jwhitelan
New Member
Ok I will still give this a shot then. I did try the headphones and nothing but silence.
Pioneer SA-9500 II DOA
- Thread starter jwhitelan
- Start date
Ok I will still give this a shot then. I did try the headphones and nothing but silence.
I wonder if the relay is bad and is the problem.
jwhitelan
New Member
One newbie question before I have to leave town. Could the relay not click because there are no speakers attached to it? I just realized that is the difference from last time. I had speakers connected to it when I powered it on each time. I moved it to my bench and didn't connect speakers to it.
strat10
Well-Known Member
Compressed air will not clean your switches and controls.
Those connections are correct, and if you have a known good pair of cables, it would be a good test as far as it goes. But there can still be problems with corrosion in any or all RCA type connectors, including the pre-out, power in connectors.
Replacement jumpers can actually be made DIY from brass rod of appropriate diameter.
This is a very good test to isolate the 9500 sections into preamp and power amp. Since you have a known good 9900, taking the good preamp signal from 9900 pre-out to 9500 power in will test the 9500 power amp (with speakers attached). Conversely, taking the 9500 pre-out to 9900 power in (with speakers attached) will test the 9500 preamp section. Of course using the 9900 switch in the correct setting for a separated connection.
BTW, the caps are there just to keep the dust and air out or off the metal surfaces for some corrosion protection.
Otherwise, you could take an iPod with volume control set low and use a 3pin mini to double RCA cable as your "preamp/source" and plug directly into the 9500 pre-in to test the 9500 power amp.
The cleaning issue is one we all face when dealing with vintage equipment, in this case, now 40 year old gear. No matter how "clean" the faceplate, knobs, etc. look, that's only cosmetic. And hoping that the unit still "works" in most cases is wishful thinking, although we all do it. Such is the inherent faith we have in the build quality of yesteryear and the prominent equipment builders of the time.
However, if problems persist, or even it you get the unit going, there is still the likelihood for intermittent problems electrically in the signal path or control paths. So some good preventative maintenance and diagnostic testing at the same time is important.
Some would suggest exercising each and every switch, connector and control at least 10-50 times to try to "wipe" or break through any corrosion. I submit if you're going to do that finger/wrist exercise, you may as well get in there at the control pots, switches, selector switch contacts, and panel jacks with DeOxit before and after exercising, cleaning off any excess or residual external to the contacts.
Recommend using DeOxit D5 (red label) in either regular or non-flammable carrier for cleaning, and DeOxit Gold G5 (gold label) for preservation. Yes, they are a bit expensive (check Amazon, Fry's, local Guitar Center (also sold under Hosa packaging), or remaining Radio Shack as potential sources, or order direct from CAIG labs) but they belong in EVERY electronics or DIY guy's tool box - very useful for other household and commercial electrical troubleshooting and cleaning. Have saved a Garage door system, auto radio, and home switches with them. Looking to see if it will help some balky power wheelchair problems in the near future.
The headphone test should help, although if it doesn't work, you still have to check out the power amp section and the speaker relay and control circuit.
Relay could be the issue as in corroded contacts (could be cleaned / burnished if top can be popped of and replaced, or better to replace entirely with new) or if the capacitors in the relay circuit have now gone off value due to age and recent use. Clicking was hopeful, but if stopped clicking, the control circuit is now suspect, a recap and check of the transistors and resistors in that section would be appropriate, as well as a cleaning of the relay contacts. Also, measuring the DC offset at the relay speaker terminals "in" (before the relay contacts) would be useful to see if the DC offset is greater than 200mV, which is a typical triggering level for the relay to stay open, not closed.
If its military, thanks for your service! Not many use the word deployed for routine work, although in many service industries (utility, firefighting, especially forest fires) for example) I suppose it might.
True, most solid state designs have a resistor / wire inductor at the output to present a residual load to the amp section to protect it. The more important issue will be whether there is DC offset in excess of 50-200mV that is preventing (correctly) the relay from operating, or the relay control circuit has now gone wonky - which isn't unexpected in a 40 year old unit which has probably been tested / turned on a bunch of times in the last few months after possibly being in storage, or began to fail recently after some years of faithful use.
