The Mac is now out of the mix and Im using a restored HK Citation 22 along with the Crown.
Stacked speakers, multiple amps question
- Thread starter sberger
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The Mac is now out of the mix and Im using a restored HK Citation 22 along with the Crown.
My point was that you'd get more power and a more consistent sound quality using a single amplifier than trying to mix and match. Sometimes that is a challenge given the loads involved, but not with the Crown.
Not disagreeing. But for whatever reason I like the end result of the 2 amps now in place(see signature) then the Crown. They are both of equal gain, and to my ears the sound signature is very similar. With the Crown I also rely on a speaker switch box which may or not have an effect on the sound.
Why the switch? Yeah, those do affect the sound. I'd stack bananas or use a four pole Speakon connector.
That's effectively what happens in any environment using multiple pair of speakers - like receivers with A and B switching. They're simply wired in parallel. Using stacked bananas or Speakons (only about four bucks each at Parts Express) would be more elegant and ensure a tight connection.
onplane
What! No Wake???
Sam, the far more interesting question than which amp powers which set, is: how do you stack?
Naturally with these AR's the woofer on the bottom speaker should be near the floor; not so clear on the top speaker. That is, I'd be temped to put the tweeters together and have the top speaker's woofer closer to the ceiling.
So, Sam, how are yours stacked?
Regards,
Jerry
I have them stacked horizontally, with the woofers on the outside, 3's on top of 3a's. I like the 3's better, and listen to them separately often, so having them on top provides a pretty good height for them(yes I know I have wire issues...no cracks please).
Jerry I've followed your biamp threads here and on CSP, and while I'm tempted frankly I'm worried that something would end up getting fried in the process.
Jerry I've followed your biamp threads here and on CSP, and while I'm tempted frankly I'm worried that something would end up getting fried in the process.
onplane
What! No Wake???
Great pic, Sam!! Pics really help understand what folks are doing.
OK, tweeters and mids facing in will cause reduced separation. Separation can make a HUGE difference on some recordings.
As for stands, I'm not a huge fan, because you "give away" the low frequency room multiplier. No AS system can put out the amount of bass you can achieve with the more efficient vented systems. Thus putting speakers on the floor (in your case I'd put a square of carpeting on that beautiful floor just the size on the speaker) we take advantage of our room's natural enhancement to low frequencies.
Anyhow something for you to try. You might also try my preference for woofers to the closest horizontal surface.
Finally, you might try the woofers facing in to hear the improved separation. Now in all of these different configurations, you must listen to a wide range of recordings. Sam, some recordings are so close to mono than nothing impacts them.
As for bi-amping with three terminals, this is not for the faint of heart. Unless ... unless you have that unique Sherwood unit that make it a "no brainer".
Regards,
Jerry
I'm getting sufficient amount of bass as it is in the present configuration, sometimes almost a bit too much. Putting them on the floor would almost certainly result in a boominess that I would prefer to avoid.
I will try the the woofer in suggestion, however. I have them in this configuration based on a suggestion by one of the regulars over at CSP who did the same thing with his 3a's. Sounds fine to me so I haven't thought to try them out differently, but I'm always willing to experiment.
What Sherwood are you referring to? I used to have a nice Sherwood tube amp, but that's long gone, Only piece left in the arsenal is a 8910 solid state receiver. But I am faint of heart when it comes to these speakers. Already had to replace one woofer a while back after an amp mishap, and really don't want to have to go through that again.
I will try the the woofer in suggestion, however. I have them in this configuration based on a suggestion by one of the regulars over at CSP who did the same thing with his 3a's. Sounds fine to me so I haven't thought to try them out differently, but I'm always willing to experiment.
What Sherwood are you referring to? I used to have a nice Sherwood tube amp, but that's long gone, Only piece left in the arsenal is a 8910 solid state receiver. But I am faint of heart when it comes to these speakers. Already had to replace one woofer a while back after an amp mishap, and really don't want to have to go through that again.
onplane
What! No Wake???
Sam, by using room gain we hope for bass extension into the very low frequencies. In short, we take advantage of the slower roll off in frequency response that you naturally get with acoustic suspension. We are not seeking "boominess". You might read this short article by a current sub manufacturer, who makes both ported and AS subs:
https://www.svsound.com/blogs/svs/75367747-sealed-vs-ported
Sherwood has a very unique receiver their RX-5502, which has in one box 4 full range amps rated at 100 wpc @ 4 ohms. With this unit I bi-amp my AR's using just the three terminals AR provided. Funny thing is, Sam, no where in Sherwood's promotional material or manuals do they talk about bi-amping. So we have an amp design for one application that works exceptionally well in a totally different application. I consider this a really nice "find" and share whenever I can.
Having the 4 amps in one box makes AR bi-amping with three terminals sooooo very much easier than what I did with discrete amps 8 years ago.
Regards,
Jerry
onplane
What! No Wake???
Sam, I forgot to comment about reversing the woofers in your current configuration. Separation is the major difference you would notice.
Now, the question here is what is the correct amount a separation?
Unfortunately, the answer here is very much room dependent. Rooms can provide more or less reflections. Then the big issue is distance between the speakers and your normal listening position. From your pic, it appears you sit quite a ways back from the speakers. I'd think in this case more separation would be better. Again many recordings sound better with a high degree of separation, but some others ... not so much.
Sam, please let us know what you hear.
Regards,
Jerry
Now, the question here is what is the correct amount a separation?
Unfortunately, the answer here is very much room dependent. Rooms can provide more or less reflections. Then the big issue is distance between the speakers and your normal listening position. From your pic, it appears you sit quite a ways back from the speakers. I'd think in this case more separation would be better. Again many recordings sound better with a high degree of separation, but some others ... not so much.
Sam, please let us know what you hear.
Regards,
Jerry
I sit about 10 feet from the speakers. I switched them around and yes, I am getting better separation. A little research confirmed that this is the preferred, or recommended way for horizontal placement. I'm not sure why the suggestion over at CSP was woofer out. I'll have to pose the question.
Yes I remember you referring to that Sherwood in a prior thread. Sounds interesting.
At some point I'll give the speakers on the floor a try. Thanks for your insights.
Yes I remember you referring to that Sherwood in a prior thread. Sounds interesting.
At some point I'll give the speakers on the floor a try. Thanks for your insights.
onplane
What! No Wake???
Sam, there is no "preferred" orientation. Rooms and geometry determine everything.
Too much separation can be a bad thing. The big question is with the music you enjoy, do you like the better separation?
Regards,
Jerry
onplane
What! No Wake???
Well, Sam, if you perceive the increased separation as better, you can get a little more separation by stacking your speakers vertically.
Now, the key here is to stack in such a way that your tweeters REMAIN in the same vertical plane as they are now. This brings your woofers in the same alignment and remember, Sam, your woofers still provide the fundamental notes on many instruments.
Regards,
Jerry
Took your advice and added the Speakon's and listening now to the Crown power both pairs and yes, it's more elegant looking, and it sounds very nice. Those connectors had a bit of a learning curve but finally figured it all out. Thanks for the advice. Now I just gotta figure out to do with all the spare amps
audio-ed
Well-Known Member
I recently picked up 2 sets of JBL L100's . Listening to 1 set I was very happy but I kept thinking how would both sets would sound . Jury is still out. Playing with placement . So far it's not giving me much more sound over 1 set. It's noticible but I thought it would be more dramatic . Haven't stacked yet. . I remember stacking large advents and playing with 2 receivers and I liking the sound.