my second daughter's school too.

Big screen TVs, gaming consoles, and computer speakers are how it goes in most dorms. It's all digital, and even CDs are conspicuous in their absence. Spotify is big as are headphones for the phones and laptops.

Any sort of amp and speakers will probably mark him as a man of unusual taste and distinction, and there's plenty of solid vintage gear that will blow the doors off the guys with the computer 2.1 systems. Hell, a Lepai T-amp and a set of 8" bookshelfs would probably blow the doors off a lot of guys there.

A USB DAC like the Maverick or the like would serve him well as that would allow them to access the Internet cleanly, although he may be able to get in via a gaming console too...
 
For turntables I'd look for Duals, they're pretty cheap, easy to find, very solid and a lot of the 80s ones come with auto features... They'll be able to take a fair amount of abuse, sound very good and not expensive at all (Should be able to get one for under $100).

If you do get a dual avoid ones with the ULM (Ultra low mass arms) if you can because they don't take 1/2" cartridges without difficult to find adaptors
 
matteos said:
For turntables I'd look for Duals, they're pretty cheap, easy to find, very solid and a lot of the 80s ones come with auto features... They'll be able to take a fair amount of abuse, sound very good and not expensive at all (Should be able to get one for under $100).

If you do get a dual avoid ones with the ULM (Ultra low mass arms) if you can because they don't take 1/2" cartridges without difficult to find adaptors
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As a handy guy with about 15 Duals to fix around here, I wouldn't recommend one for his situation.

Duals ARE nice, but most of them out there require far more maintenance than your garden variety belt drive Japanese turntable. Unless he's prepared to deal with Steuerpimples, dried grease, frozen levers, hardened grommets and other common Dual issues, there's other options I'd look at first.
 
That Kenwood looks pretty plastic to me; you should be able to do better if you wait.
 
Andyman said:
As a handy guy with about 15 Duals to fix around here, I wouldn't recommend one for his situation.

Duals ARE nice, but most of them out there require far more maintenance than your garden variety belt drive Japanese turntable. Unless he's prepared to deal with Steuerpimples, dried grease, frozen levers, hardened grommets and other common Dual issues, there's other options I'd look at first.
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Fair enough, not my experience, didn't have to do a thing to mine... But my experience is 1/15th of yours so...
 
RUNN1NG EMOT said:
I've been looking around for my first system and found lots of suggestions for new equipment. However, I'm seeing lots of sweet looking set-ups on here with older equipment. Is there anything to this, or is it just happenstance? I'm willing to pay more for new equipment if it is better quality, but if I can get some old equipment with good quality, I'd be down for that, too.

I'm pretty ignorant about most of this stuff so any information would be helpful!
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You're not ignorant, just looking for assurance. I think you put a fair amount of thought in your initial choices described in the turntables forum, and frankly that system will sound fine in your dorm. Keep the Orbit in an easy access spot so if you must you can pull it and stash it if necessary. If those Pioneer speakers need augmentation then you can add a sub. And Onkyo makes good stuff. Trust your insincts, you'll enjoy it more knowing you made the choice. Craigslist is a time intensive thing, very random and intermittent and that A-700 is nearing the big 30, as in years old. Buy new and by you, that's what I suggest. Have fun with it, it'll go by very fast.
 
Are you sure you are an audiophile? For a dorm stereo, I'd go to best buy and get a basic 2-channel stereo receiver for $200 or less and get the buyer protection plan. If somebody barfs on it, ypu'd be covered. Then, I'd go for a vintage turntable with a good reputation. I'd look for basic speakers at Goodwill or other used sources for super cheap ($20 or so.) Then I'd bide my time and buy good speakers when you find a super good deal. Cover the basics and then improve after you've spent more time and more hours listening. Surely some starving student has pawned something incredibly decent in your college town.
 
Before buying anything used, audition it on all functions. With a little patience, you can get a pretty nice sounding system very cheaply by buying used, but every piece of not working or sorta working gear makes the total expenditure higher. If you do buy used, remember to go for the high end stuff. There's not much point in buying 30 year old gear if it was bottom of the line when new.

'70s gear is nice looking, but I've found the sweet spot for price/performance ratio to be different depending on which part of the system is being considered.

For receivers, early '90s Dolby ProLogic receivers can be had for little money, even the ones that were pretty expensive when new. In my experience, a nice Dolby ProLogic receiver will do stereo pretty well, while many Dolby Digital receivers won't, and often don't even have phono outputs.

I like speakers from the '80s for sound quality + reasonable price. Many will need the woofers refoamed, an easy job that will cost about $30. The link to the guy with all the speakers showed some nice sounding models.

When it comes to turntables, I've been very lucky with late '70s/early '80s Japanese direct drive models. If you find a Japanese table from that era, the direct drive ones were more toward the upper end, while the cheap and shitty end of the spectrum was belt driven. Keep in mind that I refer only to Japanese made tables of that time period. The same wouldn't hold true for most European tables or tables from recent times. If you aren't sure which brands are Japanese, just ask. To give a little hint, all of the items in my sig were made in Japan except for the speakers.

I agree with the guy who said you should try to befriend a local AKer or two to get steered in the right direction. They can at least help with setup...hey, we aren't born just knowing how to set up a turntable, are we?
 
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You guys do realize that school starts in, like, two weeks. It really depends on timing and luck with anything used.

And it depends on whether he wants to start the school year with his gear. Finding decent vintage takes time, a lot of time. Even with that there's the question of reliability, how long is it gonna work....
 
Which do you have more of,...time or money? That dictates people's buying choices most of the time I think.

If you have spare time and enjoy cleaning, learning and fixing things, the old stuff is pretty rewarding on many levels, good sound being one of them.
 
It's too bad he's not closer as I have all sorts of stuff here that would suit him fine, including stuff I already have on CL for pittances.
I would think there's got to be some local AK'ers kn the Chicago area that have unused stuff that he'd be interested in.
 
cubdog has offered me to stop by his place on my way to school (in Aurora) to look at some vintage gear. Hopefully I'll find what I'm looking for!
 
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