Zilch's AK Design Collaborative - Econowave Speaker

[Steve O2]

Thanks the bass is good, but the mid bass on up is awesome

These really sound a lot better than they did:thmbsp:

CV shorted these in the mid and tweeter department compared to the same era 15" model RE 38...

Here's a couple pic's of my new room Im setting up

I just got started in here, Im gonna try a lot of different arrangements...

Those model 313's with the side by side horns just came in, they may be next in line:scratch2:

I can EQ and adjust phase and delay seprately on each speaker:yes:

 

[Steve O2]

For the $75.00 I paid for those and the price of admission to the E wave I think Im hooked

I just picked these up for $60.00

Here's a link to pics including the guts...

http://www.audiokarma.org/forums/showthread.php?p=3200398#post3200398

The woofer runs full range with those little horns so I think it would run good with the E wave:scratch2:

 

[Zilch]

With Cerwin Vega RS-30 eWaves, Steve O2 is "Official E'Waver #79!"

http://audiokarma.org/forums/showthread.php?p=2260584#post2260584

And as is the case with many builders, another eWave project is already on the boards.... :thmbsp:

 

[Russellc]

Thanks the bass is good, but the mid bass on up is awesome

These really sound a lot better than they did:thmbsp:

CV shorted these in the mid and tweeter department compared to the same era 15" model RE 38...

Here's a couple pic's of my new room Im setting up

I just got started in here, Im gonna try a lot of different arrangements...

Those model 313's with the side by side horns just came in, they may be next in line:scratch2:

I can EQ and adjust phase and delay seprately on each speaker:yes:

So how does it compare to your other CVs?

Russellc

 

[Steve O2]

It images better than any of them:yes:

And it is WAY better than the stock RE 30...

Even with only one of em on it fools me into thinking there's more speakers on

The CLSC 215 is almost as good in that aspect.

For sheer volume and "dynamics" The CLSC 215's, CLS 215's, and RE 38's seem just a little more comfortable at max SPL. And I mean very little...

The E wave's will run all the way up to clipping at 600 watts per channel, but they seem to be happier with 300 watts per channel...

The big CV's are happy with 600-1200 WPC...

The D220ti has a little sizzle to it none of my other speakers have.

I have the Selenium D2500ti-nd driver Im gonna use that in my other pair of
RE 30's , it has a warmer mid range...

I'll be able to make a quick A-B comparison then:yes:

In this new room so far I can run with absolutely no EQ (but I have played with delay and phase adjustments) and it sounds better than my old smaller room

Im running 12 15" and 4 12" woofers here and I like to play em loud :nutz:

I have a Behringer mic preamp on the way, I want to try using REW...

 

[MWalt]

Good God! Ya got a real "rock wall" going there.

 

[Steve O2]

Actually mostly country these days

I watch a lot of movies, this is a 7.1 surround setup, I like to feel like Im there:yes:

My other pair will be the center channel

 

[juniorJBL]

Has there been a comparison between the B&C and a JBL 2426? Yes the JBL is about twice the price but just wondering.

 

[donprice]

Eminence Kappalite 3015 - crossover tweaks?

I've got a pair of the Eminence Kappalite 3015 15" drivers (PE # 290-597) on the way. ~5 ft^3 ported boxes...should be thunderous in the HT.

The response curve (attached) shows a 3-4 dB bump between ~1100 and 2200 Hz. I've got the parts to build the "standard >95 dB" crossover. Any suggestions on tweaking the crossover, perhaps like the mod for the LE14, to smooth out the LF-HF transition? I understand the we are starting with 1200Hz low pass to get the 1600 Hz acoustic crossover so I don't think there is much fixin' to be done but I would appreciate another opinion.

Similarly, I've got one of the 10" Deltalites (PE # 290-591) to play with for a center channel or possible surrounds. Same question...

I need to find the frequency analyzer gadget for rent somewhere...

Of course once I get this all worked out it will be time to upgrade to the B&C drivers :scratch2:

Thanks guys!

Don

 

[Zilch]

Has there been a comparison between the B&C and a JBL 2426? Yes the JBL is about twice the price but just wondering.

I measured JBL 2425/6 H and J earlier in this thread, and Widget and I did it with the eWaveguide years ago on LHF, along with 2418H-1.

It had "potential." :tongue:

The response curve (attached) shows a 3-4 dB bump between ~1100 and 2200 Hz. I've got the parts to build the "standard >95 dB" crossover. Any suggestions on tweaking the crossover, perhaps like the mod for the LE14, to smooth out the LF-HF transition?

There's no way to know 'til you build it. Measurement's the easiest way to get the answer, but you can try different component values in the lowpass if you perceive there's an issue.... :yes:

 

[juniorJBL]

I measured JBL 2425/6 H and J earlier in this thread, and Widget and I did it with the eWaveguide years ago on LHF, along with 2418H-1.

Was that in the Q & D thread?

 

[Sir.Byrd]

Well I finally got around to finishing my Cerwin Vega Re 30 E waves
It all fit really nice, the crossover screwed right on the back terminal where the old one was. It still has the fuse too:yes:
The L pad fits perfect in the hole where the tweeter was, and the grills still fit

These work as advertised, I just got these done and Im already planning a bigger better version

Thanks to all the people here for coming up with such a cool DIY project that really makes an average speaker into a great one

Why not find a way to directly connect the wires coming from the stock binding posts directly to the circuit board? No sense having two sets of binding posts in one speaker.

 

[Zilch]

Was that in the Q & D thread?

No, a Widget "Comparison" thread.

I likely linked it from Q&D; check the table of contents....

 

[Tube King]

I know the feeling. I have NEVER seen vintage cabinets like what some of the guys here come up with. Where I live, nobody has, and probably never had the space for them. So some traveling is required to find those things.

I have a suggestion. Did you see the nice job Jackgiff did on finishing the PE Trapezoidal Box Kit? And those nice retro legs he made for them? I think some efficient 12" woofers from Eminence or the B&Cs Jack used, will work in that box size, ported. The trade off is no low bass, but that's high efficiency.
http://www.audiokarma.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=176119&d=1256602425

skywave-rider,
Thanks for the information! Those look great! Compact enough that my wife will approve … however I just got clearance that the JBL’s zilch provided were “small enough”. If I can afford to build them, I will. If not the “kit” speakers may be on the way. Again, EXCELLENT recommendation.

The high-efficiency crossover variant will accommodate woofers up to 100 dB/1 watt. That's an extremely efficient woofer.

Good to know. I suppose I can purchase the crossover board and necessary parts from you? PM me with information on how to get started with my order. Once I decide on a woofer I’ll place the order.

Designer's choice, really. There are large and small high-efficiency woofers. The typical range used for eWaves is 8" - 12" diameter. The standard eWaveguide is 12" wide, which establishes a minimum baffle width somewhat wider than that. Some are also building with the 6" square waveguide, allowing a smaller form factor.

The JBL C36’s are just the style I’m looking for. You really know classy when you see it.

Now we get down to it. If you want to maximize the bass response from an efficient woofer in a reasonable-size box, that virtually mandates a ported alignment. One way to develop a "feel" for what is required is to look at the recommended enclosures and tuning for the various drivers you might consider in the Parts Express woofer selection guide:

http://www.parts-express.com/resources/woofer-selection-guide.cfm

The printed version of that chart in the PE catalog includes port lengths and diameters.

There, you see there are few woofers with efficiencies higher than 90 dB/1W. If you want to build using a woofer with efficiency higher than 95 dB/1W, you must almost of necessity move up to more expensive pro sound woofers.

Your link doesn’t work for me. What does JBL have that will satisfy my needs? Remember, 12w, able to rock out to Zep, mellow out to Norah Jones, and be dynamic enough for the classical standards. I’m also looking for something that will please my son and his Raffi cd’s. :lmao:

That's where they are, basically, though it may take some patience and determination to find them. Another option is to do what was commonly done in the "vintage" years, build the cabinets yourself. Three or four of us are enjoying our eWaves in JBL C36 cabinets built according to these plans:

http://www.lansingheritage.org/html/jbl/plans/c35-c39.htm

Here's mine:

http://www.audiokarma.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=82897&d=1205613414

GEORGOUS! Now let’s see if I can afford to build them!

PS: Where did you put the port?

 

[Zilch]

Your link doesn’t work for me.

It's the PE Woofer Selection Guide, same as is in the catalog. Look at DC300-8, 90.5 dB, and doesn't sacrifice bass to do it:

http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?Partnumber=295-320

Is it 12 watts total, or 12 per channel you have?

PS: Where did you put the port?

No ports on that one 'cause it's acoustic suspension closed box. There's plenty of room on the baffle for a pair of 2" or larger diameter ports.... :yes:

 

[Steve O2]

Why not find a way to directly connect the wires coming from the stock binding posts directly to the circuit board? No sense having two sets of binding posts in one speaker.

I could have soldered the wires from the stock speaker terminals right to the circuit board but this was easy...

I guess I was in a hurry to get em done and I didn't feel like warming up the soldering iron

 

[Tube King]

It's the PE Woofer Selection Guide, same as is in the catalog. Look at DC300-8, 90.5 dB, and doesn't sacrifice bass to do it:

http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?Partnumber=295-320

Is it 12 watts total, or 12 per channel you have?

No ports on that one 'cause it's acoustic suspension closed box. There's plenty of room on the baffle for a pair of 2" or larger diameter ports.... :yes:

12 per channel, aka 12w per amp.

 

[Zilch]

12 per channel, aka 12w per amp.

Those DC300-8 woofers are higher than normal efficiency, and I believe they will do fine.

Member RayW can calculate the actual SPL for you, but I don't think you'll need more than 3 of those 12 watts to play plenty loud in a normal room.... :thmbsp:

 

[Tube King]

Those DC300-8 woofers are higher than normal efficiency, and I believe they will do fine.

Member RayW can calculate the actual SPL for you, but I don't think you'll need more than 3 of those 12 watts to play plenty loud in a normal room.... :thmbsp:

With that woofer and the Selenium D220Ti-8 driver I would be building a 4ohm crossover correct?

 

[Zilch]

With that woofer and the Selenium D220Ti-8 driver I would be building a 4ohm crossover correct?

No, you'll be building the standard 8-Ohm crossover. The drivers are playing in different passbands; they are not in parallel electrically except at the crossover frequency, where they are both rolled off by the filters.... :yes: