Those nasty car telematics--worse than I thought

[DesertRatt]

Connected Cars Talk to Google and Ad Trackers While Seven Car Apps Hand Over the Owner's VIN

Researchers tested 21 new cars and 30 car apps. 19 cars talked to outside companies, and seven apps sent the VIN to trackers like Google and Meta.

hackingpassion.com

Apparently, there are no limits to what car makers can embed in your car for spying on you.

The Tesla spying and tracking is just insane.

 

[RVT1K]

Are they using the in-car microphone to listen in on conversations?

 

[Enophile]

Are they using the in-car microphone to listen in on conversations?

Yes.

And they track what you write on the internet and listen to your conversations at home.

 

[DesertRatt]

"1996 is the first year cars had factory‑installed cellular modems and true telematics systems. GM’s OnStar, launched in 1996 and installed on 1997 Cadillacs, is universally recognized as the first OEM‑embedded cellular telematics platform."

 

[RVT1K]

Yes.

And they track what you write on the internet and listen to your conversations at home.

I would say its far past "torches and pitchforks" time but it is astounding just how much of the population has embraced this kind of crap. All under the umbrella of "convenience".

 

[ConradH]

About the only thing I think is good is "black box" recording so you can prove you weren't (or were) at fault in an accident or crooked speed trap.

 

[GChief]

Are they using the in-car microphone to listen in on conversations?

we can hope so

 

[RVT1K]

About the only thing I think is good is "black box" recording so you can prove you weren't (or were) at fault in an accident or crooked speed trap.

Sure but what about your insurance company surveilling you every second you are in your car and cancelling your coverage because your telemetry showed something that violated the small print even if there was no police involved?

 

[Bill Ferris]

I recently watched a YT video provided by a custom car garage where he proved that a some of recently manufactured vehicles telemetrics can be disabled by tracking down the labeled fuse for it in the vehicle`s fuse block, either located under the hood or inside the cabin, and simply pulling its fuse.

He afterwards drove the vehicles around starting and stopping the engine/ignition to determine if there were going to be any drivability issues before releasing the vehicle to the owners, who had requested his shop to looking into disabling the vehicle`s tracking telemetrics.

CA., as I`ve read is trying to mandate by law all modern vehicles sold in its state to have a readily present operator switch to completely turn off all telemetrics, if the owner wishes to do so without affecting the drivability/performance of the vehicle.

None of my three vehicles are newer than 2006, so, no concerns at my end.

 

[init4fun]

About the only thing I think is good is "black box" recording so you can prove you weren't (or were) at fault in an accident or crooked speed trap.

Hi Conrad, all of my vehicles (3) have forward & rearward facing "dashcams" that record vehicle speed and some other parameters so I've got the proof thing well covered

 

[gadget73]

Most of us have been carrying phones for years that are most likely doing the same thing, so all I can say is "not surprised" to this.

and to be clear, that does not constitute an endorsement or approval, merely an acknowledgement of the situation.

 

[RVT1K]

Most of us have been carrying phones for years that are most likely doing the same thing, so all I can say is "not surprised" to this.

and to be clear, that does not constitute an endorsement or approval, merely an acknowledgement of the situation.

Yes. It all started with the mandatory incorporation of GPS under the guise of "safety".
I recall a situation with stranded motorists and their inability to identify where they were.
So now we're stuck with phones that continuously report location to whoever is listening or buying that info.

 

[gadget73]

I keep that turned off on my phone, but I don't really believe its truly off, just the programs I poke at don't have permission to access it.


I forget which Batman movie it was, but one of the more recent ones had that whole scene with Morgan Freeman and they turned on all of the mics and cameras in people's phones to track someone. I fully expect thats far less fiction than we'd like to believe.

 

[whoaru99]

Most of us have been carrying phones for years that are most likely doing the same thing, so all I can say is "not surprised" to this.

and to be clear, that does not constitute an endorsement or approval, merely an acknowledgement of the situation.

That comes up a lot, but a very big difference depending the rabbit trail one goes down, is that accessing your tracking data from your cell phone generally requires a warrant. Not so with a lot of this other tracking data.

 

[RVT1K]

I keep that turned off on my phone, but I don't really believe its truly off, just the programs I poke at don't have permission to access it.


I forget which Batman movie it was, but one of the more recent ones had that whole scene with Morgan Freeman and they turned on all of the mics and cameras in people's phones to track someone. I fully expect thats far less fiction than we'd like to believe.

