P-Mount cartridge suggestions?
- Thread starter Azimuth
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griffithds
Active Member
Thats a good question! I have picked up "P" mounts on e/bay (some NOS), but do not know of anyone still making 'P" mounts. Perhaps Grado?
Regards,
Don
Regards,
Don
Azimuth
Well-Known Member
I found this. Slim pickins.
http://www.lpgear.com/category/T4P.html
http://www.lpgear.com/category/T4P.html
sled108
Super Member
I'd say...Get This...A Cart's Body will not Deteriorate...The Stylus is what Matters...For this, the Body alone is worth $100...You can Listen to it, and in time if you want to Up-Grade to a 'S' Stylus...That will be at least another $100...
I'm sure that whatever New Needle that's on it now....It will sound Real Good...For P-Mounts, you can't beat L737S...
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Stanton-L-7...rd_Player_Turntable_Parts&hash=item337c79a1c1
I'm sure that whatever New Needle that's on it now....It will sound Real Good...For P-Mounts, you can't beat L737S...
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Stanton-L-7...rd_Player_Turntable_Parts&hash=item337c79a1c1
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Bob_in_OKC
Addicted Member
I'd probably be looking at an Ortofon OMP10, unless you can get your hands on a Digitrac 300SE...no longer made, but was still floating around not tool long ago.
http://www.needledoctor.com/Ortofon-OMP10-P-Mount-Phono-Cartridge?sc=2&category=378
http://www.needledoctor.com/Ortofon-OMP10-P-Mount-Phono-Cartridge?sc=2&category=378
I had one of those SL-QD33s once, with an Ortofon cart (I think it was an OMP5). I thought it sounded pretty thin. I've also heard them with the ubiquitous AT "wedge" carts (AT90CD, 3472, etc -- there's a dozen or more variations on the lpgear page) and it wasn't any better.
My first choice would be an old Stanton, the L727, L737 or L747 if you can find and/or afford it. I haven't heard a Grado on that table, but I'd think it should perform okay. The main thing is you want a cartridge with some beef to the sound, because those tonearms really seem to need that.
If you want to go super-budget just to get the thing running, you could try the p-mount Red Ed, a.k.a. the Sanyo MG29P. Those can be had on eBay <$20 shipped. I've been pleasantly surprised by the standard 1/2" elliptical stylus version as a budget cart. Haven't heard the p-mounts, which come standard with the conical stylus.
My first choice would be an old Stanton, the L727, L737 or L747 if you can find and/or afford it. I haven't heard a Grado on that table, but I'd think it should perform okay. The main thing is you want a cartridge with some beef to the sound, because those tonearms really seem to need that.
If you want to go super-budget just to get the thing running, you could try the p-mount Red Ed, a.k.a. the Sanyo MG29P. Those can be had on eBay <$20 shipped. I've been pleasantly surprised by the standard 1/2" elliptical stylus version as a budget cart. Haven't heard the p-mounts, which come standard with the conical stylus.
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Love-Vinyl
It's about the Music
+1 on that. That little Stanton is a sneaky good cartridge especially for a P-Mount. I also have a Grado GF1 which is similar to the Grado Silver but it's more than your budget. For the price of the Stanton you will be playing many happy years of
!
ETI_5000
Super Member
Real name Nagaoka (the OE manufacturer) C501M/P http://www.soundring.com.au/en/products/hi-fi-cartridges/c501m-p-moving-magnet-detail . However, sorry to be the bearer of bad news – it won’t be a good choice. The Nagaoka C501M/P has an ideal tracking weight of 1.8-2.3g. So the Nagaoka/Red Ed/Sanyo at 1.25g (the p-mount standard), will be tracking at well below what it’s designed for. Nagaoka attempted to adapt a cartridge that doesn’t have an ideal tracking weight of 1.25g to become a p-mount, by putting a p-mount body on it in place of the original half-inch mount body, and making no other changes.
I'm not sure what they were thinking.
I suspect the Nagaoka will really struggle at 1.25g, which most non-adjustable p-mount tonearms are set at. It works best at 2g as a half-inch mount cartridge (Nagaoka C51M/II/Denon DL-007/Red Ed/Fisher MG-29D/Goldring Elan/Kenwood V51/II/Music Hall Tracker/Sanyo MG-29D/Toshiba C51M/II) on a half-inch mount tonearm.The Ortofon 310 (or for the same performance at a slightly higher price, the OMP 10) is probably a good choice, although it works best at 1.5g (according to Ortofon). It should be OK at the p-mount standard of 1.25g, though. It can also be upgraded later with a better stylus (Ortofon 320), if you have more money, as can the OMP series. An Ortofon OMP 10 with a stylus 40 would be good. There was also a 5x0(P) series, that some sellers still may have - the 510(P) would probably be the correct price, and can be upgraded all the way to 540(P) by changing the stylus. Like the OMP 40, the 540(P) has a nude Fritz Gyger 70 stylus, but it is rather pricey at some sellers...
