Gigantic, I see you have the SMAHL that fits flush to the front of the mounting board but the squawker is still behind. How is that working? Have you thought about how to face mount the mid?Heretical ship of Theseus:
This:
became this:
Which became the Super Heresy 1.0:
and is now the Super Heresy 1.5, which shares components from the modded speakers, but has no parts in common with the original, 1971 H700s that I began with in August.
Klipsch Modifications
- Thread starter Mike Gibson
- Start date
Gigantic
A big, big love
It worked ok, but I currently am using a Celestion mid horn and a JBL D250 driver.
Continuing the ship of Theseus theme, these are the same cabinets as the blue SH Clones. Next step will be to make them 2-way, with a bigger mid horn and a B&C DE10 diver.
What crossover is that pictured in your post? Deets pretty please. I'd like to make my Forte 2s awesome again too!
Well it has been some time since I posted on a thread like this. For years I had stopped looking for speakers to buy and fix and find happy homes for because I had stopped traveling for work. After Janet died I got to thinking and used her old fakebook account to look for Klipsch as I had heard that marketplace had basically killed off Craigslist. So much to my delight I found a ton of stuff.
KP-301 with the KP-110 bass bins in really fine shape. Recapped and re-tweeted and they are my favorite old Klipsch. In the mix is a KP-250 2 and all these I mention here get the recap retweet treatment. A fairly rare HIP fiberglass and trim cabinet, I had forgotten how heavy these things are. Ran across five KI-362's and took a chance on them based on their Chorus past. I am very pleased with them after the magic stuff was done. I am going to take the odd man out and make a KP-301 style cabinet to stick a set of 362 drivers in and see what that does for bass and fidelity. These 362's reminded me of why I do not like the 1" Ti diaphragm Klipsch tweeters.
I have to admit I missed tinkering around with old gear and I have enjoyed this. Coming up soon a complete KP-301 build with better components crossovers and 25mm Baltic Birch cabinets. On the 362 rebuild cabinet mentioned above I am going to reuse the 362 crossovers and see how that works. I think it will sound good but expect the KP-301 to sound noticeably better.
KP-301 with the KP-110 bass bins in really fine shape. Recapped and re-tweeted and they are my favorite old Klipsch. In the mix is a KP-250 2 and all these I mention here get the recap retweet treatment. A fairly rare HIP fiberglass and trim cabinet, I had forgotten how heavy these things are. Ran across five KI-362's and took a chance on them based on their Chorus past. I am very pleased with them after the magic stuff was done. I am going to take the odd man out and make a KP-301 style cabinet to stick a set of 362 drivers in and see what that does for bass and fidelity. These 362's reminded me of why I do not like the 1" Ti diaphragm Klipsch tweeters.
I have to admit I missed tinkering around with old gear and I have enjoyed this. Coming up soon a complete KP-301 build with better components crossovers and 25mm Baltic Birch cabinets. On the 362 rebuild cabinet mentioned above I am going to reuse the 362 crossovers and see how that works. I think it will sound good but expect the KP-301 to sound noticeably better.
I think i finally have my forte 2s played in, and ready for the ref mic. ALK networks with the best parts i could afford. Stock woofers, Crites phenolic mids, lmahl/b&c tweeters, PathAudio padding resistors. Braced and damped cabs. They sound great!
Attachments
I am a carpenter in my other life, now im fired up to build boxes from scratch. Criton tdx3 perhaps.
Tbh, the stock fortes had my partner and i in tears. We had both been away from hifi for 25 years, listening to squished files on little devices. I put on Peter Gabriel w Kate Bush doing “dont give up”, and we were both bawling by the first chorus! Lucky to have a girl who feels the same aboot music.
Tbh, the stock fortes had my partner and i in tears. We had both been away from hifi for 25 years, listening to squished files on little devices. I put on Peter Gabriel w Kate Bush doing “dont give up”, and we were both bawling by the first chorus! Lucky to have a girl who feels the same aboot music.
I scalloped/rounded the Baltic Birch bracing, a bit like acoustic guitar braces. . I was hoping to preserve cabinet volume, and limit turbulence. That, plus No-Rez make for a pretty dead cabinet. This results in fewer honky/farty box colorations, and improved clarity/coherence.
Marking the spot….I am done for now.
Purchased a pair of 70th Anniversary La Scala’s back in 2018. Replaced a pair of Heresy III. Liked the HIII so much, decided to go large. Finding NIB at a very fair price sealed it.
