XRT20 Speaker System Restoration (and questions)

[onwardjames]

Velocityboat, I've got an Onkyo M504, but I realize that's insufficient. Also, I grew up foaming at the mouth looking at those Infinity IRS V's.

I'm more concerned with my tiny home. I really don't have the space for such a set of speakers, as my listening area is only 11 x 11.

I shot him an offer - My Echowars restored Sansui 9090db (he flips gear for a living) and 8 benjamins. A low-ball offer, some might say, but this baby clips at 161 wpc, and is a solid 8+ out of a 10, cosmetically.


This would be the SHOVE (not a push) that I need to stop dabbling in mid-fi, or good bang for the buck, or some crap I dragged home and restored mentality.

This would prod me to....gasp....use the room treatment my wife bought a year ago.

Selling my Vandersteen 2C's and those Polk SDA 1-B's would go a ways to funding this. I also have a full NHT Super Zero + sub + amp (all NHT) combo that I'd sell for 200 or so (and that stuff sounds AMAZING) plus TONS of other crap that needs a new home. Hell, I'd probably end up in the black, and empty my house of stuff.

Speakers sitting idle as of now -

RESTORED Yamaha NS-690 III's, RESTORED BA A150's (such a great speaker), the aforementioned Polks, several Pioneer receivers, gobs and gobs of other crap.

 

[c_dk]

In that size room you might have to disconnect 3 of the 4 woofers......

This is why we pleaded with Mac to design a scaled down line array, guys who wanted the big dog but did not have the room to install them.

The XRT-18s filled that need except for the boys need expensive toys syndrome.

 

[damacman]

Oh I don't know. The M504 isn't a bad amplifier at all. I think it would do just fine driving those XRT20s. Years ago, a friend drove his XRT20s with a McIntosh MC754 (75wpc and direct coupled) and he loved that combo. I drive my XRT22s with bridged MC2600s - but 99% of the time, the meters read lower than 6w per amp (equates to 12 wpc). Is 1.2kW/ch really necessary? I sometimes wonder . . . Your M504 adds over 10dB to that. Paul Klipsch was big on the first 10 Watts - and that's all one really needs with a pair of LaScalas or K-Horns.

I think part of the problem many AKers have, including myself, is that we take in audio gear like lost puppies. Always something to like. I've currently got $10,000 worth of amplifiers sitting un-used at the moment. Although I can't seem to find a way to part with any of them, I do often wonder - what's the point? Each of those amplifiers could be the centerpiece for someone to build a first class audio system around.

So, I like your idea. Get serious with a single pair of speakers and take the opportunity to move some other stuff out. If I weren't so damn weak, I'd do the same thing.

 

[c_dk]

The acoustics of a 11X11 room should be interesting. There will certainly be enough bass......unless where it cancels out due to room nodes is somehow pleasing.

I have had to do some interesting room voicing curves and I am sure this one would be verrrrrry interesting.

 

[Velocityboat]

Velocityboat, I've got an Onkyo M504, but I realize that's insufficient. Also, I grew up foaming at the mouth looking at those Infinity IRS V's.

I'm more concerned with my tiny home. I really don't have the space for such a set of speakers, as my listening area is only 11 x 11.

I shot him an offer - My Echowars restored Sansui 9090db (he flips gear for a living) and 8 benjamins. A low-ball offer, some might say, but this baby clips at 161 wpc, and is a solid 8+ out of a 10, cosmetically.


This would be the SHOVE (not a push) that I need to stop dabbling in mid-fi, or good bang for the buck, or some crap I dragged home and restored mentality.

This would prod me to....gasp....use the room treatment my wife bought a year ago.

Selling my Vandersteen 2C's and those Polk SDA 1-B's would go a ways to funding this. I also have a full NHT Super Zero + sub + amp (all NHT) combo that I'd sell for 200 or so (and that stuff sounds AMAZING) plus TONS of other crap that needs a new home. Hell, I'd probably end up in the black, and empty my house of stuff.

Speakers sitting idle as of now -

RESTORED Yamaha NS-690 III's, RESTORED BA A150's (such a great speaker), the aforementioned Polks, several Pioneer receivers, gobs and gobs of other crap.

What I would do is put Tweeter arrays outboard and lessen corner bass. Give yourself 9 inches from outer walls same as distance the CS20 uses to avoid cabinet reflection of tweeters. also angle speakers toed in. I run mine that way now in the bedroom. What I found myself doing is dumping excess power into mine in a smaller room to overcome bass room modes. The arrays can do that.

At low levels of a few what's they will be wonderful. Now turning them up you will want to address issues with room correction or get a bigger amp in the small room or your highs will muddy. Also get a thick padded rug six feet in front of those mids or you will get mid floor bounce. I ran mine with a Yamaha R2000 until I bought MC2500. Right now I run them with a PC2602. They do not need much power if you got Room Corrected Right.

The guy I bought my MC2500 from had XRT20s His upgrade speakers were Genesis 2s. An IRS V little cousin. You are definitely stepping up big time.

