Just ordered the VPI 16.5 Record Cleaning Machine

[Edriz]

Hello Edriz,

Just to clarify, if used as directed the Enzymatic Formula will not leave a film or residue of any kind on its own, but there is the possibility of all the contaminants not being dissolved in a given example. Please keep in mind that the Enzymatic Formula is not a complete cleaning solution and is not intended to be used alone or with just a rinse to achieve the best results. All of the formulary components needed to clean a record are not in that formula. It is designed to be used with either the Super Cleaner Formula or the Premium Archivist Formula in order to provide a complete "set" of cleaning components.

There is information about this in the instruction folder that you received with your order and also on our website. Please get in touch if you have any questions about this.

Sometimes a highly glossy sheen on a record can be an indication of a film, but this will vary depending upon the vinyl formulation. The sheen and the "rainbow effect" is mostly caused by the esters of stearic acid in the vinyl formulation. Excessed of this on the surface of the record will sometimes make it shinier.


By the way, our updated formulas will work much more quickly on average than the previous versions. We have been shipping the new products for several weeks, but some of our dealers may still have the previous version on the shelf for awhile. With the new formulas you will normally get the full results in a couple of minutes, but there can be a myriad of reasons for exceptions to that rule. However, recleaning of a record that is a particularly tough case will normally yield faster and better results.

I'm always available and happy to answer questions by phone or email.

Happy listening.

Jim Pendleton
Osage Audio Products, LLC

Hi Jim,
I ordered mine through Soundstage Direct but the box it came in had the Osage return address. I spoke with Seth at Soundstage and he said the AI cleaners were drop shiped from the warehouse? I'm guessing he means directly Osage. If thats the case, i should have the new formula. I still have the box and it did come direct from Osage. It arrived here Thursday I believe. I didnt order the Super Cleaner Formula or the Premium Archivist Formula. I was hoping to keep it to a 2 stage cleaning, ya know, wash and rinse. I guess i could place an order for the Archivist Formula. Thanks Jim for the added information. I suppose I'll head over to your site and place a order for the step#2 cleaner. Sure do appreciate your assistance

 

[osageaudio]

Hi Edriz,

Yes, I did drop ship your order directly from here. Seth doesn't keep much stock of our products on hand right now.

Yes, you do have the newest version of the Enzymatic Formula. If you have any questions about the second step choices, please get in touch before you place an order anywhere.

Keep in mind that, with the AIVS products, using a high-purity water after any of the cleaning steps is less of a rinse and more of a finishing step to pick up any partially dissolved contaminants that are still on the record. We've always called this a rinse, but it is actually more of a cleaning step since there is technically nothing to rinse with respect to any of the cleaning components except in the case of them being bonded to partially dissolved contaminants that are still on the record.

Happy listening.

Jim Pendleton
Osage Audio Products, LLC

 

[Edriz]

Hi Edriz,

Yes, I did drop ship your order directly from here. Seth doesn't keep much stock of our products on hand right now.

Yes, you do have the newest version of the Enzymatic Formula. If you have any questions about the second step choices, please get in touch before you place an order anywhere.

Keep in mind that, with the AIVS products, using a high-purity water after any of the cleaning steps is less of a rinse and more of a finishing step to pick up any partially dissolved contaminants that are still on the record. We've always called this a rinse, but it is actually more of a cleaning step since there is technically nothing to rinse with respect to any of the cleaning components except in the case of them being bonded to partially dissolved contaminants that are still on the record.

Happy listening.

Jim Pendleton
Osage Audio Products, LLC

Good thing I looked back here, I was half way to the orderin process, email enroute

 

[seek/destroy]

S/D, I use the AI products. I think you will find they have no peer.

The better the quality, and effectiveness of the cleaners-rinses will have many benefits.

Records that play cleanly are of course of more value, and are more enjoyable to listen to. The other advantage, is a Stylus that encounters less dirt, and residues as it plays.

Styli, such as Micro-Line/Line Contact Styli seem to have a nasty propensity for digging up more crud out of a Record's Groove.

You'll note with the better cleaners, and the RCM, that you aren't noticing all the crud-fuzz build up like you had in the past. Mark

Hey Mark, Im not sure if you are still looking at this thread, but I was wondering exactly how much fluid you use on the record. Do you completely cover the record so its like a sheet of fluid above the grooves or do you just use enough to wet the entire surface? I've been doing the sheet of fluid amount. I was also wondering, during the pure rinse, if the fluid is difficult for you to spread over the entire playing surface. Im about to cover it completely for about a 1/4 of the record following the brush and then it pools together in bands. Thanks again. Im still enjoying this and actually have two more of the Osage brushes on their way, along with some stylus cleaner.