Noticed on first hook up the K77’s sounded broken up close. Did not know if phase cancelation, or some other issue. Sounded better at 10- 12’.
Found out about DaveinTn products. Found right away the K77 cutout for LaScala II’s is larger than earlier Las Scala’s. Dave graciously made a demo pair from walnut. Sonic heaven.
After a couple years never got upstairs to the loft area to listen. No music. Lost interest. Only went upstairs to listen to music. Changed computer to a iPad.
Got the bug back. Found the incredible products coming out of China for much less than the sales tax on previous gear.
Tore into the La Scala’s and rewired with Canare Quad speaker cable. Applied my old standby adhesive dampening material to tophats. Thick closed cell rubber. Lined the tophats. Even applied to K401. Cannot hurt.
Copied the AL5. Upgraded tweeter and horn, upgraded internal wire, and reduced resonance in tophats. Sonic heaven.
Read and reread Claude’s praise of the Kappa 15C. Waited till PE had on sale and ordered a pair. Sat in storage for a couple years breaking in.
Started streaming. Made listening too easy. Speakers are in a loft, open on two sides to rooms with two story ceilings. Quit going upstairs to listen. Fills whole house with music.
Decided the Kappa15 were ready and swapped the K33 and Kappa 15C. Lined the inside of doghouse with the soft rubber. Sonic heaven.
Conversed with Mike Boxler. Saw that the B&C DE-120 drops into La Scala’s II fine from his measurements. The AL4 crossover is a little different over time. Factory schematic, his AL4, and the ones in mine.
All those big Mylar caps were killing me. The higher output at crossover with Kappa 15C, the higher output from the DE-120’s. Mike suggested reducing the padding down on the K55’s. Bring up to match the new woofers and tweeters.
Finally ran magnet by those sand cast resistors. Steel leads, ordered replacements from PE. Bumped up K55 2.6dB.
Those Mylar caps went in bag with stock resistors.
Decided the three 4ufd and single 1.5ufd caps would get replaced from parts on hand, various film caps PP, PC, and even some PIO for tweeters. . The 10ufd, 33ufd, and four 50ufd were replaced with high quality polar electrolytics. Hooked up as a non-polar. Saw testing showing they measured the same as film capacitors as frequency rises, like -120dB SNR.
Got out LCR and started testing. Planned on using ELNA Silmic II. Found the ELNA Cerafine measured better. Found 100v measured better than lower voltage.
Bypassed the “poly switch” and removed the 100 ohm sandcast resistor strapped across the fuse.
I did not do the approved method of changing one item at a time. The effort to pull crossovers made this too much. Changed resistors, bumped up midrange, bypassed polyswitch, and replaced all the capacitors all at the same time.
Gave it 30 hours of listening and tried to see if it jelled.
I LIKE IT MUCH BETTER! Tonality seems more even, dynamics still great. Replacing film caps with electrolytic did not damage.
Purchased a pair of 70th Anniversary La Scala’s back in 2018. Replaced a pair of Heresy III. Liked the HIII so much, decided to go large. Finding NIB at a very fair price sealed it.
Noticed on first hook up the K77’s sounded broken up close. Did not know if phase cancelation, or some other issue. Sounded better at 10- 12’.
Found out about DaveinTn products. Found right away the K77 cutout for LaScala II’s is larger than earlier Las Scala’s. Dave graciously made a demo pair from walnut. Sonic heaven.
After a couple years never got upstairs to the loft area to listen. No music. Lost interest. Only went upstairs to listen to music. Changed computer to a iPad.
Got the bug back. Found the incredible products coming out of China for much less than the sales tax on previous gear.
Tore into the La Scala’s and rewired with Canare Quad speaker cable. Applied my old standby adhesive dampening material to tophats. Thick closed cell rubber. Lined the tophats. Even applied to K401. Cannot hurt.
Copied the AL5. Upgraded tweeter and horn, upgraded internal wire, and reduced resonance in tophats. Sonic heaven.
Read and reread Claude’s praise of the Kappa 15C. Waited till PE had on sale and ordered a pair. Sat in storage for a couple years breaking in.
Started streaming. Made listening too easy. Speakers are in a loft, open on two sides to rooms with two story ceilings. Quit going upstairs to listen. Fills whole house with music.
Decided the Kappa15 were ready and swapped the K33 and Kappa 15C. Lined the inside of doghouse with the soft rubber. Sonic heaven.