Aren't there similar situations in the Jason Bourne movies? Tapping into every camera in the area of interest.

 

[RVT1K]

I recently watched a YT video provided by a custom car garage where he proved that a some of recently manufactured vehicles telemetrics can be disabled by tracking down the labeled fuse for it in the vehicle`s fuse block, either located under the hood or inside the cabin, and simply pulling its fuse.

That's a fairly elegant solution.
My thoughts were along the lines of putting a dummy load in place of the antenna.

 

[init4fun]

I keep that turned off on my phone, but I don't really believe its truly off, just the programs I poke at don't have permission to access it.


I forget which Batman movie it was, but one of the more recent ones had that whole scene with Morgan Freeman and they turned on all of the mics and cameras in people's phones to track someone. I fully expect thats far less fiction than we'd like to believe.

This.....

And, I'll add that modern "smart" TVs track your viewing habits so as to target you with ads. Any presumption of "privacy" goes right out the window as a tradeoff for accepting the convenience of modern electronic devices. I'm neither advocating for nor railing against the modern reality of these "smart" devices, , , , simply stating that I'm fully aware of how they operate & the tradeoff(s) that come with their use.......

 

[Bill Ferris]

This.....

And, I'll add that modern "smart" TVs track your viewing habits so as to target you with ads. Any presumption of "privacy" goes right out the window as a tradeoff for accepting the convenience of modern electronic devices. I'm neither advocating for nor railing against the modern reality of these "smart" devices, , , , simply stating that I'm fully aware of how they operate & the tradeoff(s) that come with their use.......

I saw several YT videos about smartass TVs doing that major personal privacy leaking, including some of them having several live activated microphones embedded in the chassis, with SamSuck & LG the worst offenders !
One method to help curtail this wholesale privacy abuse is to never connect the smartass TV to the internet from first installation, and don`t be lured to lazily stream from any of the internet based embedded apps the manufacture provides to lure the unsuspecting user, nor engage the updates that they push to install more user convenience based privacy violation leaking abuse.

These multi person team privacy researchers even found that some more recent smartass TVs when hooked up to a computer, via HDMI connection, bypassing the connected computer`s internal internet security/privacy settings due to the "backdoor exploited" two way digital connection capability of HDMI, with the smartass TV being able to scan & phone home the connected computer`s internally stored information files, and spewing out the TV and connected computer back to the info. brokers that way.

Joe & Jane`s public mantra "give me convenience, or give me death" driven/chosen lifestyles have opened up ever expanding loss of privacy Pandora`s Box, and the billions of $ profit making data brokers are more than happy to exploit, as they were knowingly given the keys !

 

[TSmith8605]

That's a fairly elegant solution.
My thoughts were along the lines of putting a dummy load in place of the antenna.

I gather that pulling the fuse on the telematics box works for certain cars but in other cars may also disable other functions. I saw a YouTube on removing the telematics box completely from a Toyota. Turns out a couple of other things are routed through the box and those will also be disabled. So you can buy a wiring harness kit that replaces the box but passes the other functions along. You have to take the dash all apart to get at it.

I think the dummy load on the cellular antenna is a good idea - the system will just think there is no cell service available. But I'm not sure how to do that: where to connect.

 

[TSmith8605]

This.....

And, I'll add that modern "smart" TVs track your viewing habits so as to target you with ads. Any presumption of "privacy" goes right out the window as a tradeoff for accepting the convenience of modern electronic devices. I'm neither advocating for nor railing against the modern reality of these "smart" devices, , , , simply stating that I'm fully aware of how they operate & the tradeoff(s) that come with their use.......

I have a new Samsung smart TV. I did not connect it to the Internet on set up. I use an HDMI connection from a BluRey player (also not connected to the Internet) and an Apple TV streaming box. After a bit of Internet Google / Reddit searching, it appears that the AppleTV box can not route Internet traffic from the TV (i.e. via "Ethernet of HDMI") to the Internet and Apple has strict privacy rules that prevent this. The AppleTV box has no camera or microphone (for spying).

Of course the AppleTV streaming apps do monitor and report what I watch and use that to make suggestions which is fine with me. None of my streaming services have commercials except the F1 coverage on AppleTV+ (the streaming service) and those are always the same commercials.

I also did not connect my new fridge to the Internet and I use ad blockers and tracker blockers on web browsers.

Still, my phone can follow me around anyway.