• The move to the new server is done. There are some software and database maintenance updates in process. This has us passing the hat around to help out. We appreciate any donations. Seriously, even a dollar helps. The payment page may be found here - https://www.audiokarma.org/support.html

CAT-5 interconnects - Anyone done it?

Hi Redboy: In recent years I must have made no less than 50 pairs of CAT-5 interconnects using all sorts of RCA connectors. I also obtained some CAT-6 but I have not constructed anything from the stock as yet. Most of my wire I obtained very cheaply as used LAN cable.

The stuff to get if possible is CAT-5 Plenum because it has a Teflon insulation. But any CAT cable is cool because it is good copper, and most CAT-5 is solid strand. I HAVE seen it in multi strand. In fact I have some. There maybe some naysayers that say this is NOT CAT-5, but it says so on the sheathing.

As for the sound: great. I've been very, very pleased.

The downside: having a complicated assortment of components means a lot of wires running all hither and thither. Keeping CAT-5 twisted pair interconnects dressed and untangled is a nightmare. (In addition, they can be fragile and I might suggest filling the RCA plug-end with epoxy.) So as a result, I have been replacing most of my interconnects with sheilded microphone wire, and other interesting stuff I dig up at a shop supplying some of Sendai's telecommunications industry.

But I have to say, a simple CAT-5 twisted pair straight up, no sheath or cover makes an excellent performer.
 
lorne said:
But I have to say, a simple CAT-5 twisted pair straight up, no sheath or cover makes an excellent performer.
Click to expand...
There you have it! Proof of concept, and proof I'm not the only one in this camp. Thanks lorne!

I've got some multi-strand CAT-5 floating around, too. I was surprised when I first came across it. Can't think of a good use for it, but I'm hanging onto it.

The pair I made is on loan to doucanoe. I'm hoping he'll weigh in on this once he's had a chance to play with them.

What's the Teflon insulation do for the cable? Why is that a good thing?
 
teflon in plenum Cat5

Correct me if I'm wrong...

Plenum Cat5 accommodates fire regulations (normal cat5 insulation will release a poisonous gas, chlorine I think, when it burns). Teflon provides insulation without killing anyone if its fumes get in the ventilation system.

Also, I believe, Teflon insulation provides a tighter bend radius.

A excerpt from: http://www.elec-toolbox.com/communications/classifications/cat5/about.htm

"Most Cat 5 cable uses PVC (polyvinyl chloride) insulation, but plenum cables intended to be installed in spaces that handle environmental air use more expensive fluorinated ethylene propylene (FEP) also known as Teflon."

That may not necessarily be the reason "lorne" recommends the plenum Cat5.
 
Teflon is a better insulator (higher dielectric constant) AND the chlorine (more likely, HCl) from PVC is just as bad for copper as it is for us :-(
 
That may not necessarily be the reason "lorne" recommends the plenum Cat5.
Click to expand...
Your right. My thinking was along the lines of mhardy6647. As soon as something is added to straight-wire, it no longer acts as straight wire-due to capacitance/inductance. And then there is chemical interaction. I've never been very concerned about these things. I've come to think that (at least for my electronics) there are bigger fish to catch than the ones I may be casting for in tweakery. But that's just me. The main thing about CAT-5 is it's cheap, it rejects some nasties due to its twisted construction, and the copper is excellent. In it's raw form it doesn't look very sexy. And it is dfficult to keep from being a rat's nest. Other than that, I think it's a no-brainer for enthusiasts on a tight budget like me.
 
OK, I brewed up a set with the deadwaxcafe recipe. Neutrik connectors, basic cat5, hand wrapped teflon tape with a foil/tinned copper shield wrap and another layer of tef tape. Shield connected to COM at one end only. Finished off with a cloth cover and some heatshrink at the ends.

Compared to the Phillips RCA's (about $16 at your local Wally World), these cat5's have a definite advantage. Cleaner, more "air" (made the room sound bigger), reduced some midrange mud we didn't realize was there.

Comparison tests conducted at Fotno's with Marantz CDP, Yamaha CR-2020, and AR-3's. Some cuts we listened to had a higher benefit than others, so there's obviously a lot of variables in play. For the baseline of time/expense, these are well worth building if you are still using the "came with my dvd player" cables.

My 2¢.

<EDIT: Just for the record, also homebrew braided cat5 speaker wires using three twisted pairs. Speaker connects are 3', interconnects are 3'.>
 
Last edited:
Okay oz, now you've got to cook up a pair by my recipe and put them to the test! It'll take you five minutes. Use one twisted pair. No wrapping, no ironing, no shielding, no fancy stuff. Just strip, solder, and plug 'em in. Let us know what you think!
 
Been reading this thread and while I don't want to rain on anyone's parade, I thought I'd correct a factual error I've seen mentioned a few times. With audio interconnects we are talking about unbalanced circuits, meaning a single signal traveling one direction and a ground. Twisted pairs will not reduce noise in unbalanced circuits. On the other hand, when noise hits balanced circuits, which have a positive and negative signal, the twisted wires will enable the noise to cancel itself out.

I have found that for my line level connections (not turntables), unshielded cable works fine. But that just means I don't have EMI invading the cable--the twisting accomplishes nothing noisewise.
 
hakaplan said:
Been reading this thread and while I don't want to rain on anyone's parade...
Click to expand...
It's OK Howard, I've got my umbrella! :D

Now I'm curious - what is the improvement if RF rejection is not required? Would I reap a bigger benefit if I moved them between the pre and main amps?

