Orsefon C22 (McIntosh C-22 circuit copy)
- Thread starter CohibaJoe
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riesancas
New Member
Hi. You see, the original C22 costs a lot of money, whereas the Chinese Orsefon isn't bad—though it would be great if they installed high-quality parts at the factory. That’s why you have to replace them yourself. I measured the capacitor specs and found they were out of tolerance—they’re very cheap parts. The same goes for the op-amps—five euros max. You end up having to buy and install better ones, and the same applies to the volume control...
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Why buy a vintage C22 when...you'll have to replace every component? Besides, the upgrade here is a choice, not a necessity.
I see your logic, but—end-to-end—this doesn’t really track. If you buy a vintage C22 in need of new parts (not all do, in fact), and replace a few of the worn out components, you still have a McIntosh C22. If you buy an Orsefon and replace a few of the components (because it’s either DOA or a POS), well, you still have an Orsefon. In fact, it seems that in both cases—if you want a non-working preamp to become a working preamp—replacing parts is a necessity—for entirely different reasons with entirely different outcomes.
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A C22 of any vintage has a residual, in other words. This really doesn’t. It’ll be e-waste when the guy moves on. You can rebuild nearly anything to be nice, why waste it supporting this company? Surely one can do better for $1400ish and maybe have something actually moveable when it’s time to do something else, unless the highest thing you aspire to is baloney.
DirtyErnie
Well-Known Member
OP bought into the Mac vibe at a cost ($$ & effort) he could afford.
Sure, it'll never be a true Mac, but if it sounds close enough and he's happy, can't we just ride the wave with him?
Sure, it'll never be a true Mac, but if it sounds close enough and he's happy, can't we just ride the wave with him?
Live and let live…sure, but I’ll admit that I’ve got some mixed feelings about all of these Chinese clones of high-end American goods. I wonder: What would Frank and Gordon think? And I’m not sure I can accept that there’s such a thing as a Mac vibe (like an Opel instead of a Vette—as a Corvette vibe?). Isn’t it either a Mac or it isn’t? Everything else is counterfeit.
But @DirtyErnie, you’re right. Live and let live.
Peace.
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Friend of mine recently bought some Sound Artist LS3/5A monitors. $600. He loves them. If Amir at ASR is to be believed, they measure terribly and perform nothing like the Rogers, a "true" LS3/5A that goes for five times the price *used*. My friend can't afford that so he bought some Chinese knock-offs that make him happy.
What's the old saying? "They all look like Miss America with the lights off."
Though some need much darker rooms than others.
DirtyErnie
Well-Known Member
Nothing says so much "Your Mileage May Vary" as "Made in China". Hope the circuit boards I just had made are good enough to use once they get here.
I'm curious how bad the original parts actually are, and how much changing them affects things. In a tube amp, quite honestly the electrolytic caps are just not that critical. They are power supply filtering/decoupling and cathode bypass. Have to be pretty sad to not be adequate for that task. Its the coupling caps that you're more likely to be hearing, if at all.
From the likes of some other Chinese electronics, they might be pretty bad. But one would think that because that item seems to be a more upper end Chinese copy, they would be on the high side of quality. The Chinese are very capable if they put their minds and money into something.
Well, all iPhones are assembled in China, India, or Vietnam. Seemed to be assembled pretty well.
The Chinese invented printing, paper, gunpowder, a form of pictographic writing concurrent with Egyptian Hieroglyphics, calligraphy, Kung fu…
So I have no doubt that they can make a worthy clone of a McIntosh amp—if driven to do so. That’s one of the reasons it makes me uncomfortable. As my friend who works in Intelligence says, “The Chinese are playing the long game.”
So I have no doubt that they can make a worthy clone of a McIntosh amp—if driven to do so. That’s one of the reasons it makes me uncomfortable. As my friend who works in Intelligence says, “The Chinese are playing the long game.”
The problem as I see it isn't so much that they are incapable of making a high quality product, but that we are unwilling to pay for it. When the goal is the cheapest thing that can be found, the quality is going to suffer. Consider what we're looking at here, a low-cost knockoff of a high quality product. It basically can't be built to identical quality or it wouldn't be nearly as cheap
still curious how good or bad it truly is though, and how much is to be gained by putting a lot of expensive parts in it. Even if those caps aren't the best, does replacing them with much higher cost parts produce a benefit? I would suspect that money spent on upgrade parts might be better spent elsewhere to get more bang for the buck.
still curious how good or bad it truly is though, and how much is to be gained by putting a lot of expensive parts in it. Even if those caps aren't the best, does replacing them with much higher cost parts produce a benefit? I would suspect that money spent on upgrade parts might be better spent elsewhere to get more bang for the buck.
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