kjello
Super Member
I might watch TV again some day lol
I might watch TV again some day lol
Tedrick
Infinity-phile
Congrats on the 3.6's!! Buddy of mine has a pair. He's spent a LOT of time tweaking speaker placement, tuning/treating his listening room, and matching electronics. The soundstage is HUGE, and the sound is so big and dynamic, yet effortless. He uses subs, as well, but only for the very deepest few Hz. It's my favorite system to listen to, and one of the best setups I've heard period.
I run actively Tri-amped modified MGIIIa's with stereo subs (NHT W-2 with X1 crossover, and they blend well. I am sure you are really enjoying the 3.6's with subs. They will now play all genres of music easily I am sure. I run my subs from 47hz. down and cut the MGIIIa's at 40hz with a 18db butterworth slope.
Regards,
Jim
Regards,
Jim
kjello
Super Member
Current main setup with Bluesound Node 2i streamer, Dynamic Precision DAC 8.0 and Dynamic Precision BPC 7.0 passive preamp. Poweramps are still two NAD 218 THX in vertical biamp config. Two bridged Yamaha P7000S are running 18 inch JBL 2243HPL's below 40 Hz. Other sources xlr connected to passiv pre via Rotel RC-995 preamp. When I look back on every small step upgrade, I never thought this sound quality was possible. I wonder where are the limits. And where my weakest link is now... to be continued.
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kjello
Super Member
Smiling
kjello
Super Member
I love to- every christmas to ask my mother : what stuff you use to clean your silver spoons.
kjello
Super Member
S200 vs 218
I've been busy lately. I replaced both main amps for my Magnepan 3.6/R set up. Spent many years with the 218's, now AXB tested vs S200's I will replace the 218's.
I've run two 218's in vertical biamp set up, one 'left-amp' and one 'right-amp'
Then one channel for bass panel and one channel mid/tweeter panel. Into split crossover.
I don't run 218/S200 with soft clipping, they sound better without, besides i never push them that hard.
Also I never run these in bridge mode unless the speakers are confirmed 8 ohms. MG 3.6/R are 4 ohms, so... vertical biamp it is.
I will try to describe the differences. I must admit I like the looks of the 218 much better, with the rack mount and handles they look robust.
I don't really like the looks of the S200, I dont know why. Its kind of like if you put make up on a pig.. it's still a pig.
There is a actually quite a lot of differences in the chassis, the S200 has a thick 10mm cast bottom plate with integrated cast feet, lacks the handles and the wider rack mount front plate.
Heat sinks are the same as the 218, they are massive on both (18X36 cm)
S200 got better speaker terminals and gold plated XLR and RCA input. Both have soft clipping and they are both brigdeable.
They share the same topology and PCB layout. Both 3 emiter follower design/bipolar junction power transistors BJT 4 pairs each channel for the output. The same brand both amps. I think Matsushita (from memory) or was it Toshiba .. anyway the S200's got better PCB (two sided, (same layout) and the wire straps are replaced with pcb tracks),
Metalfilm resistors instead of the ordinary and some better capacitors here and there. Slightly improved input stage, I don't have the details here. Checked both manuals and both are set up with 8 mV idle current.
They share the same massive Holmgren toroidal transformer power supply. I belive they are conservative rated 1,2 kVA
I can only turn on one amp at a time and wait til its out of protection mode, otherwise the 16A fuse flips.
For Europe the S200 and 218 are rated 200wpc/8ohms these are 230 Volt versions.
218 weighs 50 lbs, the S200 weighs 60 lbs. They are a bit nightmare to move around with their knife sharp edges. The lighter 218's with handles wins here.
S200 has detachable power cabel. These came with 1 m Supra LoRad 3X2,5 mm2. I don't think they affect sonics much.
S200's has ever so slightly audible transformer hum, could be caused by the cast bottom plate/integrated feet. Maybe. Have to get real close to cathc it. 218's are dead quiet.
I did a lot of testing AXB both sets, back and forth,for days, also left-right (mono) no blind testing or advanced stuff, just me and my gear playing my music, mostly streaming via Spotify premium/Bluesound Node 2i - external DAC - passive preamp.
I got the S200's from a guy that was willing to let me test them before finished deal. Nice, and in this case there would have been no deal unless I had them for several days. The sonic differences are that small.
Both amps are unlimited in the low octave, I tested clean 20 Hz sinus signals into my 18 inch JBL 2243HPL subs, No problem. But really scary how the floor shakes.
Stereophile found the 218's to have a bit 'overripe midbass' I dont find that problem through the Maggies.
I find not much to report in the midrange, voices and piano sounds the same to me. Great.
The S200 has better top end, highs are smoother more liquid and less 'cutting air', without loosing detail. The 'S' sound is more natural.
With gear less revealing than the ribbon tweeters of the MG 3.6/R, I don't think I would catch it, I was listening to my forhead was sweaty to catch these small details, but the differences are there.
Here a nice 218 sells for around 500 dollars, S200 around 1000.
Feels a bit like 100% more dollars for 1% better sound.
Im tired moving amps around. S200's stays. 218's goes.
test
I've been busy lately. I replaced both main amps for my Magnepan 3.6/R set up. Spent many years with the 218's, now AXB tested vs S200's I will replace the 218's.
I've run two 218's in vertical biamp set up, one 'left-amp' and one 'right-amp'
Then one channel for bass panel and one channel mid/tweeter panel. Into split crossover.
I don't run 218/S200 with soft clipping, they sound better without, besides i never push them that hard.
Also I never run these in bridge mode unless the speakers are confirmed 8 ohms. MG 3.6/R are 4 ohms, so... vertical biamp it is.
I will try to describe the differences. I must admit I like the looks of the 218 much better, with the rack mount and handles they look robust.
I don't really like the looks of the S200, I dont know why. Its kind of like if you put make up on a pig.. it's still a pig.
There is a actually quite a lot of differences in the chassis, the S200 has a thick 10mm cast bottom plate with integrated cast feet, lacks the handles and the wider rack mount front plate.
Heat sinks are the same as the 218, they are massive on both (18X36 cm)
S200 got better speaker terminals and gold plated XLR and RCA input. Both have soft clipping and they are both brigdeable.
They share the same topology and PCB layout. Both 3 emiter follower design/bipolar junction power transistors BJT 4 pairs each channel for the output. The same brand both amps. I think Matsushita (from memory) or was it Toshiba .. anyway the S200's got better PCB (two sided, (same layout) and the wire straps are replaced with pcb tracks),
Metalfilm resistors instead of the ordinary and some better capacitors here and there. Slightly improved input stage, I don't have the details here. Checked both manuals and both are set up with 8 mV idle current.
They share the same massive Holmgren toroidal transformer power supply. I belive they are conservative rated 1,2 kVA
I can only turn on one amp at a time and wait til its out of protection mode, otherwise the 16A fuse flips.
For Europe the S200 and 218 are rated 200wpc/8ohms these are 230 Volt versions.
218 weighs 50 lbs, the S200 weighs 60 lbs. They are a bit nightmare to move around with their knife sharp edges. The lighter 218's with handles wins here.
S200 has detachable power cabel. These came with 1 m Supra LoRad 3X2,5 mm2. I don't think they affect sonics much.
S200's has ever so slightly audible transformer hum, could be caused by the cast bottom plate/integrated feet. Maybe. Have to get real close to cathc it. 218's are dead quiet.
I did a lot of testing AXB both sets, back and forth,for days, also left-right (mono) no blind testing or advanced stuff, just me and my gear playing my music, mostly streaming via Spotify premium/Bluesound Node 2i - external DAC - passive preamp.
I got the S200's from a guy that was willing to let me test them before finished deal. Nice, and in this case there would have been no deal unless I had them for several days. The sonic differences are that small.
Both amps are unlimited in the low octave, I tested clean 20 Hz sinus signals into my 18 inch JBL 2243HPL subs, No problem. But really scary how the floor shakes.
Stereophile found the 218's to have a bit 'overripe midbass' I dont find that problem through the Maggies.
I find not much to report in the midrange, voices and piano sounds the same to me. Great.
The S200 has better top end, highs are smoother more liquid and less 'cutting air', without loosing detail. The 'S' sound is more natural.
With gear less revealing than the ribbon tweeters of the MG 3.6/R, I don't think I would catch it, I was listening to my forhead was sweaty to catch these small details, but the differences are there.
Here a nice 218 sells for around 500 dollars, S200 around 1000.
Feels a bit like 100% more dollars for 1% better sound.
Im tired moving amps around. S200's stays. 218's goes.
test
kjello
Super Member
Interesting, It's my first pair of planars. What will be your next choice ?