Conversed with Mike Boxler. Saw that the B&C DE-120 drops into La Scala’s II fine from his measurements. The AL4 crossover is a little different over time. Factory schematic, his AL4, and the ones in mine.
All those big Mylar caps were killing me. The higher output at crossover with Kappa 15C, the higher output from the DE-120’s. Mike suggested reducing the padding down on the K55’s. Bring up to match the new woofers and tweeters.
Finally ran magnet by those sand cast resistors. Steel leads, ordered replacements from PE. Bumped up K55 2.6dB.
Those Mylar caps went in bag with stock resistors.
Decided the three 4ufd and single 1.5ufd caps would get replaced from parts on hand, various film caps PP, PC, and even some PIO for tweeters. . The 10ufd, 33ufd, and four 50ufd were replaced with high quality polar electrolytics. Hooked up as a non-polar. Saw testing showing they measured the same as film capacitors as frequency rises, like -120dB SNR.
Got out LCR and started testing. Planned on using ELNA Silmic II. Found the ELNA Cerafine measured better. Found 100v measured better than lower voltage.
Bypassed the “poly switch” and removed the 100 ohm sandcast resistor strapped across the fuse.
I did not do the approved method of changing one item at a time. The effort to pull crossovers made this too much. Changed resistors, bumped up midrange, bypassed polyswitch, and replaced all the capacitors all at the same time.
Gave it 30 hours of listening and tried to see if it jelled.
I LIKE IT MUCH BETTER! Tonality seems more even, dynamics still great. Replacing film caps with electrolytic did not damage.
This may be the schematic for original AL4 crossover. Mine had a jumper wire where the 5 ohm resistors are and tweeter and midrange driver have inverted polarity. The crossovers in my pair of La Scala II’s are the last version. The AL5 followed.
With these filters all the caps in are signal path. At least how I see them.
Tested caps to how they measure out of circuit. Just do not like large value metalized Mylar caps. Or power resistors with steel leads.
The distortion levels for electrolytics are higher at low frequencies. Testing shows almost the same as film caps above 600 Hz. Not bad below 600 Hz.
The 15 ohm resistors in series with the K55 are
now an 8 ohm.
But saved all the factory components removed. Could reinstall. Doubt it.
With these filters all the caps in are signal path. At least how I see them.
Tested caps to how they measure out of circuit. Just do not like large value metalized Mylar caps. Or power resistors with steel leads.
The distortion levels for electrolytics are higher at low frequencies. Testing shows almost the same as film caps above 600 Hz. Not bad below 600 Hz.
The 15 ohm resistors in series with the K55 are
now an 8 ohm.
But saved all the factory components removed. Could reinstall. Doubt it.
Yes, several are in the signal path, not all. But if you are happy that's all that matters.
Lovely madness this.
I ran across your post because I was specifically researching some stuff around MEH's, and 402's are a very solid basis by the looks of it (I'll scratch build mine from wood).
A couple of questions if I may;
Have you compared against other MEH'sand have you considered 3 (or more) way MEH 402's?
Which driver selection is in your 402MEH or which ones would you ideally have in them? If I'll go two way it will be Faital HF20 I think, and 15"es undecided as of yet.
Are you using a cone plug? I read that some leave it out and report no significant difference.
And the most important question; Could you share something about port size & location?
P.s. I've gone through several 402 MEH projects on other websites, would just be of great help to get insights from a fellow AK'er.
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MA043HA
New Member
I rented a Danley SH50 Synergy horn to see what the MEH excitement was about before following ChrisA (Cask05) into K402 MEHs. The SH50 in mono as I recall was very coherent and entirely too much for my living room. Strictly speaking my MEHs are 3 way since they use the coaxial BMS 4592ND just not 3 way in the sense of having separate midrange drivers ported into the sides of the horn.
Eminence Delta 15"s and BMS 4592ND coaxial. At some point I'll try my other compression drivers in the MEHs for true 2 way - TAD 4002s, Celestion AXI2050s, maybe even JBL 2446Hs.
No cone plug. Is that some foam or something to fill the air gap between the woofer cones and the horn port? Pic? I do run 3d printed throat lens in my original Jubilees but not in the MEHs. but I guess that's not what you're talking about.
The ports are 2" diameter rather than the 2.25" Chris used, 6" from the edge of the 2" throat opening, 3" long and right up against the horn corner (see pics earlier in this thread)