I have a td-124 with Castagna tone arm. It needs some work for sure. The spindle is dry and I suspect the motor is as well. Despite being dry the platter spins easily and the motor spins by hand with a little resistance. I would like to plug it in and turn it on temporarily to see if it works at all before I remove the motor for a rebuild. So far I have resisted. Is it safe to start it up for a second to see if it works at the most basic level? Or will I damage it if it is in fact completely dry inside the motor?
New (to me) Thorens td-124
- Thread starter jkvw
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Mister Pig
Pigamus Maximus
Oil the motor, there is a felt pad that holds the oil reservoir. Clean the belt pathway and the idler wheel. Clean the spindle well and refill it and give it a go. Keep something under the table in case the gasket for the bearing cap has a bit of a leak. Unless there is something damaged already, you won't hurt anything.
MRL_Audio
RIP 2022
You got good advice from the farm animal. You’d be better served to do a little work before you jump right into powering it on though. Highly unlikely you do damage though if you just can’t wait. These tables are well made and are pretty straight forward to get back up and running. There are plenty of existing threads here and elsewhere for what’s needed to do the rebuild properly.
Thanks! I'm looking forward to hearing it for the first time though not expecting that to be very soon
Thanks MisterPig and MRL. I am of course anxious to see it spinning, but more practically I want to know that the motor is electrically in good shape. For all I know it is shorted out or otherwise damaged. No point paying for a rebuild and/or a rebuild kit if the motor has other issues.
adnick
Addicted Member
Congrats on a very fine table….just refurbished one myself. As @MRL_Audio there are numerous posts reference that model, and theanalogdept.com has pages dedicated to it.
It is possible to oil both the top/lower bushings of the motor without disassembling it, just takes some doing
ISO 46 turbine oil is the Thorens recommended oil, which is available, but 3in1 machine oil (blue&white container) is suitable.If you do get it up and running, don’t forget the speed pitch control for the Eddy brake, it will allow fine speed adjustment.
Have fun,
Andy
https://audiokarma.org/forums/index.php?threads/new-project-very-early-td-124.982404/
I recently acquired a pretty rough condition TD124 and found Andy’s thread above to be very helpful.
I recently acquired a pretty rough condition TD124 and found Andy’s thread above to be very helpful.
Waiting to pickup proper oil before I try anything with the motor. In the meantime I resurrected the Castagna tone arm that I thought was trash when I bought it. It was all over the place and parts were hidden in the packing peanuts. Turns out in shipping some screws rattled out, the "stylus force adjustment" wire became disconnected and the vertical "jewel" bearing popped out. Took it apart and reassembled then tightened the bearing with a pair of pliers very gently and seems like it will work now. Pretty cool design now that I understand it. Maybe not the pinnacle of tonearms but nice bonus that it isnt trash.
ps - sorry for the banana plug end stuffed w packing peanut acting as a weight. never did find that piece in the box.
ps - sorry for the banana plug end stuffed w packing peanut acting as a weight. never did find that piece in the box.
Attachments
Yeah that is all I could find on it as well. Other than a post calling it "rare as hens teeth" and another by a guy who has a busted one on a thread about equipment nobody else owns. So maybe I will be the third to post about it.
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adnick
Addicted Member
Really appreciate the positive comments, it’s always great to combine hobbies, but my focus is to help people put these fine machines back in service….there’s some skills that take patience and practice, but in general if I can do it with help from the internet then others can too
To buy a comparable new machine in today’s machine, (if they exist) would be financially beyond many, “they just don’t make ‘em like they use to” is arguably apropos for many different brands.
Thanks again,
Andy
@BillWojo and I became friends because of our interest in old tonearms, what becomes evident in tonearm collecting is that many of them perform extremely well, even some that are completely dismissed by the audiophile authorities
That will be a very unique and high performance machine when finished
VR
Andy
Congrats on a very fine table….just refurbished one myself. As @MRL_Audio
It is possible to oil both the top/lower bushings of the motor without disassembling it, just takes some doing
Andy
Anybody know if Norvey turbine oil is suitable? It doesnt say "iso 64" but I've always used it on my dual turntables so have it around.
