Sactostrat
New Member
The Empire RM10 with a new stylus at 3.0 grams is doing great. No more skipping and sounds pretty good. I'm happy you all steered me in that direction.
Rek-O-Kut Turntables - ROK
- Thread starter jcmjrt
- Start date
adnick
Addicted Member
Have the plinth together and started fitting the table, still have to do the finish and add some feet....
The original idler wheel, has a divot, was obviously left sitting with the selector engaged. Tried soaking it, and even turned it on the lathe, no joy.
Ordered one of the “Russian” idler wheels, but given the delivery time, went ahead and purchased a plastic replacement off of eBay, the “Rek O Kut Rondine Jr. L-34, Rondine B-12, B-12GH, B-12H Idler Wheel Replacement” As the seller states this is not a replacement for the metal body wheels like mine, the shaft diameter is too small. Took it to the lathe and drilled it one size under then honed It to fit.
Polished the main shaft, with special attention to the area the ball bearing rides against, then went ahead and polished the platter.
The speed is very close 33.29, so close that messing with it doesn’t seem prudent, w/f .20-.24 and that’s with no damper materials added to the platter. Very happy with the results so far.
This table never had a tonearm mounted in the factory hole, so an S320 variant goes in the factory location and a Pickering 190 is waiting to get installed as a second arm (which will most likely be my main arm).
Also have a Model A 120 mono, it might replace the S320.
The table is extremely quiet quite now, but there’s much left to do...
VR
Andy
The original idler wheel, has a divot, was obviously left sitting with the selector engaged. Tried soaking it, and even turned it on the lathe, no joy.
Ordered one of the “Russian” idler wheels, but given the delivery time, went ahead and purchased a plastic replacement off of eBay, the “Rek O Kut Rondine Jr. L-34, Rondine B-12, B-12GH, B-12H Idler Wheel Replacement” As the seller states this is not a replacement for the metal body wheels like mine, the shaft diameter is too small. Took it to the lathe and drilled it one size under then honed It to fit.
Polished the main shaft, with special attention to the area the ball bearing rides against, then went ahead and polished the platter.
The speed is very close 33.29, so close that messing with it doesn’t seem prudent, w/f .20-.24 and that’s with no damper materials added to the platter. Very happy with the results so far.
This table never had a tonearm mounted in the factory hole, so an S320 variant goes in the factory location and a Pickering 190 is waiting to get installed as a second arm (which will most likely be my main arm).
Also have a Model A 120 mono, it might replace the S320.
The table is extremely quiet quite now, but there’s much left to do...
VR
Andy
Pio1980
AK Member
The idler doesn't determine speed reduction, just enables it.
The ratio of the platter circumference at the point of idler contact vs the circumference of the driving shaft to the idler determines speed.
adnick
Addicted Member
Yes that’s understood, but I’ve noticed that a slight idler pressure adjustment + or - results in small speed variations; not whole rpm’s but certainly 1/10s.
VR
Pio1980
AK Member
Yes indeed, that changes smallish factors like "slippage" and others.
adnick
Addicted Member
Made some progress with the plinth, still have several small things to do, have some sound damping caulk that I’ll place in between each layer within the plinth, and make some exits for the cables, that kinda stuff.
Rewired my Pickering 190 with some Cardas wires and junction box, not sure this arm was ever used, the bearings are incredibly sensitive, just have to do the final install....
Rewired my Pickering 190 with some Cardas wires and junction box, not sure this arm was ever used, the bearings are incredibly sensitive, just have to do the final install....
Can you help with info about the "Russian" idler wheel? I haven't heard of anyone making a new replacement wheel for these tables.
adnick
Addicted Member
Wish I could give you a definitive response however, ordered it a couple of weeks ago so it’ll be a while. They list the specifications as, overall diameter 63 mm, around 2.48” and shaft size is 5.6 mm, .22”, thickness of the bearing housing is 9.5 mm .374”
It does have a metal center, but without having it in hand, that’s all the info I can provide.
As stated, I’m very happy with the plastic L34 wheel off of eBay, sizing the bearing made for a near perfect fit, and it has an “o-ring” type rubber that could be replaced with smaller/larger rubber rings....
