Most Underrated/Overrated Component or Brand

[beans]

When I saw the title of this thread, I first thought that McIntosh will take a beating, being a vintage Mac owner. It's understandable. I agree that from the sheer sound quality aspect, you can get great sound from much less expensive components. When I put my Mac system together I didn't expect to hear anything I've never heard before. But it's what I wanted...for several reasons.
What Mac owners are paying for is quality, but also the McIntosh company itself is one of the best there is. We are also paying for the classic look/styling, and the resale value. In my case there was also a sentimental, nostalgic factor because my dad had Mac equipment, and what I found out is that if we had kept it, it would be worth more now, 40 years later (MC275 goes for ten times what my dad paid, brand new in 1968). And THAT is unbelievable.
Everyone on this thread needs to read Roger Russell's web site where he compares amplifiers truly in A-B fashion, and the conclusion is that it is damn-near humanly impossible to tell the difference between "good" amplifiers, and there are a lot of them out there.
So, McIntosh is probably overrated/overpriced, but you can say the same about every other hi-end, hi-dollar component. And Mac equipment is not THE MOST expensive, either.
Manley seems to be getting a lot of praise now, but their specs do not match up to Mac's tube stuff, and their stuff is outrageously expensive.

 

[alexsurber]

Marantz is over rated. They sound pretty nice, and they are built like a tank, but that font, well, looks kinda 70's. Not the prettiest receivers. Must also say that pioneers are a little overrated, some people act like they're the holy grail. My sx-1080 looks great, and sounds great too, but I have heard better.

Underrated: Yamaha for sure. Beautiful sound.

 

[Brian]

This thread is a matter of perception and about as subjective as it can get. In the extreme, everything is over rated including Sansui, Marantz and Pioneer compared to the Philips Lab Series receivers, most Sherwood receivers and a number of other labels. My expectation of Mc receivers is not in comparison to the likes of Pioneer (BTW, never met 1 I liked the sound of), and most of the non-US Marantz receivers but against separates and integrated amps/tuners. This is unfair and I've said it before but it is an expectation I can not divorce myself from. You can spend thousands on separates ot pick up high end integrated amps and separate tuners and then run them against say the 4100 and over linger term listening, the 4100 aquates itself so well, it makes me wonder why we spend so much for so little improvement. Likewise, the 1500, 1700, and 1900.

As for comparing them to the receivers from companies you mentioned, it may be the effects of so many years of listening, comparing and associated equipment but I hear differences. How significant they are depends on the units. Some are close enough or have other qualities I could live with them and others so significant, I could not keep the other unit on for any length of time without fatique. The one thing about Mc is the receivers have been consistent in quality and performance while I can not think of another company that I can similarly compliment but, Mc only panders to a niche where most others broadly market. Only against the Sony STR6060FW and STR6120 (and probably the STR6200) can I say that the Mc receivers may not be under rated but as these early Sonys seem to need quite a bit of TLC, the final price spread may not be all that significant.

 

[Axcel]

fatique.? in my 30+ years of audio I have never experienced it. But its a term tossed about by the audio population am I the only one? Not to get off topic but Brian just mentioned it

 

[ugornot]

fatique.? in my 30+ years of audio I have never experienced it. But its a term tossed about by the audio population am I the only one? Not to get off topic but Brian just mentioned it

Quite often I think this may happen to me. On some occasions music buoys me up lifts and settles my spirit. Other times the music must be fatiguing because it just transports me to dream land.

But then again its my expectation from all the arts. Paintings, photographs, sculpture, prose and poetry. I expect all of these to transport me into another place, time or mood. I guess I just don't get critical listening. Critical in the sense of judging equipment. I am wildly tolerant of the equipment if the music does its job. And if the equipment interferes then its history. But my obsession is the music not the equipment. Sorry for the poor humor and the homespun philosophy.

Bill

 

[beans]

would have to agree I too have owned recr's from Pioneer -kenwood -Sansui -
just about all main brands including Mcintosh (4100) and heard nothing mind blowing better from the Mac (which I paid far more for)

Again, it's really not all about the sound. It's about how long you will have it, what it will bring if you ever have to sell it, and the styling (if you even like the styling.) In the case of Mac amps, they do the best job of protecting your speakers and your ears if you try to overdrive it, whether purposely or accidentally.

 

[Axcel]

Again, it's really not all about the sound. It's about how long you will have it, what it will bring if you ever have to sell it, and the styling (if you even like the styling.) In the case of Mac amps, they do the best job of protecting your speakers and your ears if you try to overdrive it, whether purposely or accidentally.

The other quality equipment all fetched as much or slightly more $$ when resold as did my 4100 All quality peices usually do no matter the logo on it. As for the best in protecting ears and equipment again don't buy that arguement either (all did a fine job in that respect) sorry:thmbsp: its also about 99% sound and not the name on it for me not quite all important but just about:yes:

 

[grillebilly]

Almost all my gear is underrated because if it was overrated I couldn't afford it. Last night 2 Onkyo 4500 MKIIs went on the Auction site for $42 and $52. That was a fine unit IMO, has a strong 60WPC and is heavy and durable. The comparable Pioneer 850 would be close to $100-125. In reality, they are both bargains, I guess. Now the big Onkyo can be had for under $250, while most other makes putting out 160 WPC would be double that.
I may be shooting myself in the foot because I am looking for a mid-sized Onkyo for my boy at college.
Overrated? All the black faced gadget-laced stuff I bought in the 90's. It's all been sent to the curb or the kids bedrooms.

 

[NAD613]

:thmbsp:Underrated: The Aiwa cassette deck ran circles around the Sony and lasted forever. Onkyos are bulletproof, but I would not say underrated because most prople seem to know Onkyo gives the most bang for the buck. I'd say Technics is underrated. Dismissed by many as "mid-fi" Have you ever seen/heard or tried to lift any of their 80s "R&B" (Recording and Broadcast) stuff? I had an SU-A4 preamp that was beautiful, understated, transparent and included both MM and MC preamps!

I have a Technics CD player I bought back in '99 & it sounds a lot better than the Sony it replaced. It's a very good CD player & sounds fantastic.

 

[BajaGringo]

I have found that there are many, many brands that made a really good particular model in one of their lines at some point in time. The ones who did but didn't continue to follow that line are the ones who were/are run by the bean counters...

 

[catch 22]

I think Scott SS equipment is under rated, (over shadowed by their tube stuff). Overrated? ANYTHING that someone claims is the BEST without comparing, most everybody made some good vintage stuff, and most everybody made some junk.

 

[Lady Ayeka]

Hey nukem maybe the reason Marantz (post 22XX series) is lacking is that by early 1980 Marantz had been acquired by Philips of the Netherlands and was no longer interested in high quality gear. Philips took Marantz in a mass market direction,retaining the classic looks ( gyro tuning ) but skimping everywhere else. The prices on ebay of 80's Marantz gear reflect how apparent this is to any Marantzaphile. Of course, Marantz has since moved up market again but I can't vouch for their quality now.


Overrated: That would be ANYTHING with Dr.Bose's name on it. From the $2,000 WAVE radio to his bassless crappy wall of sound 901's. If you can't beat em with brains, baffle em with bullshit. If Bob Carver could market like Bose he'd be Bill Gates by now.

Mike

i'll have to second that. BOSE blows.:thumbsdn:

 

[fly-fi]

Overrated / Underrated

Understand it probably goes without saying in this area of the forums but anything with vacuum tubes is OVERRATED!

Most Underrated: Concept! The modular design makes it the easiest of any receiver/amplifier brand to work on, and the components/boards are first quality. Onkyo Kennwood and Yamaha are also quite underrated.

Pioneer, Sansui, and Marantz are all rated correctly IMHO...

 

[beans]

... As for the best in protecting ears and equipment again don't buy that arguement either (all did a fine job in that respect) sorry:thmbsp: its also about 99% sound and not the name on it for me not quite all important but just about:yes:

I was referring to the Power Guard circuit that kicks in when distortion hits 2% and limits the power output right there. I'm pretty sure the Power Guard patent has run out and I don't know if any other makers use anything like it, but I have it on a 75 WPC amp, which is good because I tend to drive it pretty hard (being relatively small).

So is Mac still the only maker that offers a feature such as Power Guard?

 

[Marantz2270]

Underrated:Akai
Overrated:Rotel

 

[Alan NY]

I'm down with this

Underated TOTL - Technics, Aiwa, JVC
Underrated receiver - Yamaha R9
Overated - Pioneer HPM-100s
OverInflated price - Marantz

Got my R9 back. Matched up with my Bozak Symphanies is magical. I really don't have that much to compare it to but my upgraded KR-9600 isn't even close. With the prices TOTL 70s monsters are fetching these days, an early/mid 80s R9 or R8 would make a very good pickup. They don't show up that often. I watched a real solid 100 WPC R8 go for $160 on the bay. 100 WPC from any good 70s gear goes for pretty close to twice that.

When it went down, not many people new much about the unit, but those who had em all loved em, and we ain't selling!

 

[CharlieBee]

I have not had experience with Mac but having read the first 11 pages of this post can determine it is a high end product of some of the best USA engineering for heavy usage. Lots of our favorite Japanese brands suffered growing pains from some poor engineering (exs. SX-1010 with the power supply mounted upside down under the circuit board prone to overheating, combination of ON/OFF switch with speaker selection switch) or lack a adequate safety factor in the components used or poor circuit board support. Some of the Japanese brands reputations are tainted due their production of main stream consumer market stereo equipment and also producing portable Walkman, CD players, etc. and components with more mechanical mechanisms that have higher failure rates.

The Macs cost several times more that the typical Japanese make and though the specs and sound may or may not be better, its build and engineering make it more durable and desirable for more demanding professional heavy use. For the casual home user the Japanese make is often the best buy for the money especially if one can find one deeply discounted at an estate or garage sale!


Charlie

 

[jbeckva]

Hmmm... most underrated? I would have to say Nakamichi as far as receivers go, and specifically the AV-1. Since my "addiction out-of-remission" back in March, I have been through everything from a crown PA to Onkyo, to Yamaha, and Sansui. Every time I eventually put the AV-1 back up. The crown was awesome, but the AV-1 is just a tad bit sweeter I think.

Last time was just 20 minutes ago, against a Yamaha R-9.

This AV-1 just amazes me. The only issue (and I have 2 AV-1's with same problem) is with the pre-amp on it. After a little bit of warmup, they both start injecting some sort of "pulse-like" signal into the mix. Not hum necessarily which is strange, but a like a "clock" of sorts. Not a big deal tho, because it seems only those inputs other than the CD input (which from what I can tell is on another PCB), and that with using the "source direct" option eliminates most of it.

 

[djv8ga]

I don't know about over/under rated, but Denon must be irrelevant since I didn't see it in one post. I'm guessing that's a good thing.:thmbsp: This thread is a cool read.

 

[nyindallas]

Under-rated
Technics - I have a SA-700 driving some old RTR speakers. Room filling, bright sound at 25% volume.
I would also have to say Kenwood in general. Also the Infinity Primus 150, 151, 152. Great sound for around 120 a pair.

Over-rated
Everything I have listened to from BOSE. Interesting to compare the BOSE 300$ headphones to the 60$ Grados.
Also many of the Marantz Vintage units that end in 'b'. Once opened a 2238b next to a 2230. Night and day build and sound.