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Why the disdain towards direct-drive TTs from some audiophiles?

Some people get too invested in their opinions. When one of those people is also someone who feels they need to be right and others therefore are wrong you get disdain toward those who have differing opinions. I view it as an inherent character flaw of those who make it their mission to down what other people like.
 
Direct Drive:
Have never used a Direct Drive TT as my TT at home. When I had my Radio Shack Franchise they offered many and I sold many. Retailers liked selling new Direct drives. They were virtually bulletproof and several years would pass between someone having brought one in for service.

Belt Drive:
Retailers also liked the easily swappable headshells. You sold lots of cartridges you would have never sold, on a deck without that feature. The lack of that feature on VPI turntables is why I won't buy another. But if they had that feature, their headshells would probably sell for $300-500. Don't get me wrong their TT's sound nice but the constant fleecing of their customers, with $1000+ Baloney Sandwich upgrades is quasi nauseous.

Idler Drive:
My Dual 1219 right now is my Daily Driver. I guess the biggest downer is it is 43 y.o.- Love the convenience of auto start and stop. I play more records in the winter so this feature is very welcomed this time of year. With a Shure M91 w/ Jico HE stylus it is a perfect combo IMO.

In conclusion, the Direct Drive I own is in the closet. The VPI Traveler is the first TT I have owned that the music comes out of total silence when the record starts. My Dual would be my main system TT if it had that trait.
 
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Interesting thoughts on the Dual idlers there 91r100gs. I've been snapping them up when they surface here. I'd agree they have a certain something that is fun and dynamic and not so clinical to listen to. I'm using M91ed, M95ed and Shure V15 III on a few I have- 1219, 1019 and 1218 are my favorites.
 
Bought my KAB modded Technics SL-1210Mk5 back in 04. The base model (used) sell's today (on Amazon) for twice what I paid for it new from KAB back then.

It's on it's fourth cartridge (upgrade) and has never been in the shop for repair since I owned it.

The sound has continually gotten better .. as I've upgraded my 2 ch stereo rig over the years. It's never sounded better than it does now.

The thing was really built like a tank IMHO.

I'll probably buy a high quality belt drive in the next few years .. for no other reason than the experience of trying something different before my Vinyl spinning days are over on this world … to quote English Philosophers Jager/Richards "Time waits for no one and it won't wait for me".
 
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Bought my KAB modded Technics SL-1210Mk5 back in 04. The base model (used) sell's for twice what I paid for it (on Amazon) new back then.

It's on it's fourth cartridge (upgrade) and has never been in the shop for repair since I owned it.

The sound has continually gotten better .. as I've upgraded my 2 ch stereo rig over the years. It's never sounded better than it does now.

The thing was really built like a tank IMHO.

.

Isn't it nice when a purchase you made years ago still passes along the benefits of upgrading around it. In my current system it has happened several times.
 
Isn't it nice when a purchase you made years ago still passes along the benefits of upgrading around it. In my current system it has happened several times.

For the longest time I preferred using either a TD-150Mk II or TD-160. Decades actually.. usually lived in a basement. But experiencing shaky floors currently has really changed my opinion about certain turntables. It's a good thing actually. I'm quite addicted to the better mid- level DD Technics tables right now. They just work with little fuss and are quiet and rock steady. I used to like fiddling around a lot more. But today it seems a bit tedious. I'd like to have a few quartz models like the Mk IIs.
 
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For the longest time I preferred using either a TD-150Mk II or TD-160. Decades actually.. usually lived in a basement. But experiencing shaky floors currently has really changed my opinion about certain turntables. It's a good thing actually. I'm quite addicted to the better mid- level Technics tables right now. They just work with little fuss and are quiet and rock steady. I used to like fiddling around a lot more.
Liked your last sentence a lot
 
I've only had one DD table that was noisy. And that was a Realistic LAB 500.
Motor noise along with pumping out enough sub sonic noise that it was unlistenable at bigher volumes. I tried everything except a subsonic filter.
I even tried a second one I picked up cheap years later. On the flip side the LAB 400 performed much better. The LAB 500 was the first DD table I used and soured me on them for some time.
 
I have only seen disdain towards ToTL direct drives turntables on a certain British forum where most members are Linn, Rega or Garrard users.