VR
Andy
Thanks, and can you either mention or PM the maker? Thanks!
adnick
Addicted Member
Not sure who the maker is, it’s listed as coming from Ростов-на-Дону, Russian Federation however, the ship from address is Hong Kong; so this may well be a “middle man” offering of the product.
A well known Russian Audio dealer use to offer a similar product but I cannot attest to who actually makes the one I ordered.
The other one that I’m currently running is American made, and the maker contacted me after reading my post and has asked me to provide the shaft diameter on my Deluxe so he can offer an alternative size to the current one. Have no affiliation with the maker but it’s a fine product and I’m happy to comply.
Hopefully we’ll have several options to keep our passion fueled!
VR
Andy
I see the delrin one from Vermont, that does look good so I'm probably going to go that route. Thanks!
setup1
Super Member
FWIW, I'm using this idler wheel from Karmadon. It's currently installed in my B12GH (Papst Aussenlaufer motor) and have used it also in my L34 Rondine Jr. I don't think this will work with the B12H (Ashland), if memory serves me right the idler wheel on that unit has a different bearing diameter. When I ordered this particular idler wheel, Serge asked me to measure the idler wheel stud to ensure a proper fit. Shipping from his shop in Ukraine was about 2 weeks.
adnick
Addicted Member
FWIW, I'm using this idler wheel from Karmadon. It's currently installed in my B12GH (Papst Aussenlaufer motor) and have used it also in my L34 Rondine Jr. I don't think this will work with the B12H (Ashland), if memory serves me right the idler wheel on that unit has a different bearing diameter. When I ordered this particular idler wheel, Serge asked me to measure the idler wheel stud to ensure a proper fit. Shipping from his shop in Ukraine was about 2 weeks.
That’s a very good looking product....My Deluxe has a .25 inch shaft so the L 34 idler I have had to be sized to fit the shaft, otherwise it’s perfect.
Was aware that some people have the Karmadon wheel, but it’s not currently listed on his website, at least I couldn’t find it.
Do you know, is it a special order item or di I just miss it on the Karmadon site?
Regards,
Andy
setup1
Super Member
I contacted Serge via Facebook because I needed an idler wheel for my Gates CB77 and he mentioned that he was developing one for ROK. So I gave him the dimensions of the stud which was identical between the L34 and the B12GH.
cmarti
Well-Known Member
I just send my originals to Gary at The Voice of Music and he rebuilds them. What is the benefit of using the Russian or the Karmadon one?
setup1
Super Member
Twenty or so years ago, I had my ROK and Bogen/Lenco idler wheels refurbished either by Ed Crockett (VOM/Gary’s predecessor) or Terry’s Rubber Rollers, both with decent results. I got fresh rubber over the old plastic hub/sintered bearing with many years of wear.
With the Karmadon ROK idler wheel you get precision ground fresh rubber of proper durometer attached to a milled brass hub with a sintered bearing machined to tighter tolerances. IMO, this is an improvement over the original and equates to much less vibration transmission. Like I mentioned in my blog, the performance gained is similar to using an Audio Silente idler wheel on my TD124.
I have no experience with the Russian or the New England machinist but if they offer similar quality to Karmadon, then they’re well worth considering too.
Please note that I have no affiliation with Audio Silente or Karmadon, just sharing my positive experience.
cmarti
Well-Known Member
Thank you, your response was great. That's what I needed to know.
adnick
Addicted Member
After a couple of days the speed is 33.34,not too shabby 
The thing is so quiet can’t tell it’s on by listening; thoughts of hearing loss came to mind so....
Got out the old DB meter and it didn’t pick up the turntable either, no difference in ambient sound on/off, that’s outstanding.
Polished the platter shaft, and bearing point, added 10w synthetic gun oil, an running the delrin idler wheels off of eBay.
Very happy with this table...
VR
Andy
The thing is so quiet can’t tell it’s on by listening; thoughts of hearing loss came to mind so....
Got out the old DB meter and it didn’t pick up the turntable either, no difference in ambient sound on/off, that’s outstanding.
Polished the platter shaft, and bearing point, added 10w synthetic gun oil, an running the delrin idler wheels off of eBay.
Very happy with this table...
VR
Andy