I've been using LA-CO brand turbine oil (with the zoom spout) for a few years with my TD-124.
I think it has an iso rating of around 32...which means it's less viscous than an oil with a higher iso rating.
Do some research on iso ratings and turbine oils.
I think what you have should be fine.
I think it has an iso rating of around 32...which means it's less viscous than an oil with a higher iso rating.
Do some research on iso ratings and turbine oils.
I think what you have should be fine.
@jkvw
How about some pictures?
I'm particularly interested in your main spindle bushings. If they're black and your unit is an early version (like mine) with a low Serial Number, I think they may be the original Nylatron bushings. If so, I'd recommend you change them to Sintered Bronze (Oilite) bushings- which are "self lubricating". The sintered bronze surface has pores- the oil "sweats out" of the pores as they get warm and gets sucked back in when they cool. Self lubricating along the contact surface!
Nylatron is/was one of those "modern plastics" (modern back then) better suited for sliding doors. Problem is that Nylatron expands with heat and as the spindle turns, the bushings will expand from friction and eventually seize the spindle. I found out from experience.
If the bushings in your unit are Nylatron, no worries- proper replacements are available as are other parts.
Good luck and enjoy the restoration!
How about some pictures?
I'm particularly interested in your main spindle bushings. If they're black and your unit is an early version (like mine) with a low Serial Number, I think they may be the original Nylatron bushings. If so, I'd recommend you change them to Sintered Bronze (Oilite) bushings- which are "self lubricating". The sintered bronze surface has pores- the oil "sweats out" of the pores as they get warm and gets sucked back in when they cool. Self lubricating along the contact surface!
Nylatron is/was one of those "modern plastics" (modern back then) better suited for sliding doors. Problem is that Nylatron expands with heat and as the spindle turns, the bushings will expand from friction and eventually seize the spindle. I found out from experience.
If the bushings in your unit are Nylatron, no worries- proper replacements are available as are other parts.
Good luck and enjoy the restoration!
adnick
Addicted Member
Pictures are always good, especially detailed before, during and after a refurbishing
plus it’s a very useful reference.Still have some sort of plastic bearings in mine, no clue if they are Nylatron or if they were changed to Delrin somewhere along the way. Based on Rich’s experience (and others) I’m assuming someone changed them to Delrin.
Decided to leave them as is because when the clearance was checked the spindle & bearings were in fantastic shape.
My first inclination was to change them to Oilite, but after talking with Steve (theanalogdept) about his experience with both Oilite and Delrin, my decision was to use Delrin.
One point he made that’s important, Delrin bearings made to the same specifications as the bronze replacements, acts in the same manner when pressed into the sleeve, in other words, the compression is almost identical, which provides the same clearance diameter between bearing and shaft.
As I said, so far no replacement was needed in mine and I’ve run it for weeks now and for more than 8 hours in a single day….Steve also advised that the shaft well needs to be full with the correct oil for Delrin.
I’m just providing information, each of us has our on reasons for the way we refurbish these tables
VR
Andy
Thanks for all the info guys!
After some tense moments with very difficult screws I got the motor opene and put a couple drops of the turbine oil on the lower bearing. It wasnt completely dry. I can now happily report that the motor runs! It makes a quiet but noticeable noise while running though. So I assume I should do an actual rebuild of the motor?
Some pics of the motor opened up attached (forgot to take a pic of the part I actually oiled). Will take pics of spindle bearing next. Then I will have a good idea of the parts I will need to order and can start the real build
Anything look abnormal in there?
After some tense moments with very difficult screws I got the motor opene and put a couple drops of the turbine oil on the lower bearing. It wasnt completely dry. I can now happily report that the motor runs! It makes a quiet but noticeable noise while running though. So I assume I should do an actual rebuild of the motor?
Some pics of the motor opened up attached (forgot to take a pic of the part I actually oiled). Will take pics of spindle bearing next. Then I will have a good idea of the parts I will need to order and can start the real build
Anything look abnormal in there?
