preston1000
Active Member
Would like to know if you've removed the stock RCA cables from your turntable and replaced them with better sounding RCA cables. If so, what cables did you use and what improvements did you notice?
Upgrade RCA cables
- Thread starter preston1000
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1tumbleweed
Kozmik Kowboy
A serious reply:
I had to replace the ICs on my Dual CS-1268 because the originals were crap (the connectors, actually). I used some Monster Interconnect Junior I had lying around, which had a separate ground wire built-in in addition to the L & R. Worked a treat. Capacitance in the phono cable itself is not all that critical unless you're dealing with Quad CD4. If possible, use somethig with a foam dielectric and you'll be fine.
And, it's "baling wire", not bailing wire.
As always, just my opinion, YMMV.
I had to replace the ICs on my Dual CS-1268 because the originals were crap (the connectors, actually). I used some Monster Interconnect Junior I had lying around, which had a separate ground wire built-in in addition to the L & R. Worked a treat. Capacitance in the phono cable itself is not all that critical unless you're dealing with Quad CD4. If possible, use somethig with a foam dielectric and you'll be fine.
And, it's "baling wire", not bailing wire.
As always, just my opinion, YMMV.
bobins08
Celebrating Life
30+ year old RCA cables are not doing you any favors no matter the capacitive loading requirements.
Use shielded, low capacitance cables with good connectors. If you need to add capacitance due to cartridge loading requirements then add it at the phono input by use of a splitter and load plugs.
Use shielded, low capacitance cables with good connectors. If you need to add capacitance due to cartridge loading requirements then add it at the phono input by use of a splitter and load plugs.
lini
just me...
tm: You won't find that opinion all too often among experienced phono fans, as most will be aware that at least the cable capacity can make quite a difference. And I guess hardly any phono fan would deny that there's also diffrent suitability depending on the turntable model, for example regarding flexibility especially for models with subchassis - or simply the diameter for a model of which one wants to reuse the original strain relief...
p1k: Well, I did for example. The first phono cable I've swapped was that of my TD280II - not only because the stock cable and RCA plugs appeared somewhat shabby, but foremost because the cable was rather long and had a pretty high capacity. Improvement as expected: smoother response and extended bandwith in the treble/highs with my AT120/102P family carts. Don't quite remember the exact cable type I've used on that right at the moment, but I generally use comparatively simple coax cable types for the purpose - sometimes RG family (e.g. RG179), sometimes others. For example, one of my favourite cheapos is a 5 mm coax cable, type 50010001SW, with a 7 x 0.2 mm pure copper inner conductor and braided pure copper shield, 67 pF/m - which Bürklin over here used to offer for ages, but doesn't anymore (now they have the 50010001WS, but I prefer the old, black over the new, white version; I like white outer insulations only when made of PTFE, 'cause PVC outer insulations collect dirt all too easily...).
Greetings from Munich!
Manfred / lini
p1k: Well, I did for example. The first phono cable I've swapped was that of my TD280II - not only because the stock cable and RCA plugs appeared somewhat shabby, but foremost because the cable was rather long and had a pretty high capacity. Improvement as expected: smoother response and extended bandwith in the treble/highs with my AT120/102P family carts. Don't quite remember the exact cable type I've used on that right at the moment, but I generally use comparatively simple coax cable types for the purpose - sometimes RG family (e.g. RG179), sometimes others. For example, one of my favourite cheapos is a 5 mm coax cable, type 50010001SW, with a 7 x 0.2 mm pure copper inner conductor and braided pure copper shield, 67 pF/m - which Bürklin over here used to offer for ages, but doesn't anymore (now they have the 50010001WS, but I prefer the old, black over the new, white version; I like white outer insulations only when made of PTFE, 'cause PVC outer insulations collect dirt all too easily...).
Greetings from Munich!
Manfred / lini
cratz2
Addicted Member
preston1000
Active Member
Belden 8402 20 AWG stranded (26x34) high-conductivity TC conductors, EPDM rubber insulation, rayon braid, TC braid shield (85% coverage), cotton wrap, CSPE - Brown Chlorosulphonated Polyethylene jacket.
Any thoughts?
Any thoughts?
lini
just me...
p1k: I wouldn't use that Belden 8402 as a phono cable - formost due to being rather thick, having a pretty large minimum bend radius as well as both a pretty high conductor-to-conductor and pretty high conductor-to-shield capacity, but also because I don't like tinned copper conductors that much.
Greetings from Munich!
Manfred / lini
Greetings from Munich!
Manfred / lini
preston1000
Active Member
The only thing that would concern me with Beldens are the open stage they'll produce. Will it be enough with the Denon MP-11? Don't know.
To answer the OP's question, yes I have and with great results. The first one I did was Dual 506 that sounded very muffled, I was new at audio so I assumed it was the cartridge. The RCA's were very stiff and the insulation was getting brittle so I replaced them with some cables from an Onkyo CP-1046F that was missing enough parts I know it would never be brought back into service. Much to my surprise the cables resolved the muffling issue and that 506 is now the main deck in my buddies system. I have now re-cabled a half a dozen tables with varying results and I'm sure there will be more in my future. One of things I enjoy most about this hobby is the unlimited opportunity for experimentation. If you try it and it makes it better, great! If it it's the same no biggie, if it makes it worse put it back the way it was and try again when you have a new idea or opportunity.
bimasta
Addicted Member
In every tonearm I've wired (4 or 5), a continuous run of thin well-shielded tonearm wire, uninterrupted from cartridge-output to preamp-input, sounds far and away the best to me. The output from a LOMC is the smallest by far in the audio chain — every solder-joint, metal-to-metal plug connection, every dissimilar metal interface, chips away at that tiny signal, a little or a lot. Some wiring has 6, 8, 10 discontinuities. They add up. No matter how fancy the metals or dielectrics used, or if the RCAs belong in the window at Cartier — it won't be as good.
I await the onslaught....
I await the onslaught....
bimasta
Addicted Member
Yeah!!! Someone that understands the properties of baling wire! Seriously: Thanks for saying what I have believed all along.
You're welcome. Both theory and experiment bear it out.
But you're dead wrong on one point Trinhsman. Baling wire may be the best of all wires for speakers, amplifiers and DACs — but it is a terrible choice for tonearm wiring.
You're welcome. Both theory and experiment bear it out.
But you're dead wrong on one point Trinhsman. Baling wire may be the best of all wires for speakers, amplifiers and DACs — but it is a terrible choice for tonearm wiring.
preston1000
Active Member
Okay, so I got the MP-11 and the vocals sound amazing as do the guitars. So my question is, is it difficult to get to the RCA outputs to attach the Beldens 8402?
I would gather I need to do some soldering which isn't a problem. Does someone have a link or pics how it's done?
Thanks
I would gather I need to do some soldering which isn't a problem. Does someone have a link or pics how it's done?
Thanks
preston1000
Active Member
Today I installed the Belden 8402 where the originals were soldered.
Can I hear a difference, yes I can. There's more detailed sound stage and warmer. I will post some pictures of the process if anyone's considering this upgrade.
Can I hear a difference, yes I can. There's more detailed sound stage and warmer. I will post some pictures of the process if anyone's considering this upgrade.
preston1000
Active Member
Video of Denon DP-45F, Nagoaka MP-11, stock RCA cables.
The White Stripes 7 Nation Army
Video of Denon DP-45F, Nagoaka MP-11, upgraded Belden 8402 RCA cables.
The White Stripes 7 Nation Army
The White Stripes 7 Nation Army
Video of Denon DP-45F, Nagoaka MP-11, upgraded Belden 8402 RCA cables.
The White Stripes 7 Nation Army
