Sony PS-4300 cueing fluid..?
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jleon92f
Addicted Member
Hi,
It is time to add some damping to the cueing on my PS-4300. Is there an easy way to do this without taking the whole arm apart?:scratch2:
John.
Sorry to bump and old thread, but I could never get an answer on it either and I searched for days before CAREFULLY trying something on my own:
I laid the turntable on it's side, held up by the open dust cover and was able to let the tonearm assembly slide out with plenty of room to access the mechanism and unscrew the little hex screw. YMMV as I don't know how consistent they were when it comes to the length of the wires, and of course you want to be very gentle with it in the process. But it worked great for me, and now my TT is functioning perfect. Here's a pic so you can see what I mean:
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AFAIK, that table doesn't have fluid - it uses a sloped plastic cam that the lift post rides on. I think VE has the service manual.
I'm not sure about fluid, but if you look at the mechanism, which is the same the ops TT, removing that set screw, adding the silicone oil (which is more like a grease, but is called oil) to the shaft behind that screw, and at the bottom around that spring fixed my issue of the arm dropping like a brick. (and actually bouncing off the record)
My only point in posting this here is that many are under the impression that the only way to get to that is by removing the tonearm completely, requiring removing and resoldering the tiny tonearm wires. I don't trust my soldering skills with wires that tiny so I was showing others that they might be able to fix this without going through all that provided the tonearm wires are long enough.
Whatever grease they put on there originally had dried to the point that the tonearm wouldn't drop at all until I cleaned it, but then it dropped to fast. The thick (like honey) silicone oil makes it operate nice and smooth.
I posted this here because the OP was asking if there was a way to do it without having to desolder the wires. While he may have already fixed this issue, I wanted anyone else searching for this issue to see that they may have another option.
Also, I have all the manuals available on VE for this TT. (which by the way say that this TT has been lubricated by the manufacturer and requires no additional lubrication - I guess they didn't expect them to last this long. I couldn't find anything about lubrication in the service manuals either)
My only point in posting this here is that many are under the impression that the only way to get to that is by removing the tonearm completely, requiring removing and resoldering the tiny tonearm wires. I don't trust my soldering skills with wires that tiny so I was showing others that they might be able to fix this without going through all that provided the tonearm wires are long enough.
Whatever grease they put on there originally had dried to the point that the tonearm wouldn't drop at all until I cleaned it, but then it dropped to fast. The thick (like honey) silicone oil makes it operate nice and smooth.
I posted this here because the OP was asking if there was a way to do it without having to desolder the wires. While he may have already fixed this issue, I wanted anyone else searching for this issue to see that they may have another option.
Also, I have all the manuals available on VE for this TT. (which by the way say that this TT has been lubricated by the manufacturer and requires no additional lubrication - I guess they didn't expect them to last this long. I couldn't find anything about lubrication in the service manuals either)
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Raccoon1400
Super Member
They do use damping oil, 300000wt is what I use. I've do it in those tables. You do have to take quite a bit apart.
That is exactly what I used. It was given to me by another member here on AK, however as shown in my pic, applying the oil required nothing more than removing the three screws holding the tonearm assembly down, and letting it gently slide out of the hole.
But, as I said in my post, I don't know if everyone's tonearm wires will be long enough to allow this, I don't know how consistent they were with that in manufacturing, especially since the lateral weight on my other turntable (same model) is further from the "lift rail" than on this one, but it's worth checking before trying to solder those tiny wires.
As a side note, you seem familiar with these... my other one has a problem with the motor spinning up without a little manual help. Do you have any advice on that? I'm wondering if some of the levers may need cleaning/lubing, and also if the motor itself can be lubed at all. I can't find any information on working on these BSL motors and the user manual specifically says not to mess with the 3 screws on the bottom of the motor.
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Thanks for the picture.
My pleasure... just trying to help newbies like me. I figured you'd probably got it fixed by now, but thought others might find this thread and get help. There doesn't seem to be a lot of info on these things, and at least for me, they're pretty complex.
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As an update, I tried packing 200,000 cst silicone grease (the heaviest my local hobby shop had in stock) into the cueing mechanism of my PS-4300, it had minimal impact on the dropping speed of the arm. I just ordered some 500,000 cst to see packing some of that in with the 200k will improve things.
Update 2: the 500k cst grease arrived, I packed as much as I could in on top of the existing 200k cst. It still drops faster than I'd like, but no bounce now. After its cycled a number of times and has had a chance to mix in as much as possible, I'll take it apart and add more 500k cst.
melofelo
Addicted Member
Also try a small tub of plumbers silicone grease..usually about £3 on this side of the pond for a 30ml container..(enough for a lifetime).
Worked a treat on my akai ap-206...and other arms that do not use a silcone oil reservoir but simply a piston in an open ended bearing sleeve ( sometimes metal or sometimes a plastic moulding which forms part of the upper plinth but is open at both ends) .
The thickness of plumber's grease is somewhere between vaseline and honey..i.e it will flow but not drip and this consistency gives just the right amount of resistance for cueing systems that rely on the mechanical friction of the silicone alone to slow the arm down as opposed to displacing a thinner silicone liquid inside a sealed piston.
Worked a treat on my akai ap-206...and other arms that do not use a silcone oil reservoir but simply a piston in an open ended bearing sleeve ( sometimes metal or sometimes a plastic moulding which forms part of the upper plinth but is open at both ends) .
The thickness of plumber's grease is somewhere between vaseline and honey..i.e it will flow but not drip and this consistency gives just the right amount of resistance for cueing systems that rely on the mechanical friction of the silicone alone to slow the arm down as opposed to displacing a thinner silicone liquid inside a sealed piston.
Pulled it apart again last night. This time I used a small medical syringe to force the 500k cst grease into the opening on the cueing cylinder, making sure it got in around the grooves on the shaft. Still a bit faster than some of my other auto tables, but significantly improved from the previous behavior. I'm not scared of it damaging a stylus or a record anymore.
beedub
Active Member
Sam, I have been asked to do this for someone on a 4300. Did you pull the arm up as in the pic by mrkmpn, unscrew the set screw and inject the very heavy weight grease? or put it in from the top?
I injected my Technics 1700 from the top, that went well.
basically, could you give a little more detail on how did you proceed, please? thanks, bw
I did it the same way as the photos. The 4300 is very good at standing on it's side without falling over, and there is plenty of slack in the tonearm wires to move the tonearm base up (or sideways, when it's standing on edge) to get access to that screw. I packed 500k CST silicone grease in a syringe, and used that to force it into the opening while manually moving the lift up and down. I tried 200k CST at first, and it didn't provide any damping effect.
The screw for the grease refill is on the side of the brass tube under the arm base, just above the spring. It's a small metric Allen head set screw.
beedub
Active Member
Thanks, Sam. I looked at it briefly tonight but it seemed to catch on something as i tried to pull it out. it came a little. .Will try again later.
did you take anything else off or loosen something or??
also, i cannot see my gears etc, did you take the cover off them? mine has the plastic cover over 1/2 the tt including gears.
did you take anything else off or loosen something or??
also, i cannot see my gears etc, did you take the cover off them? mine has the plastic cover over 1/2 the tt including gears.
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All I did was remove the three screws on top of the arm and lift it out enough to see that set screw in the side of the lift mechanism. If memory serves, you might have to move the arm assembly around a bit to get it free of the plinth. There should be enough slack in the arm wires to let you move it out about 2-3".