Hobie1dog
subaholic
Either another pair of Definitive Technology BP 2000 w/ 15" built in subs, Mirage M3si, or PSB Stratus Gold. All 3 have a Large Scale Sound with prodigious bass. If I buy another set of DefTech then I'll be in the middle of 4 of them for my multi-channel/Quadraphonic listening, and have (4) 15" woofers in the room. The Mirage are one of the top 3 speakers that I've ever heard and I've been fortunate to go the the CES Show in Vegas to hear the best, the only problem with them is that there are no more drivers available if one fails. The PSB are much newer and parts are available. All 3 speakers can be found for $500 on the used market. I'm really tired and too old to be swapping speakers around, so the next pair needs to be my last. I have enjoyed your thread and appreciate all the pictures of your system.
kjello
Super Member
Haha
Funny reading old posts, realized 'upgrade sickness' has calmed very much since the 3.6 maggies came to hand.
What I have been doing is experimenting some with amps, went from The NAD S200's back to the NAD 218's both similar BJT designs, then lately to some older NAD 208's with a more complex dual rail MOS-FET design from mid 90's.
No firm conclusion yet, I find all 3 amps 'transparent', 208's with a somewhat leaner bass/midbass.
Also tried out some Duelund resistors added to the ribbon tweeter circuit. Purpose was dampening the top end a bit without masking details. I just realized still have not bother to remove them. It may imply I like it this way.
And
My music taste has changed a bit I belive. I play more and more acoustic music these days.
And also more Tidal and less Spotify.
Funny reading old posts, realized 'upgrade sickness' has calmed very much since the 3.6 maggies came to hand.
What I have been doing is experimenting some with amps, went from The NAD S200's back to the NAD 218's both similar BJT designs, then lately to some older NAD 208's with a more complex dual rail MOS-FET design from mid 90's.
No firm conclusion yet, I find all 3 amps 'transparent', 208's with a somewhat leaner bass/midbass.
Also tried out some Duelund resistors added to the ribbon tweeter circuit. Purpose was dampening the top end a bit without masking details. I just realized still have not bother to remove them. It may imply I like it this way.
And
My music taste has changed a bit I belive. I play more and more acoustic music these days.
And also more Tidal and less Spotify.
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Blue Shadow
Waiting for Vintage Gear from this century
Happens a lot. Then playing more acoustic and less headbanging music keeps the Magneplanars sounding great.
I use a 0.5mH choke for a tweeter attenuator on my MG-IIIa speakers. I think that is the value.
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Blue Shadow
Waiting for Vintage Gear from this century
Just reread this thread as I known I was kinda talkative in it. Your comments on what you were doing and the outcomes were interesting reading and your English is easy to read and understand, excellent really.
Since about the first of the year a pair of Tympani IVa have pushed my MG-IIIa speakers aside while I wait for the owner to come pick them up. Been doing some similar moving of heavy gear to fine tune the system. In my 20x13 ft room I'm like you with the speakers filling up the end of the room. My room is not wide enough for the 3-panel system even though the panels are only 18" wide. I have the dual woofer panels behind the mid-tweet panel and they sound good but have more potential.
Glad you found a speaker that has been so enjoyable and more than capable of showing you the changes you make in the gear. I think you got a great deal, speakers, mye stands, spikes and power cords. I don't know what the 3.6 sold for two years ago when you bought, but your set seemed complete and well cared for.
Recommend others interested in Magneplanars read through this thread. Good info in it.
Since about the first of the year a pair of Tympani IVa have pushed my MG-IIIa speakers aside while I wait for the owner to come pick them up. Been doing some similar moving of heavy gear to fine tune the system. In my 20x13 ft room I'm like you with the speakers filling up the end of the room. My room is not wide enough for the 3-panel system even though the panels are only 18" wide. I have the dual woofer panels behind the mid-tweet panel and they sound good but have more potential.
Glad you found a speaker that has been so enjoyable and more than capable of showing you the changes you make in the gear. I think you got a great deal, speakers, mye stands, spikes and power cords. I don't know what the 3.6 sold for two years ago when you bought, but your set seemed complete and well cared for.
Recommend others interested in Magneplanars read through this thread. Good info in it.
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kjello
Super Member
Thank you for the kind comments, I guess my english has improved a bit
These days its more focus on music and recordings than gear. I also have to be honest I have not heard a better sounding system than my current own. That could also mean I should get more around and listen to other systems
Blue Shadow
Waiting for Vintage Gear from this century
That could also mean I should get more around and listen to other systems
Ah we are not doing that much these days. Haven't had the group together since Jan and only a couple one on one listening sessions when someone comes over or I visit. Keeping the groups small. Hope this changes.