Bear in mind, if you go for an Audio Technica cartridge (the other brand I'd recommend), for the best sound, they need to be loaded with a particularly low capacitance (150pF). Most turntables and amplifiers will supply a lot more than that, which may be why some people think Audio Technica's don't sound as good as they are capable of sounding....
For a really cheap p-mount cartridge, Shure's M92E (the current universal mount version, not the earlier version, which was half-inch mount) is quite OK. They (and the replacement styli) seem to be very widely available at reasonable prices, although how long that will be for, nobody knows. Let's hope they don't follow Stanton's lead and stop making any hi-fi cartridges and styli.
Bob_in_OKC
Addicted Member
From what I see, Ortofon's 310 is a gram too light. Or am I missing something?
jancumps
iRock
That is the one I'm using; very satisfied with its performance.
ETI_5000
Super Member
You're correct, although the OMP series also weighs the same. What effect it has, I don't know - someone with a p-mount turntable, several different weight cartridges, and a tracking weight scale may be able to test it for us.
Obviously Ortofon don't regard it as critical seeing that they also make at least one other cartridge (X1-MCP) that weighs 1g higher.
Many thanks for the info. You saved me from wasting time and $ next time a customer needs a p-mount.Real name Nagaoka (the OE manufacturer) C501M/P http://www.soundring.com.au/en/products/hi-fi-cartridges/c501m-p-moving-magnet-detail . However, sorry to be the bearer of bad news – it won’t be a good choice. The Nagaoka C501M/P has an ideal tracking weight of 1.8-2.3g. So the Nagaoka/Red Ed/Sanyo at 1.25g (the p-mount standard), will be tracking at well below what it’s designed for. Nagaoka attempted to adapt a cartridge that doesn’t have an ideal tracking weight of 1.25g to become a p-mount, by putting a p-mount body on it in place of the original half-inch mount body, and making no other changes.
I'm not sure what they were thinking.
Bang for buck-wise, the M92E may be the best bet in a currently available p-mount cartridge. Not as thin sounding as those ATs. There are better NOS stylii (like the N110HE) that would mate with that body as well.
ETI_5000
Super Member
The N96E stylus (from the M96E, another recent Shure p-mount) is also an upgrade stylus for the M92E, aslthough it's slightly below the N110HE. It's a .2 x .7 mil elliptical, about level with the N97xE for quality. Trouble is, the N96E styli seem to be like hen's teeth, even though it wasn't that long ago that Shure stopped selling the cartridge.
iLUVanalog
Addicted Member
I would agree with Bob on this. The Ortofon's are a couple of steps above the AT's. Also, the Digitrac 300SE is still available on the "Bay"....just do a quick search of the model number. Only one seller (in Germany) with a supply of these, and they're going for about $135. However, the Ortofon OMP-10 (I have one of these myself) I believe goes for less than $100.
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To the OP, pardon the tangent here . . .
Sometime I think that the real problem with p-mounts and their more-often-than-not inexpensive stylii is that hard-set 1.25 g VTF rating.
Case in point -- because I'm always on the hunt for inexpensive NOS stylii for customers who need replacements, I recently picked up a 4-pack of the Shure SS-80, a stylus for the BC80 cartridge which was a "broadcast" version of these Shure p-mounts. The sylii are 0.4 x 0.7 ellipticals with "Masar polished tip to reduce distortion." They are rated for 1.25 grams. They sound awful at that setting -- sibilance beyond tolerable levels. Tracking at 2 grams they sound perfect.
iLUVanalog
Addicted Member
You're correct, although the OMP series also weighs the same. What effect it has, I don't know - someone with a p-mount turntable, several different weight cartridges, and a tracking weight scale may be able to test it for us.
I agree.....a tracking force gauge is an absolute necessity. Not all P-mounts weigh the same. Most weigh 6 grams, some weigh 5.9 grams, some weigh less, some weigh more. I have an Ortofon OMP-10, a Shure M94EP, a couple of Digitrac 200NE, and an older AT P-mount. I weighed these cartridges individually on a small digital scale. Of these cartridges, only the Digitrac's weighed exactly 6 grams. The Ortofon weighed less. The Shure weighed more, and the older AT WAY less.
Have you heard that cartridge on one of these p-mount Technics tonearms though? That's the trick. I've messed with quite a few of these tables and their variants and they're a difficult arm to mate with a cartridge, and you don't have the luxury of adjusting anything. The OMP-5 sounded (to my ears) intolerably bad on it. The 10 may sound tons better, but that's an expensive experiment.