Such is the life and fun of troubleshooting vintage equipment. And yes, every piece of even "new" equipment, becomes old and vintage in their lives (if not put into the e-waste), so this thread can be added to the help everyone in basic troubleshooting and restoration.
Agreed 1000X, but I think we are just at the beginning and OP will be progressing on with his work on this unit. As in my post above, will be good to add the DeOxit Red/Gold to his tool box and use it for all switches, selector switch contacts, potentiometer (pots) controls, and RCA jack/plug surfaces.
Oh, one thing to point out - the phono section contacts and selector sections are really important to keep clean. This section is dealing with 0.5-7 mV (milliVolts) tops so any corrosion here is a huge problem. The Tuner/Aux/Tape sections more commonly deal with line level voltage on the order of 200-2000mV (0.2-2.0 V) and so can sometimes "power" through a thin level of contact surface corrosion.
Similarly, the speaker protection relay surfaces (sometimes silver or gold plated, and dealing with ) and muting relays (low level signal switching relay, similarly coated, on some types of units) can be corroded and develop intermittent signal passage. This is usually found when turning up the volume and there is no signal, then a "pop" and signal return when the volume is turned up considerably. However, this is at great risk to the speaker if a high level signal (from 2 to 15V) is suddenly let through, so be careful if you attempt this test.
Better to check the DC offsets at the speaker relay input, and get the relay circuit working consistently (clicking), and then see what's up before then going in to clean/burnish the relay contact surfaces or replace the relay.
Search for the AK thread on Idiot's Guide to using DeOxit. Very helpful thread.
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CAIG Laboratories, Inc.
12200 Thatcher Court
Poway, CA 92064
Tel: (858) 486-8388
info@caig.com | www.caig.com
I'm the CAIG Labs representative and I will be happy to help you with CAIG/DeoxIT related questions.
For direction to clean using DeoxIT products, please visit our Audio/Video 9-1-1 :
https://system.netsuite.com/core/me...gCAn6h9n0m&vid=RrqKWugCAoKh9sgD&cktime=131864
If you are looking for DeoxIT or other CAIG products, here are some websites to get them at discounted pricing:
1. www.mcmelectronics.com with promo code: CAIG15
2. http://www.parts-express.com/brand/caig-laboratories/30
3. www.amazon.com
CAIG Laboratories, Inc.
12200 Thatcher Court
Poway, CA 92064
Tel: (858) 486-8388
info@caig.com | www.caig.com
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KingBubba
"Too Much Stuff"
By this time in its life cycle you should also look at the bottom of the big capacitors to see if they are leaking, or getting ready to leak. Mine went at least eight years ago. Don't meter test anything inside until you get mini grabbers for your meter. I'd tell you why, but it is a long story.
Hello - I'm kind of the same situation - I hear the click but no power light. and no sound. But before I ask too many questions ,I really should check the fuses and can't find the correct hex driver for the volume knob. Do you know the size of the hex screw in the volume knob? That way I can go to my local ACE hard ware store and be able to access the internal parts of this unit at least check the fuses to start. Then I can follow some of the greatly appreciated post on this subject. Just checking Thank you
cademan
Lunatic Member
You don't need to remove the volume knob on the 9500II to get to the fuses. It has a metal cage with only four screws, two on each side.
I also own this integrated amp and if you are hearing the relay click, then the amp portion is most likely 99.99 percent ok.
I had mine apart recently for a recap and forgot to see how many fuses it has but I know mine were good. I'll have to see if I still have the 9500II schematic on my other computer to see if there is a fuse for the front end.
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Thank you - That works. Now what I have to do is find out why the relay clicks but there is no power light or sound.
Thank you
I see 2 fuses and they test to have continuity (in circuit.)
cademan
Lunatic Member
Could be that the power light is burned out. Does it have jumpers in the Main in / Pre out jacks?
Pull up one side of a fuse to test. Testing the fuses in circuit will just test other things also in line with the fuses.