Josh

 

[moon unit]

Jim at Osage,

I'd like to get your opinion on the #15 enzymatic formula/pure water rinse vs. the revised formula three step process. Will the three step process do a significantly better job than the two step with #15?

Also if you could shed a little light on the #6 one step cleaner I would appreciate it, is it better used for clean/new records?

Thanks

 

[markd51]

Hey Mark, Im not sure if you are still looking at this thread, but I was wondering exactly how much fluid you use on the record. Do you completely cover the record so its like a sheet of fluid above the grooves or do you just use enough to wet the entire surface? I've been doing the sheet of fluid amount. I was also wondering, during the pure rinse, if the fluid is difficult for you to spread over the entire playing surface. Im about to cover it completely for about a 1/4 of the record following the brush and then it pools together in bands. Thanks again. Im still enjoying this and actually have two more of the Osage brushes on their way, along with some stylus cleaner.

Josh

Sorry for not responding to your questions earlier.

I insure that I have ample coverage, that during the first steps my concerns are getting as best a coverage on the record as I possibly can.

That I try to get the grooves filled with the liquids, and I'll usually have the platter spinning as I apply fluids, and then begin to spread them.

Once I have gotten the record covered, I then shut the platter motor off, and let those fluids sit. Complicated to tell you the precise amount in cc's, but I don't cheap out, but neither do a excessively flood the records, thus wasting product. I find often that canting my MoFi Brush Pads gives better coverage on the record. Od course if you are using Osage Brushes, or others, this then doesn't apply to you.

There are times, where it is hard, to virtually impossible to get total coverage of the cleaners due to the difference in records, or for some other reasons, that a past owner may have once used some funky things to clean with.

When this occurs, I will do a second application of the stronger cleaners in my arsenal.

To answer other questions here in this post, I do note the Ezymatic Formula is sometimes a little less able to sheet fully on certain records versus the #15Pre-Cleaner. It is why now, I regularly use #15 as a first step on all my records.

As for which I like better, the #15, and a pure water rinse, versus the 3-step AIVS (Enzymatic-Super Cleaner-Pure Water Rinse) I have to say I have never used just the #15 and Pure Water Rinse alone to know?

I'm finding I do get the best results using the 4-step with all the products I mention above.

Another question, will, or should the #6 One Step Formula just be relagated to only clean, or new records? I suspect one can use the #6 on all records, but due to the varying degree of filth, that additional applications might be needed. I would imagine that the #6 is a milder formula, but I believe the #6, like other AIVS formulas does contain an enzyme product. Mark

 

[osageaudio]

Hi Moon Unit,

To give you a reference point for the different products that we offer, what we have tried to do above everything else is offer choices that will fit the lifestyles of different people, and that they can feel comfortable using and get satisfactory results with.

That being said, the formulation work on Premium Record Cleaner Formula No. 15 was started with the goal being a fast-acting pre-cleaner product to use before the 3-step system or before Premium One-Step Formula No. 6. During the field testing that was performed prior to putting the product on the market, one customer asked how it would work with just a follow-up with Ultra-Pure Water. We had never tested that in the lab as that was not our goal.

Long story short: he tried it that way and thought that it was generally as good a system as the 3-step system because of the speed at which records could be cleaned. Our lab testing verified that the No. 15/ U-P Combo did work just as well on most records, but some would require a second cleaning to get full results.

What we learned in this exercise has been applied to improve the formulations of the Premium One-Step Formula No. 6, Super Cleaner, Premium Archivist, and Enzymatic Formulas to make them work faster.

Premium One-Step Formula No. 6 matches up very well with any other single step product on the market, but it is best suited for maintenance cleaning and the cleaning of records that are not real dirty. The main reason for this is that the dirt on a really dirty record will populate the very small fluid column that you can get on a record very quickly and the cleaning action will virtually stop. This is true of any cleaning product, so even the best of them will need to be used in a second cleaning to get a really dirty record clean.

Back to your first question, the No. 15/ U-P combo will do the job on the records that one would commonly come in contact with. You will probably find some that will benefit from a second cleaning cycle. If I had to assign percentages, I would have to estimate that overall this combo would be 95% as effective as the 3-step system, but that's no more than a guess because any random sampling of records will yield different test results.

One other point, if you or anyone else ever has a question, please call or email me directly. I'm happy to help. I rarely look at any of the audio forums. If someone had not alerted me of your post it would have gone unanswered most likely.

I am available by phone and email pretty much seven days a week from early in the morning until late in the evening. Don't be afraid to get in touch.

Happy listening.

Jim Pendleton
Osage Audio Products, LLC