 

[Velocityboat]

Is 1.2kW/ch really necessary? I sometimes wonder . . .

Play some 1812 Overture on some XR290s like I did on 4th of July. Oh hell yeah. 2000 watt cannon blast and power guard limited. It's all in the dynamics. More exhilarating than lighting fireworks in the backyard.

And real symphony don't play here on the 4th.

 

[onwardjames]

The acoustics of a 11X11 room should be interesting. There will certainly be enough bass......unless where it cancels out due to room nodes is somehow pleasing.

I have had to do some interesting room voicing curves and I am sure this one would be verrrrrry interesting.

The room is the first room my back door opens into. Where I sit, there's no wall. You step UP into the kitchen, because my room was a concrete slab carport turned into a room. So, that lets sound at least have somewhere to go.

What I would do is put Tweeter arrays outboard and lessen corner bass. Give yourself 9 inches from outer walls same as distance the CS20 uses to avoid cabinet reflection of tweeters. also angle speakers toed in. I run mine that way now in the bedroom. What I found myself doing is dumping excess power into mine in a smaller room to overcome bass room modes. The arrays can do that.

At low levels of a few what's they will be wonderful. Now turning them up you will want to address issues with room correction or get a bigger amp in the small room or your highs will muddy. Also get a thick padded rug six feet in front of those mods or you will get mid floor bounce. I ran mine with a Yamaha R2000 until I bought MC2500. Right now I run them with a PC2602. They do not need much power if you got Room Corrected Right.

The guy I bought my MC2500 from had XRT20s His upgrade speakers were Genesis 2s. An IRS V little cousin. You are definitely stepping up big time.

I got the thick rug already, and yes, that's a necessity.

Also good to see your bolded line above. Kinda been thinking I am being silly with this, but jesus, as much as I love my 'sui, that Dolby board (currently working just fine, thank you) scares me, and if I DO NOT strive for better gear, I'll just keep dragging home more middle level stuff.

It's because I lusted after this as a child, and even now, it's so OBTAINABLE! So, this is truly the push I need to get out of that damn rut.

One last thing.......Ford Ranger pickup, or Honda Fit? I am not certain, even with the seats down, that the Fit can do it. The Ford ranger would mean 70 miles with 2k worth of speakers in the bed of the truck.


This is a MAJOR step for me (cashwise, and losing the 9090db, a gift from the wife, who is okay with it) so I really REALLY appreciate the comments, positive, negative and otherwise.

 

[onwardjames]

p.s. He accepted the offer.

 

[Velocityboat]

p.s. He accepted the offer.

Congratulations you will not regret this. Hopefully the owner did not drive them with an underpowered non power guard amp into clipping and all the tweeters are still intact. I had to replace 4 to get them going with the fifth eventually. I have the schematics if you want to PM me. If you can't source all tweeters quickly you can use a resistor for top tweeter like Roger does in XRT22 to get going.

If your room opens to back you are all set on bass modes. I hauled mine home with a set of XR19s 600 miles in a Tahoe. I would go the Ranger route and bring thick moving pads rent from Uhaul. Take the wood top and bottom caps off the arrays they have clips place in separate box. They are fragile and I had to glue a split one of mine I wrapped the arrays in cardboard then blankets. If you have a few half sheets of plywood works well to slide cabinets wrapped in moving blankets in and out of pickup bed. Use good racheting tie downs. Leave grilles on they are sturdy. Lie cabinets on back.

In two weeks you will have altered all your previous listening impressions of what you once knew about your music collection.

 

[eiraved]

Something to consider before using your pickup for transporting this investment. I sold a pair of Mach 1 speakers which the buyer transported 30 miles on the freeway in the open bed of a pickup. When he arrived home, the woofer foam was totally destroyed with some cone damage. The damage was wind caused, and he was not too pleased...


You might consider removing the woofers and keeping them in the cab with you, or at the very least wrapping the entire speaker tightly in the moving blanket before placing it in the bed.

 

[Velocityboat]

Oh I don't know. The M504 isn't a bad amplifier at all. I think it would do just fine driving those XRT20s. Years ago, a friend drove his XRT20s with a McIntosh MC754 (75wpc and direct coupled) and he loved that combo. I drive my XRT22s with bridged MC2600s - but 99% of the time, the meters read lower than 6w per amp (equates to 12 wpc). Is 1.2kW/ch really necessary? I sometimes wonder . . . Your M504 adds over 10dB to that. Paul Klipsch was big on the first 10 Watts - and that's all one really needs with a pair of LaScalas or K-Horns.

I think part of the problem many AKers have, including myself, is that we take in audio gear like lost puppies. Always something to like. I've currently got $10,000 worth of amplifiers sitting un-used at the moment. Although I can't seem to find a way to part with any of them, I do often wonder - what's the point? Each of those amplifiers could be the centerpiece for someone to build a first class audio system around.

So, I like your idea. Get serious with a single pair of speakers and take the opportunity to move some other stuff out. If I weren't so damn weak, I'd do the same thing.