Or is the only benefit the therapeutic effects of the handicraft involved in making them? <Which would be OK too, still time well spent... :D>
 
Squidward said:
In all seriousness, if you can get away without a shielded cable for a particular application, you're better off. At the very least, the shielding can cause increased capacitance in a cable.

Experiment on!
Click to expand...


hey-Hey!!!,
Squidward is right about the capacitance thing. I've had some small coax that was a really nice string capacitor. The CAT5 in plenum rated TFE insulation is some nice stuff. Three strands in a braid works slightly better than a single twisted pair around my system. Maybe a more radical twist...:)

Do some experiments, and judge for yourself. Make it at least a single blind, and record results. Then run the tests open....:)
cheers,
Douglas
 
ozmoid said:
It's OK Howard, I've got my umbrella! :D

Now I'm curious - what is the improvement if RF rejection is not required? Would I reap a bigger benefit if I moved them between the pre and main amps?

Or is the only benefit the therapeutic effects of the handicraft involved in making them? <Which would be OK too, still time well spent... :D>
Click to expand...
Todd, admittedly I haven't done A/B testing with Cat5, just tried some old unshielded cable and found that there was no noise and it sounded no worse than anything else.

I have a Cat5 cable sitting here that I've hesitated to cut up because it has ethernet connectors on both ends--and it's one of those things you think you might need later on for the computer. But now I simply must conduct a test. Keep that umbrella handy. :D
 
Redboy, I've used the Cat 5 for speaker wire and for speaker box connects with good results. I've yet to use it for interconnects. I have some RCA connectors and some fancy shielded interconnect wire that I was going to use for interconnects. Would you like to try a pair to compare with your other cables? Drop me a PM.
 
westend said:
Redboy, I've used the Cat 5 for speaker wire and for speaker box connects with good results. I've yet to use it for interconnects. I have some RCA connectors and some fancy shielded interconnect wire that I was going to use for interconnects. Would you like to try a pair to compare with your other cables? Drop me a PM.
Click to expand...
I'm just curious, what is the shielded cable you intend to use?
 
hakaplan said:
TI have a Cat5 cable sitting here that I've hesitated to cut up because it has ethernet connectors on both ends...
Click to expand...
:yikes: Don't cut up your cable!! With the ends on that stuff is danged expensive - they'll cut you whatever you want at Lowes or Home Despot. The "plain" is around .18 per foot, the "Plenum Grade" (already teflon covered) is about $1 more per foot. For $3 and change, you can get 3' of Plenum Grade which will yield 4 interconnects 3' long.
 
hakaplan said:
I'm just curious, what is the shielded cable you intend to use?
Click to expand...
It is Tiff Electronics Co., USA, #IC2. The Co. was recently bought out by Esoteric Audio. They make wire like these. The IC2 wire is two jacketed conductors inside a copper shield, covered with a teflon layer. The connectors I was going to use for these are Streetwires, USA ZN 5.0 goldplated, threaded base :these. The wire and connectors are something I found in my car audio days. The car audio gear is pretty robust and usually has very low inductance because of all the 12v. hash present in the typical vehicle install.
 
I snagged a couple hundred feet of Cat 5 last week at a garage sale, so I see some interconnects and speaker wires i nmy future. Once I get caught up with everything else....................
 
I pick up the scraps at work whenever I see 'em running networking cable. "Scraps" are typically the 1000 ft payout boxes with 75 feet or so of plenum-grade cable in 'em. I do believe I have a lifetime supply.

Free tip: Cat5 interconnects and speaker cables make, IMNSHO, excellent party favors when attending hi-fi get-togethers.
 
I made a 6' set of unshielded, Cat5e plenum cable terminated with generic all metal, gold plated RCA connectors (the kind with the relief springs). I use 6' because all of my other test cables are 6' and differences will be more audible. I used these between a Pioneer PD-M650 CD player and a Yamaha CR-2040 receiver using Sennheiser HD-595 headphones.

I was comparing them to various Belden shielded coax cables, all with capacitance hovering between 16 and 17pf/Ft. The Cat5e measured 12.5/Ft. Also tested was the ever popular Canare L4E6S star quad. It was wired as prescribed with the ground and shield tied only at one end and measured 63pF/ft. For kicks I threw in some other coax, one only three feet, but 70/Ft, the other a six footer at 90/ft.

The result: The Cat5e was ever so slightly better in clarity and high end, than the Belden cables, which all sounded about the same. Coming in third was the short 70pF cable, followed by the Canare, and then the 90pF. These were not huge differences, but all were consistent with amounts of capacitance. The higher the capacitance, the more noticeable the degradation in sound. The difference between the Cat5e and the Belden was very small and at 3' it would be even smaller. I had to listen many times over to different music to pick up the difference.

If you have any doubts as to what I've said about twisted cable being worthless for noise rejection in unbalanced circuits just plug them into a turntable and see what happens. All of the cable above were tested between a PL-630 turntable wired with RCA jacks and a Yamaha preamp. None of the shielded cable hummed at all. The unshielded Cat5e was so noisy that when you touched the cable with your fingers you could hear that noise magnified in the headphones over and above the already awful hum. Also as predicted based on capacitance, the Belden low capacitance cable sounded the best. The Cat5e might have beat it, but with all the noise there was no way to tell. And I honestly don't understand the hoopla over the Canare. It is okay, but hardly stellar.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom