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Why the hell won’t they give us meters?

elitopus said:
There are a few of us on the forum that use Ashly amps. A couple of the Altec boys got me into them.

Right now I have 17 pro amps (I think). It’s 7 Ashly’s, a couple Haflers, and a single SCS. The rest of the amps are not mosfet.

I don’t know anyone who repairs them. If they were newer maybe Ashly would? But I’m sure it would be expensive.
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It's an older amp. I think 90's.. Never thought to contact Ashly... I"ll look into that.. A repair would be cheaper than replacing it.. Thanks!
 
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I like meters but meters are a mechanical product and it's becoming harder and more expensive to build mechanical products, especially with tiny precision parts. The market for meters is disappearing and thus the number of suppliers shrinks and the price goes up. I like a lot of old obsolete tech, but it's not coming back.
 
tom67 said:
Ok, I will settle for the meters on inexpensive receivers of the 70s even if they are not that accurate. Yamaha sells this amp for $7,900 and I'm sure the owners like the meters. They also sell several other amps ranging from $300 to $800 that have no meters. All I'm suggesting is maybe they could make one with meters for say $900 for those of us who like the look. I have to agree with your points on better build quality for those who can afford them.View attachment 2740647
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Report back in 30 years, and let us know how that Yamaha is functioning. And ask if they can still service it or provide parts. For that money, or even a bit more, I'd prefer a used Bryston 4B which is around 10 years old, with another 15 years of warranty left. Yes, I know it doesn't have meters, but I know it will serve me reliably for my lifetime. And it's supported with that mindset. I am all about that Reliability. At $900, what would Yamaha have to go cheap on on an existing model without them? Meters cost money. LED meters is more doable on that price point. And less likely to cause the rest of that unit to suffer in ways you don't want.
 
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I feel like some people want to fight so hard against anything that isn’t about the sound. And yes, anything that doesn’t deal with the sound of your system is extra and unnecessary. Just like fancy veneer on speaker cabs, or a chrome plated amp chassis. But it does look nice....

Are meters necessary? No.

Do they look cool to some people? Yes.

Can they be a useful tool? I think so.

Does the fictional “measurements only crowd” love meters? Absolutely;)
 
similost said:
UUummmmmmmmmmmm.... uhhhhh.. weeeellllll.......... Not sure how to address that........... But I do know you need to get out more...
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From an engineering point of view, the tradeoffs for increased sensitivity hurt bass performance. This can be somewhat overcome by larger enclosures. I'm just not a fan of short coil/short gap drivers. While they may be punchy, control at lower frequencies is compromised. Nothing comes for free.
I used to love demoing this for people. Nothing like demolishing a pair of monster 15" CVs or the like with a 6" bookshelf speaker playing bass tones, then music. Output matching exposes much.
 
GChief said:
Good chance that is still a lie :idea:

I hang around a lot of fellow audiophools, most do not have meters that I have noticed... and I would have noticed those tacky things. It's bad enough some have the too many knob and switches having 70's receivers :no:
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I thought you had good taste based on your music preferences, but that's now suspect with this new revelation. Meters are cool. There, now it's settled :D.
 
hopeless said:
From an engineering point of view, the tradeoffs for increased sensitivity hurt bass performance. This can be somewhat overcome by larger enclosures. I'm just not a fan of short coil/short gap drivers. While they may be punchy, control at lower frequencies is compromised. Nothing comes for free.
I used to love demoing this for people. Nothing like demolishing a pair of monster 15" CVs or the like with a 6" bookshelf speaker playing bass tones, then music. Output matching exposes much.
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There is nothing wrong with larger cabinets.
 
hopeless said:
From an engineering point of view, the tradeoffs for increased sensitivity hurt bass performance. This can be somewhat overcome by larger enclosures. I'm just not a fan of short coil/short gap drivers. While they may be punchy, control at lower frequencies is compromised. Nothing comes for free.
I used to love demoing this for people. Nothing like demolishing a pair of monster 15" CVs or the like with a 6" bookshelf speaker playing bass tones, then music. Output matching exposes much.
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I don't know.. I'll put my 2 way 15's up against any 6" any day... They are in a 3' box.. so not a huge box, but not a bookshelf either... I wish I could remember where it really drops off, but it's DEEP.. well under 30hz... If you get them on an amp that's got some really good damping, they are some the of tightest drivers I've heard.. Then again, these aren't your every day 15's either... which just goes to say, every speaker is different, and a blanket statement of smaller is better is kinda weak..
 
I've always wanted to build one of these "sound meters"...
A Rubens Tube

I read an article in a magazine (Popular Science? Stereo Review?) many years ago about how to build one.
 
vinowino said:
EAR 834 No meters, no treble or bass, just a beautiful tube amp. Button on far right to turn on and off. Volume control next. Source knob. I hear just what the producer or engineer decided was best.
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I use old school amplification that has tone controls and though I rarely have occasion to set those controls to anything other than flat, I like the option to do so.Occasionally, I'll put on something that I feel could benefit from a bit of a bass boost or treble cut... I bet that amp sounds great though and if I was in the market for such a thing, a lack of tome controls wouldn't deter me from considering it. I might however get one of those little Schiit 4 band eq units to run with it though. I believe those things have a defeat type switch so that you can test if the eq thing is degrading the sound at all.
 
Sure pretty, but as I said, mechanical and prone to failure. They look nice on my Marantz power amps, but barely even move. And the one Marantz amp I got from an AK member, reported to work perfectly, had to have one rebuilt (not cheap). I also had a new CV 3200 amp and one of it's meters failed.

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I’ve never understood the appeal of VU meters on amps. I have always seen them as lipstick on a pig. The equipment they are on don’t measure up to Macs but they try to make an association visually. They remind you of McIntosh so they must be high quality right?

IMO meters only have two actual functions in hifi. First they are handy for setting bias current though a DVM works almost as well. My push pull amp has both bias meters and measuring points. I actually prefer setting the bias by current than by voltage. The second reason is quickly becoming less important as the years go by, setting recording levels. VU meters are nice for analog recording though I prefer peak level metering for digital recording.
 
isaacc7@cox. said:
I’ve never understood the appeal of VU meters on amps. I have always seen them as lipstick on a pig. The equipment they are on don’t measure up to Macs but they try to make an association visually. They remind you of McIntosh so they must be high quality right?

IMO meters only have two actual functions in hifi. First they are handy for setting bias current though a DVM works almost as well. My push pull amp has both bias meters and measuring points. I actually prefer setting the bias by current than by voltage. The second reason is quickly becoming less important as the years go by, setting recording levels. VU meters are nice for analog recording though I prefer peak level metering for digital recording.
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Like I said, I agree. I also liked the fins on a 59 Cadillac and a 57 Chevy and can’t explain why.
 
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