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Empire Thread of Inductance & Resistance for 2000 style bodies

DCR for some of my ECs:
2000E/III = 1216 / 1232 ohms
2000E/III = 1243 / 1237
2000E = 511 / 539
66QE/X = 527 / 525
122X/EN = 515 / 527
2202E/H = 530 / 549
1000ZE/X = 723 / 711
OP5 = 773 / 777
 
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Here's data on my Empire cartridges:

Resistance Inductance
Model Right Left Right Left
66 E/X 528 531 337 342
1000 SE/X 532 521 303 317
3003 EEE 518 508 327 334
2000 E 1074 1085 605 591
2000 E/III 1021 1033 518 508
 
jbjsr said:
DCR for some of my ECs:
2000E/III = 1216 / 1232 ohms
2000E/III = 1243 / 1237
2000E = 511 / 539
66QE/X = 527 / 525
122X/EN = 515 / 527
2202E/H = 530 / 549
1000ZE/X = 723 / 711
OP5 = 773 / 777
Click to expand...

The 2000E 511/539 this is why you have to measure everything in the empire blob family and a good idea for everything else if you don’t recognize the model or you just want to double check. I’m glad you measured & posted this and now you know.

Empire should have shipped every blob cart with a spare pair of 66e & 2000e stickers to just label it yourself.
 
Ok, I cannot be exact so I will give a list of my Empire cart resistance from memory.
-2000 (looped zeros) E/III 1100 ohms
All of the following are in the low to mid 500 ohm range
-66 E/X
-5000 MK I
-EXL 20
-2000 E/II (am I the only one on earth who has a II?)
-Silver blob that has a clear sticker on it, but marks are worn off. Looks just like my 66 otherwise.
 
Brent Justin said:
Ok, I cannot be exact so I will give a list of my Empire cart resistance from memory.
-2000 (looped zeros) E/III 1100 ohms
All of the following are in the low to mid 500 ohm range
-66 E/X
-5000 MK I
-EXL 20
-2000 E/II (am I the only one on earth who has a II?)
-Silver blob that has a clear sticker on it, but marks are worn off. Looks just like my 66 otherwise.
Click to expand...
2000 E/ii is just the stylus used for the same 2000 e/xxx body. One step
Down from the e/iii. If your 2000 e/ii is in the 500 ohm range then it is not really a 2000 body cart but a mismarked 66 body cart. Hope this helps.
 
desertrat748 said:
2000 E/ii is just the stylus used for the same 2000 e/xxx body. One step
Down from the e/iii. If your 2000 e/ii is in the 500 ohm range then it is not really a 2000 body cart but a mismarked 66 body cart. Hope this helps.
Click to expand...
I thought of it being mismarked, however it is a gold body just like my 2000/III and my 5000 MKI. Weird... As an avid vintage collector of TT and carts I have seen countless 2000 E and 2000 E/III, but mine is the only II I have ever seen. And I don't know that I have ever run across a I. I would speculate that most people in the 70's either bought an E or an E/III.
 
Brent Justin said:
I thought of it being mismarked, however it is a gold body just like my 2000/III and my 5000 MKI. Weird... As an avid vintage collector of TT and carts I have seen countless 2000 E and 2000 E/III, but mine is the only II I have ever seen. And I don't know that I have ever run across a I. I would speculate that most people in the 70's either bought an E or an E/III.
Click to expand...

If you can measure inductance , it would help w subtle differences. Walt has figured out a lot about them.
 
desertrat748 said:
If you can measure inductance , it would help w subtle differences. Walt has figured out a lot about them.
Click to expand...
Which meter do you reccomend to buy to measure inductance on phone carts?

I would like to start measuring my carts. And I own perhaps 200 cart units.
 
desertrat748 said:
If you can measure inductance , it would help w subtle differences. Walt has figured out a lot about them.
Click to expand...
My meters do not have that feature, but someday I may get one that does. I am good for now though and know about all I need to know to make these wonderful cartridges sound their best.
Now to shift the focus a little I have a 500 LTD that needs a stylus. I have never actually tried it out. Is it on the same level as the "blob" cartridges and are there any decent styli out there just to give it a fair try?
 
The meter mentioned above comes in different colors and under different Mfg. names.

I have two Fluke meters and 2 analog meters and none of them have an inductance scale. So I bought one of these.
 
Brent, does your 2000 E/II have a transparent light blue stylus grip? That's the original stylus color.

And, as far as the inductance differences with the 2000E series. I still wonder if some of the bodies were mismarked or if Empire started with these at the lower inductance and changed them to high inductance in later units. My earlier 2000 E/III with a separate metal stylus guard has the lower inductance and my later one with a flip down guard has the higher inductance.

I don't remember if we ever discussed that was a definitive factor to decide one way or the other.

When buying an inductance meter, look to see what the test frequency is as the standard is 1kHz. Walt stated this before but I also think he indicated it probably doesn't make a lot of difference for our purposes.

Doug
 
Right in line with spec. "Spec" in this case meaning "aligned with the mean of our measurements", since Empire never published inductance/resistance specs for this series of cartridges-- at least, I haven't been to find any.
 
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I'm in. Just got my first Empire cart, a 2000E with short clip.
Lt: 280 mH, 505 ohms
Rt: 271 mH, 509 ohms
The cart came with a PM2385DE stylus (translucent red, swing down guard, with reversed-R "Empire" in gold on the guard). It sounds great on my SL1200 Mk II!

EDIT: The model number stamped on it also has the interlinked "0"s that I've seen described elsewhere.
 
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One other contribution, for those who don't have an LCR meter. I recently bought an MK-168 "Transistor Tester", available from different vendors on Amazon and eBay. Among other functions, it's listed as an LCR meter, and it is. Hook up the leads, press one button, and it reports inductance and resistance simultaneously. Piece of cake. Around $30, and it reports ballpark readings to my standalone LCR meter (Lt 242 mH, 509.7 ohms, Rt 248 mH, 514.4 ohms).
 
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Just got a 4000D/I. Numbers are:
Lt: 232 mH, 418 ohms.
Rt: 226 mH, 411 ohms.
It sounds terrific with an aftermarket Nagaoka 4000D/I stylus.

Oh, and a longer clip than my 2000E has, with a dimple instead of the shorter clip's slot...
 
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Here's a copy of my posting on the Big Thread for all my Empires.

So here are my measurements taken with my LCR Vici DM4070. I validated the inductance readings against some 100 mH chokes on hand and the readings came out within a few percent. However, I have two other LCRs that were not so lucky and had to be scrapped. So, it turns our you can't just order up something online and expect accuracy. Validate first!

Empire model R/ohms L/mH
XL 15 21e--------500-----325
2000e/iii---------1030-----640
LTD400----------1510-----660
500 ID------------1050-----360 <-wow! a lot of wire for so little inductance-500id
 
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Most of the lcr meters will be fine for determining what is what with Empire. Even if it’s 5-10% off it will be close enough to determine if you have a a high Inductance blob or chunky or if it’s a low Inductance model.

I wouldn’t care if I had 514 mH reading as 544 mH. I would consider it a High Inductance model around 500 mH. It’s all relative.
 
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