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Antiskate force , what is yours

Antiskate force at setting at 2, for 2 gram VTF

  • 0.14 gram or less

    Votes: 7 24.1%

  • 0.15-0.18

    Votes: 5 17.2%

  • 0.19-0.22

    Votes: 4 13.8%

  • 0.23-0.26

    Votes: 7 24.1%

  • 0.27-0.3

    Votes: 2 6.9%

  • 0.31-0.34

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • 0.35-0.38

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • 0.39-0.42

    Votes: 1 3.4%

  • 0.43 or more

    Votes: 6 20.7%
  • Total voters
    29
S

Sleiven

Active Member
img_8857-jpeg.1153428

I found that the antiskate force is different on each turntable I have. This also makes the results vary when trying to use the blank disk method for setting AS, So a survey comparing settings on a nominal value if 2 ( supposedly match with a VTF of 2 gram)

What numbers do you get?
It will show what force and relation to VTF designers use, 10-15% can be expected, so 0.2-0.3 gram side force may be typical
 
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On my Rega RB300 it is usually around 0.25-1g, with a cartridge set at 1.90g tracking force. But these Rega anti-skating dials are notoriously inaccurate.

On a Grace 707, it is set around 1g, for a cartridge running at 1.80g TF.

Anti-skate is set using the HiFi News test lp, then dialed back a bit as per the Soundsmith guy’s recommendation.
 
One TT has a linear arm so no need of anti skating. The Fat Boy arm I set using modulated grooves on my Ortofon test record for best tracking with out listenable distortion at 2 grams with my Dynavector 20 X 2 cartridge. The Linear arm has the XX-2 mk II.

Question how much of what you measured is pivot friction?
 
Sorry, didn’t read thoroughly.

My Grace finally stabilized at around 0.24g. It initially read 0.12 and increased over about ten seconds until it seems to have stabilized and maxed out at 0.24g.
Did yours increase over a similar time frame?

EDIT: I took my sticky rubber Music Mat off and let the stylus slide on a Rega glass platter which I have stacked on top of my Lenco platter.


IMG_9064.jpeg
 
The arm should be balanced to float lowest point 2-3mm above platter so nothing is touching but the contact with the scale , put on a Stylus guard or MM users may remove stylus to be safe

Force may vary a bit across platter position , try more than once and do an average if you want
 
Is it just the photograph, or are the nuts and bolts attaching the cartridge to the Hitachi headshell at an angle?
And what is the lump on the Grace headshell? And why so much dust? I am assuming that the Grace is mounted at the normal distance and it is now set up for Baerwald or Logren - the cartridge is far forward in the headshell.
 
twiiii said:
Question how much of what you measured is pivot friction?
Click to expand...
Bearing friction is often expressed in mg, a small fraction of skating force. I think it's fair to ignore it but it's a good idea to average several bumps into the platform. I would say if the variance between bumps is much more than 10% that maybe the bearings need adjustment.
 
doctor fuse said:
EDIT: I took my sticky rubber Music Mat off and let the stylus slide on a Rega glass platter which I have stacked on top of my Lenco platter.
Click to expand...
Skating force is a function of the friction between the stylus and the groove as well as the offset of the tonearm pivot. Stylus sliding on glass is not the same skating force as in a record groove. Some have pointed out that skating force is also a function of the groove aggressiveness (volume/pitch). Diminishing returns at some point.
 
Blackdog61 said:
Zero. I haven’t had a tonearm with AS in years and don’t miss it.
Click to expand...

Arms intended for pro use were subjected to frequent back cueing to line up tracks. Normal skating pulls the arm towards the label, but when back cueing it's the opposite, it pulls the arm out towards the edge. Since AS does that as well, the problem is worsened, so most arms intended for pro use don't use AS. That doesn't make it a virtue as the stylus and record will wear faster on the left channel. This is of little consequence to an organization with a budget for frequent stylus and record replacement. We at home don't usually have that luxury.
 
Mathematical the skating force is u* VTF*sin( offset ange+ tracking error)

Where U is friction factor , about 0.3, VTF say 2 grams , and Sin(22) for a Technics arm gives 0.375: which gives 0.23 gram , or about 11 % if VTF. Some report friction factor if 0.4 which gives 15%..

On my Fisher MT-6330 and AS 2 I measure 0.24g with VTF scale and get 0.23 g when using my homemade Wally Skater
IMG_8916.jpeg

Here is the math if someone want to make their own
1761065909722-png.1154202
 
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For someone not mathematically gifted, there's Pete Riggle's model:
 

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ripblade said:
Arms intended for pro use were subjected to frequent back cueing to line up tracks. Normal skating pulls the arm towards the label, but when back cueing it's the opposite, it pulls the arm out towards the edge. Since AS does that as well, the problem is worsened, so most arms intended for pro use don't use AS. That doesn't make it a virtue as the stylus and record will wear faster on the left channel. This is of little consequence to an organization with a budget for frequent stylus and record replacement. We at home don't usually have that luxury.
Click to expand...

I thought I read (Peter Lederman?) saying too much antiskate causes wear on the Left channel, and too little causes wear on the Right channel?
 
ripblade said:
For someone not mathematically gifted, there's Pete Riggle's model:
Click to expand...
I don’t understand this one.any link ?Length of arm does not matter in my force equation , maybe his force is referenced elsewhere than the tip of the arm. The first line gives 7.9% side force not 1/4.. something about the definitions I do not get right/understand
 
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