Which treatment (Restore-A-Finish or Feed N Wax) for this veneer?
- Thread starter Gang-Twanger
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I guess you can refer to wax as a finish, but even that article states that it's not much of one:Hey there, freaky fools...
I've been wondering lately about my W90's and whether or not I'm on the right road in terms of veneer revitalization (They have a walnut veneer), so I thought I'd post the question to you folks out there (Hey, folks...). So far, I've simply cleaned them a bit and added a few rounds of Howard's Feed N Wax, and they do look better than they did when I first got them. However, I know they can be a lot better, and I get the feeling that they may need a round of Restore-A-Finish and THEN the F&W. I finally have them sounding right, so now I'd like to get them LOOKING right as well. Anyway, what are your thoughts on this?
The light isn't fantastic in here, so the pic's a bit on the blurry side and isn't as faded as it looks, but it's not great either (I bought a new light, but I have to exchange it because one of the pieces is broken), but hopefully this will give you SOME idea of what they look like.
Go look at my thread and see how I did my JBL L250. I could have brought these to the shop and finished them like furniture. I wanted to show you all a nice Finish can be done quick and easy at home and even in the house.
Starting at page 8 take note how fast I got these done just with a little time after work.
http://www.audiokarma.org/forums/showthread.php?t=547686
If you like the looks of the end result I'll explain in detail.
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A wax finish is one wood finishing technique, as is an oil finish, tung oil finish, lacquer finish, varnish finish, polyurethane finish, etc etc.
Howards Restor-A-Finish is intended to restore an existing finish, not create a new one. It contains some amount of stain (for evening the old stain and hiding small blemishes, a solvent (for cleaning the existing finish) and some agent (proprietary) to provide a low gloss shine. The company is quite clear about stating that a new lacquer, oil, etc finish should not be applied over the product...PARTICULARLY polyurethane.
Howards Restor-A-Finish is intended to restore an existing finish, not create a new one. It contains some amount of stain (for evening the old stain and hiding small blemishes, a solvent (for cleaning the existing finish) and some agent (proprietary) to provide a low gloss shine. The company is quite clear about stating that a new lacquer, oil, etc finish should not be applied over the product...PARTICULARLY polyurethane.
Gang-Twanger
Resident Wharfedaliophool
See, that's the thing. I love the tone of the existing finish, and I really don't want to mess with that. I simply want to revitalize the existing finish and bring out what's already under there. That's why I've been so-apprehensive about doing anything intensive. I don't want to RE-finish. I just want to rejuvenate the 50 year old one.
Listening to the Chicago Transit Authority debut right now... Those horns... :drool:
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Also you can look at my Photobucket.
http://s1171.photobucket.com/user/427fairlane/library/JBL L250?sort=3&page=1
http://s1171.photobucket.com/user/427fairlane/library/JBL L250?sort=3&page=1
See, that's the thing. I love the tone of the existing finish, and I really don't want to mess with that. I simply want to revitalize the existing finish and bring out what's already under there. That's why I've been so-apprehensive about doing anything intensive. I don't want to RE-finish. I just want to rejuvenate the 50 year old one.
But thats kind of like saying I don't want to rebuild my 300,000 mile engine. I just want to pour something in it to make it better.
A finish only last so long and your looking at a failed finish. Sure you can goop oil all over it and it will look shiny for a minute but thats it. Also the more restor in a bottle that gets wiped on them creeping down into the wood is doing more harm than good.
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Gang-Twanger
Resident Wharfedaliophool
Yeah, it sounds like my best bet may be to do the RAF/0000 steel wool thing and clean off the wax I used plus the stuff underneath that I should have taken care of in the first place (Then maybe the F&W after? ...IDK... We'll see at that point, I guess, because I would like to protect them).
But I have time still before I can get to anything, so I think I'll keep reading into ALL options before committing to anything. I appreciate all the help though. I just don't want to lose that "50 year old veneer" look, ya' know? I've seen some refinishes here and there that made them look like a NEW speaker instead of a beautifully-restored 50 year old one, if that makes any sense, and I just wanna' avoid that.
But I have time still before I can get to anything, so I think I'll keep reading into ALL options before committing to anything. I appreciate all the help though. I just don't want to lose that "50 year old veneer" look, ya' know? I've seen some refinishes here and there that made them look like a NEW speaker instead of a beautifully-restored 50 year old one, if that makes any sense, and I just wanna' avoid that.
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Gang-Twanger
Resident Wharfedaliophool
That was my Sansui 2000x. That picture was taken up in Maine back on the day I got them. Not very-formal, I know. I was excited and in a hurry.
You know how it is.
Gang-Twanger
Resident Wharfedaliophool
Oh, that's just the right-side arm of an old couch we've had up there for a few decades.
You can see it in this video (I'm kinda' embarrassed to even post this one anymore. My system's gotten so-much-better since then. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y7Nmoxayqnc
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cratz2
Addicted Member
Well, I'm a third generation German high end woodworker and finish carpenter but I'm aware that many folks don't want to fully strip and refinish a pair of vintage speakers.
:yes:
I think for what it is... And for how little time and money it requires, Restore A Finish is likely to satisfy many folks, thus its popularity. Some folks want to get more involved and for them, RAF is definitely not an end-all product.
That's my take anyway.
Gang-Twanger
Resident Wharfedaliophool
:yes: and :yes:
4-2-7's JBL's do look awesome though. That's a very-natural-looking finish.
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I don't refinish any of my stuff thats the approach I take. I did the JBL's because they were sun baked faded and dried out.
The finishing that I'm recommending is extremely easy. No harder than putting a cream polish on. Same no brainer as all the other weak products you all are talking about. If your finish is falling on the tops it's done. If its a old oil finish from the factory it will wash off very easily with lacquer thinner.
My point is why don't you start fresh, with minimal prep and finish time. Instead of just applying more temporary fixes with diminishing results. All of which can seep into raw areas and stan irregular spots on the wood.
There is a reason that wood needs a finish and it's not just to make it look pretty. The finish protects the wood from drying out and cracking. In the case of wood with a substrate and a thin veneer glued to it, it's even more important. Not only does the finish fail so does the veneer. This is the point the veneer will crack, glue holding it will fail. Im sure you have seen this on other things in your life.
Now I know how dear your speakers are to you. Thats why I recommend the refining that I suggested. You will be able to live you life out and never do them again and the next generation will still be able to enjoy them.
Let me ask you this, How long has it been since you had the speakers and you did the last quick fix?
By the way.
The finish on the JBL's took about 6 hours over three days and the 6 hours is maybe high estimate.
You don't even need to pull your drivers as I had to.
First night
1) I washed of the factory oil finish with lacquer thinner until rags looked clean.
2) I did a light hand sanding with 180 grit paper.
Second Night (I brought home the materials)
3) I wiped on Mohawk Die Stain. ( It's reduced with lacquer thinner, Evaporates fast)(I stained because all the fading and it gives depth, otherwise not needed)
4) I wiped on Mohawk Pour-N-Wipe right after (It's a wipe on Poly finish) (4 hour dry time)
Third night
5) Padded with a red scotch-brite.
6) Wiped on second coat (Done after it drys)
Fourth night
Installed my drivers and listened to them.
I did all the work in my house with ventilation for the Lacquer thinner used. And of course protection laid out. I did mine during the week after work, but two days on the weekend will do the trick. I was going to put more coats on but they looked good to me so I left them. Besides I still needed to test if they worked right. You can alway apply other coats later at will anyway.
The finish on the JBL's took about 6 hours over three days and the 6 hours is maybe high estimate.
You don't even need to pull your drivers as I had to.
First night
1) I washed of the factory oil finish with lacquer thinner until rags looked clean.
2) I did a light hand sanding with 180 grit paper.
Second Night (I brought home the materials)
3) I wiped on Mohawk Die Stain. ( It's reduced with lacquer thinner, Evaporates fast)(I stained because all the fading and it gives depth, otherwise not needed)
4) I wiped on Mohawk Pour-N-Wipe right after (It's a wipe on Poly finish) (4 hour dry time)
Third night
5) Padded with a red scotch-brite.
6) Wiped on second coat (Done after it drys)
Fourth night
Installed my drivers and listened to them.
I did all the work in my house with ventilation for the Lacquer thinner used. And of course protection laid out. I did mine during the week after work, but two days on the weekend will do the trick. I was going to put more coats on but they looked good to me so I left them. Besides I still needed to test if they worked right. You can alway apply other coats later at will anyway.
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