More knowledgeable and open-minded audiophiles tend to view ToTL Japanese direct drive turntables with respect.

When it comes to low-end direct drives, they are usually viewed with disdain because they're bad turntables, not because the underlying technology is bad.
 
I have only seen disdain towards ToTL direct drives turntables on a certain British forum where most members are Linn, Rega or Garrard users.

More knowledgeable and open-minded audiophiles tend to view ToTL Japanese direct drive turntables with respect.

When it comes to low-end direct drives, they are usually viewed with disdain because they're bad turntables, not because the underlying technology is bad.

Well this brit spots such illogical disdain from many forums and nationalities, sometimes belief bias can play a part of course.

As someone using a Rega as my main player I also champion the (low to mid $) Denon DDs as fine, very undervalued options. My bedroom player is a little Technics TP4 DD, horses for courses really. I agree some low end DDs were a bit nasty (a 80s hitachi a friend had comes to mind, horrible) though there were a few belt drive nasties as well. Don't get me going on the last days of Garrard, the stuff of nightmares..
 
There are audio enthusiasts who spend over $1000 on a pair of cables, or $5000 - $10,000 on a turntable, or Shakti Stones for $200 each. They all swear they can hear the difference.

If you don’t like DD TTs who cares? My attitude is.....OK, It’s your money. Believe and buy whatever you want.
 
Simplest explanation "anachrophilia" (ie: love of equipment of an earlier era) is alive and well in the audio hobby. Not much different from tubes vs SS.

Rumble in idler/belt driven is horizontal; vertical in DD but either can be engineered to "audiophile quality".

Generally speaking, it's more expensive to achieve the same performance specs with idler/belt drive than DD - pretty much the same applies to tubes and SS.
 
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My theory is as follows:

1. DD turntables are complex, and must be sold in a significant quantity to justify the high development cost, and the high cost of the tools required to make them.
2. Boutique high end turntables are not typically sold in very high quantities, thus making a very high development or tooling cost not economically viable. In fact, I can't think of a single high end turntable company who actually makes their own motors, let alone the amount of electronics a DD turntable requires.
3. Because of the two above points, high end direct drive turntables from boutique high end companies are an impractical product. Mass market companies with the economy of scale to support making DD turntables on the other hand tended to focus on the mass market, with more profitable high volume mid-fi products. Some statement type high end DD turntables did exist, and these are IMO holy grail type products, the likes of which we are unlikely to see again (Excepting the modern Technics line!)
4. As soon as the CD was introduced, it seems to me that a full stop was put on big companies spending money on developing better turntables, leaving the small boutique companies with their simple technology left as the only ones to carry the flame of high end turntables. For the rest of the 80s, mass market turntables were mostly shadows of their former selves, being relegated to "you can still play your old records" duty, rather than being the center of a system. I suspect these are the bad sounding direct drive units which really inspire prejudice.
5. Yeah, I really want a Nakamichi turntable some day!
 
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I have both DD and belt drive turntables. My sl1200 is the quieter of the two so it's my main table. But I like both. Never had an idler as yet.
 
I thought I would have to go DD to get silence between tracks. Both the Garrard Zero 100 and Dual 1225 idlers had a little rumble going (nothing catastrophic, but still there between tracks on higher volume levels).

Then I got the Lenco L75 serviced and upandrunning and it's silent as a church! Must be that vertical idler and the massive 4kg platter that does the magic (and that big a**ed massive vacuum cleaner grade motor is not vibration free either but the springed motor suspension takes it away). And yes, it's all stock. Haven't started the tweak craze yet :-).

But hey! If someone threw a SL1200 or a Dual701 my way would catch it. But man, the ones that turns up for sale here in Sweden are not cheap. Could probably get three Lencos for the price of one SL.
 
Relatively few direct drive turntables have been offered
e.g. without tonearm and/or with vacuum and/or with spring isolation and/or hardwood plinth.
Most direct drive turntable tonearms appear better suited to MM than MC cartridges.
While most belt drive tables are bundled with tonearms, they benefit from that tweak aura,
sort of like Chevy Nova owners got by buying from dealers that also sold Corvettes.
 
Let's please stay on topic.
Thanks,
Jim
 
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