Did your friend sell his XRT20s or keep them forever

 

[onwardjames]

Did your friend sell his XRT20s or keep them forever

Yeah, I wonder!

And velocityboat, what you said about "In two weeks you will have altered all your previous listening impressions of what you once knew about your music collection." = wow! That's going to be fun!

 

[damacman]

He traded them to my buddy Mike who had to have them. Mike sold them a few years later for reasons that he can't fathom today. He tried to buy them back but the guy wouldn't part with them. Mike has XR19s now.

 

[Velocityboat]

He traded them to my buddy Mike who had to have them. Mike sold them a few years later for reasons that he can't fathom today. He tried to buy them back but the guy wouldn't part with them. Mike has XR19s now.

Your buddy Mike must drool over your XRT22s. Even though XR19s are great and easier to integrate decor wise he probably still laments his decision. The XRTs make a statement in sound and size.

I feel I am not using the XR19s to their potential as rear surrounds. I either need to return them to the stack configuration or upgrade the HT processor to room perfect to fully appreciate them as they deserve. I would surely listen to more music in surround mode. Though the dream would be able to replace the XR19 woofers with the LD/HP woofers for full integration with XR290 too.

 

[onwardjames]

Well, the wife's grandma fell and broke her hip earlier in the week, so we may be having to postpone things. I have soft-sold the concept to the wife. She had initially given me the bartering chip (sansui 9090db that Echowars turned into a superbeast) and said "It's yours, do what you like" and meant it. So, I guess I'm good to do this.

Told the seller next weekend might be better. My bank has closed for the day, not sure I can pull 8 smackers out at once with an ATM.

 

[damacman]

Your buddy Mike must drool over your XRT22s. Even though XR19s are great and easier to integrate decor wise he probably still laments his decision. The XRTs make a statement in sound and size.

I feel I am not using the XR19s to their potential as rear surrounds. I either need to return them to the stack configuration or upgrade the HT processor to room perfect to fully appreciate them as they deserve. I would surely listen to more music in surround mode. Though the dream would be able to replace the XR19 woofers with the LD/HP woofers for full integration with XR290 too.

Mike is a k-horn nut. He's had two pairs in the same 15' x 15" room at one time! Whole different speaker. Man do they sound good in his room.

When Mike got the XRT20s, he set them up on either side of the fireplace - tweeter panels mounted to the wall and woofer cabs sitting outside them on the hearth. He played Seal "Killer" for me and I was gobsmacked. I had never heard a sound stage like that. It was my goal to one day own a pair. That was in '95 or so. It took me until 2015 to chase a pair down and they happened to be the 22s. Mike has never heard them as he still lives in AR and has not yet visited.

@onwardjames - best of luck and keep us posted. Sorry to hear of your wife's grandmother's incident - hope she'll be OK!

 

[onwardjames]

@damacman, thanks so much! I'm typing this in the spare bedroom, and I hear grandma all the way in here ON MY WIFE'S CELLPHONE. So, that tough old bird is doing pretty good.

Does anyone here think I'm foolish trading my Sansui 9090db and 8 bills for these?? I always do this before a major purchase, and the advice here has rarely steered me wrong.

 

[Velocityboat]

@damacman, thanks so much! I'm typing this in the spare bedroom, and I hear grandma all the way in here ON MY WIFE'S CELLPHONE. So, that tough old bird is doing pretty good.

Does anyone here think I'm foolish trading my Sansui 9090db and 8 bills for these?? I always do this before a major purchase, and the advice here has rarely steered me wrong.

I never owned Sansui gear. I had a GF whose brother owned a 9090 with som L100 JBLs. It was nice but can't touch a pair of XRT20s driven by anything. Quit second guessing.

Good to hear you wife's grandma is getting along. My mom sailed through a hip surgery and was tearing up the dance floor at my nieces wedding six months later.

 

[onwardjames]

I never owned Sansui gear. I had a GF whose brother owned a 9090 with som L100 JBLs. It was nice but can't touch a pair of XRT20s driven by anything. Quit second guessing.

Good to hear you wife's grandma is getting along. My mom sailed through a hip surgery and was tearing up the dance floor at my nieces wedding six months later.

Thank you, sir! Went to see her last night, she was full tilt a-talking!

Lord, when that woman finally does go to her reward, they'll have to beat her tongue to death with a stick.

I was to pick the speakers up today, but came to realize that there was no way in hell they were gonna go in my wife's Honda Fit. So, I contacted seller and we agreed next weekend I'll rent a cargo van. It's about a 90 mile drive one way, and I wasn't too keen on non-refoamed woofers blowing in the breeze at 65 mph with my pickup.

Can anyone here measure how wide these are when set up? I know the bass cabs are 39'', the tweeter towers are 10.75'', and they are about a foot apart when bolted together.

I only have 11 feet of width, and am getting a bit concerned.

 

[gmc]

Lucky for you, you misread the specs. The bass cabinets are 39-1/4" high, but only 25-1/2" wide.