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Pioneer SP-BS22-LR, the real deal or hype?

mousepotato said:
Perchance, do you have handy a link to the review where someone voiced reservations about the midrange performance of the 52's? Please, I'm not asking you to do my research for me, but if you recall ... . (I cannot recall reading any but the faintest of criticisms about them, all things considered.) Thanks, either way.
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Read avahifi and DMurphy comments in replies #109 #116 (page 6) and #160 (page 9) here:
http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=113182.100

Lin
 
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Mousepotato, I've only used them with subs. In my computer setup, the system I bought these for, I run them with with two subs, in my main setup, where I didn't expect them to shine near as well as they did, I have 3 subs in there.

The little 4" woofer does a lot more than you'd think it could, but still it's a 4" woofer so to me a sub/subs are pretty much needed for the lowest bass, but some may find them reasonable ion the bass without a sub.
 
89grand said:
I honestly feel these speakers could be sold for 4 times what I paid for them, and perhaps only the average looking cabinet could possibly be criticized, and even then, no speaker for $400 has anything but vinyl wrapping that I know of.

I read a post on a different forum (Steve Hoffman) about these, and the guy also had some Harbeth's and said this:

"Lately, these Pioneer speakers have been splitting time with my Harbeth Compact 7ES-3s, and believe it or not, when I listen to the Pioneers I feel no overwhelming compulsion to switch back to the Harbeths, despite the latter being close to 25 times more expensive. In no way am I saying that the Pioneers are equal to the Harbeths, but they have more than a few outstanding qualities in common.

I think these speakers are rather remarkable. I listen only to classical music, so I can't speak about them in terms of other genres, but these Pioneer speakers do a couple of thing very, very nicely. Instrumental textures and tone colors are rendered with superb verisimilitude. I listen mainly to chamber music, and I can tell you that string quartets, piano trios and other small-scale works are rendered absolutely beautifully by these speakers. They sound rich, woody and resonant. They also do an excellent job of rendering concert-hall space. And as I have them positioned in my room, I never found myself wishing for more bass, although I know extended listening to orchestral works might have me dragging my subwoofer out of the closet. The only real significant complaint I have with them is a slight stridency on some recordings of violins. Not all, but some.

After listening to these speakers, I've come to believe that an inexpensive component that is very good at doing one or two things that are very important to you can offer almost as much satisfaction as a much more expensive component whose full virtues may well exceed those of the inexpensive component.

I've heard $1,000/pair speakers that are not as satisfying as the Pioneers, and if I did not know how much they cost, I would guess it was somewhere in that neighborhood.
-Bob"

I don't know if everyone would feel this way, but he did, and the fact the Pioneers are not considered a bad joke in comparison to that speaker says a lot about the Pioneers.
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That guy on the other forum would be me. And after spending some more time with the Pioneers and the Harbeths, I have no reason to revise my comments in any way. In fact, if anything, I'm even more impressed with the Pioneers than I was before. They are absolutely remarkable at rendering the instrumental tone colors and textures of the music I love. I have listened exclusively to the Pioneers for days on end without feeling a strong compulsion to slip the Harbeths back in my system.That being said, I don't intend to sell my Harbeths any time soon!
-Bob
 
opnly bafld said:
Read avahifi and DMurphy comments in replies #109 #116 (page 6) and #160 (page 9) here:
http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=113182.100

Lin
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Despite my earlier observation about Andrew Jones seeming to take a great deal of personal pride in this project, I am nonetheless flabbergasted that he joined in personally on that thread. Amusingly, he is identified as a "junior" member on the site, making me wonder what the heck kinda credentials does one need to be a senior member?!?

As to some of the comparisons of the sound of the 22's and 52's ... maybe I just don't understand speaker design very well (or maybe at all), but don't they both use the same tweeter? If so, how can one be smooth (the 22's), but the other 'strident'?
 
I think I might buy a pair of these for the system I'm setting up for my girlfriend. Pioneer PL-570, Sansui 5000x, and ...speakers that were requested to be "small" as they're going to be in a cluttered photo studio. These might be exactly what is needed, and have gotten universal praise. I have heard them, but never in a really ideal setup. I sold the rest of my small speakers except my little Kefs. Would love to compare these to them. The asking price is a no-brainer.
 
89grand said:
Thanks for that, those that is exactly what I was referring to earlier.

Here's some actual measurements that confirm the BS22 is better sounding than the towers, or at least measuring better, "sounding better" is an opinion.

http://www.audioholics.com/reviews/...neer-sp-pk52fs/pioneer-sp-pk52fs-measurements
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Thanks. And, yes, I looked at that review a couple times a few months back. Just never really thought about the bookshelves at all: I came of age, musically speaking, in the 60's and 70's, and, honestly, I just cannot wrap my head around the idea of main channel speakers the size of a family Bible.

'Course, I thought the same about the eight-inch drivers in the system upstairs, as well as the minimus 7's, and the various logitech and boston acoustics toys for the computer, all of which, I am forced to concede, sound a lot bigger than they are.

Even so ...

Could I pair speakers such as the 22's with a PSB Image Subsonic 6 and pump up White Wedding or ZZ Top's "I Need You Tonight" (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=11K1J7BDRUo) to compelling levels?
 
mousepotato said:
Despite my earlier observation about Andrew Jones seeming to take a great deal of personal pride in this project, I am nonetheless flabbergasted that he joined in personally on that thread. Amusingly, he is identified as a "junior" member on the site, making me wonder what the heck kinda credentials does one need to be a senior member?!?

As to some of the comparisons of the sound of the 22's and 52's ... maybe I just don't understand speaker design very well (or maybe at all), but don't they both use the same tweeter? If so, how can one be smooth (the 22's), but the other 'strident'?
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Well the crossovers are different, and it may be more of a crossover point problem between the 52's 5.25" driver and tweeter vs the 22's 4" driver.

As far as the junior member, it's probably a time or post amount thing, and when he joined, the automated system had no way of knowing who he was.

JohnVF said:
I think I might buy a pair of these for the system I'm setting up for my girlfriend. Pioneer PL-570, Sansui 5000x, and ...speakers that were requested to be "small" as they're going to be in a cluttered photo studio. These might be exactly what is needed, and have gotten universal praise. I have heard them, but never in a really ideal setup. I sold the rest of my small speakers except my little Kefs. Would love to compare these to them. The asking price is a no-brainer.
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Yeah, I thought they sounded pretty average, like the cheap priced should suggest, when I heard them in Best Buy, but they sounds worlds apart at home setup properly, and driven with a better amp.:music:
 
mousepotato said:
Thanks. And, yes, I looked at that review a couple times a few months back. Just never really thought about the bookshelves at all: I came of age, musically speaking, in the 60's and 70's, and, honestly, I just cannot wrap my head around the idea of main channel speakers the size of a family Bible.

'Course, I thought the same about the eight-inch drivers in the system upstairs, as well as the minimus 7's, and the various logitech and boston acoustics toys for the computer, all of which, I am forced to concede, sound a lot bigger than they are.

Even so ...

Could I pair speakers such as the 22's with a PSB Image Subsonic 6 and pump up White Wedding or ZZ Top's "I Need You Tonight" (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=11K1J7BDRUo) to compelling levels?
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They got shockingly loud for their size. I'd find them too soft in the lower bass without the subwoofers, but a 4" woofer can only do so much, it did more than I expected though and they're easy to blend with the subwoofers in both of my setups. What's really nice about these is the smooth frequency response. They don't have the pumped up, bloated upper bass that most cheaper small speakers have in order to fool the listener into thinking they have more bass than they do.

I can't guarantee they'll play as loud as you want them too, because I don't know how loud that is, but I can guarantee they play a lot louder than they look should be able to. Keep in mind too, that they like power so I wouldn't expect high volume from low powered amps.
 
Courtesy of a poster at the Circles site, here's a long video interview with Andrew Jones. It was apparently done after the first versions of these speakers were released, but he hints at some of the design changes he was working on at the time of the interview, which resulted in the current versions of the speakers.

http://twit.tv/show/home-theater-geeks/112

-Bob
 
image



That's a pretty sweet FR
 
Ed in Tx said:
Well, heck, now I want some. Please post any known deals! Seem to be going for "list" these days.
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I saw them on the Best Buy website a day or two ago for $99.

They may become even more of a hot item when more people read the very favorable review by Robert J. Reina in the new issue of Stereophile (July 2013).
 
I've heard of some even better deals, but I paid $99 from Best Buy and these speakers are an absolute steal for that price, so if you can find them even cheaper great, but they're well worth the $100.
 
matteos said:
That's a pretty sweet FR
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The response window on that curve matches the one published in Stereophile, fairly closely (generally -3, +2 dB or so from about 70 Hz upward), although in John Atkinson's measurement, the tweeter level was stepped up a bit, compensated by an off-axis rolloff.

-Bob
 
89grand, what kind of stands do you have these sitting on? I have the towers, SP-FS52 (note my previous thread) and one thing I have a problem with is their height, or lack thereof. My left speaker is partially hidden by a couch arm whereas my previous Yammies were so tall that it was a non-issue.

The bases of the towers are removable with 4 screws (you install these out of the box). I wonder if one could remove the bases and replace it with a stand, similar to what your SP-BS22's are sitting on. How do your stands work?
 
Lord Helmet said:
89grand, what kind of stands do you have these sitting on? I have the towers, SP-FS52 (note my previous thread) and one thing I have a problem with is their height, or lack thereof. My left speaker is partially hidden by a couch arm whereas my previous Yammies were so tall that it was a non-issue.

The bases of the towers are removable with 4 screws (you install these out of the box). I wonder if one could remove the bases and replace it with a stand, similar to what your SP-BS22's are sitting on. How do your stands work?
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You could set them on some stands, but you'd want some a lot shorter than mine are. Mine just sit on the stands, and the stands have rubber pads on the top base that keeps the speakers semi-secure, but they'd fall off if they got bumped hard enough. The speakers aren't bolted down to the stands.

I wouldn't think you'd want something much more than 6-8" tall or so. Maybe not really a stand in your case, but some sort of taller base would seem like the ticket.
 
One thing you could do easily and cheaply (I've done it).
Go to Home Depot or Lowes and get some patio pavers in grey or red, they sell 12"x12" or 16"x16". They are like 2-3" high. Place one or two under each tower to get the right height. I think they are like $3 each.
They also look pretty cool, like custom bases.
 
I'm impressed by the commentary and brief reviews of these speakers. I'm really intrigued. Andrew Jones is quite the engineer, but to be able to put this level of fidelity at this price point is rather astonishing.

Back in 1978, I mean we are looking at these speakers going for around $30-$40 MSRP. Can anyone think of a speaker that cost that much new in that era that would be able to compete with these Pioneers? Dynaco A25s were $99 back in their day, I wonder how these Pioneers would stack up.

Technology really has come a long ways.
 
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