SX-1010 won't Power On...

[D.E.K]

4 caps and 2 transistors??? How come I circled 8 components then? What is extra?

 

[markthefixer]

4 caps and 2 transistors??? How come I circled 8 components then? What is extra?

The two orange? brown? ones circled in the center are extra IF THE ONES ON YOURS LOOK LIKE THAT - (I momentarily forgot that wasn't a picture of your board) - I specified replacements for those caps because some of the time (depending upon the model number) Pioneer used electrolytic caps there, the + in the schematic means polarized cap - which is almost always electrolytic, which would need to be replaced. If not, then use the better caps you got from mouser - non-polarized.

Sometimes the locations where the circled orange cap are, use electrolytic caps instead of those, which can stay.. Those are solid caps that don't deteriorate and can stay. Until eyes are on the caps, you never know what they used. The replacement film caps and the orange caps don't have a polarity - almost everything else does.

I didn't feel you would be comfortable trying to identify every replacement component that might not be needed before ordering.

P.s. I think I may link to these picture posts a bit, between showing the labels and the component details in the pictures, they're great...
I HAD wanted to go get a ztx1056 to see if the lettering was on the curved or flat sides of the transistor. I have to remember that its' opposite most others.... the lettering is usually on the flat. I edited my post back there to fix the lead layout description. Your quote still has my error in it, I am unable to fix that.

 

[D.E.K]

The pictures I circled all the components and discussed on was LBW's board anyway. Here is MY PP Board:

As you can see, the ones I circled in YELLOW on my board are different than the Orange (Brown) ones on LBW's board.

P.S: The lettering is on the CURVED side of ztx1056.

 

[markthefixer]

The pictures I circled all the components and discussed on was LBW's board anyway. I will get back to that subject with my own PP Board in a minute. Meanwhile, is the SUPED-UP list of parts above sufficient or do you need more details?

No more details....

I momentarily forgot it was somebody else's board when I was posting.

Yes, the caps you circled in yellow get replaced.... so the count is 8 components on YOUR protection board.

P.S: The lettering is on the CURVED side of ztx1056

Yes, as I discovered in the picture.... our posts are crossing TOO quickly. And both are being edited too.

 

[D.E.K]

While I am all the way up to my neck in it, I wanted to study the Service Manual a little as well and learn to take it as guide if needed. Might be more accurate and a tad bit more technical than "the yellow circled ones" or "the ones circled in the middle". I flipped the shot because it was kind of bassackwards:

So you want me to replace C3, C4, Q7, C6, C5, Q6, C1 and C2 is that right?

 

[markthefixer]

Yes. Correct. Bass ackwards, or foil side versus component side.. usually when hunting foil pads to desolder, the first (bass ackwards) is the useful one.... we spend most of our time on the foil side.... and I learned long ago to read backwards as well... but not sdrawkcab.



page 19 post 273
sx-1010 AWM062 protection board
two:Q6, Q7 522-ZTX1056A $1.51 ea NPN TO-92E ebc 150v 3a 1w (Vce(sat)=0.3v @ 3a) 120mhz 30-1200 hfe relay driver transistor
one: C6 100uf/16v (100/35) 647-UPW1V101MPD $0.15 protection circuit timing capacitor
one: C5 4.7uf/25v (4.7/100) 647-UPW2A4R7MDD $0.23 protection circuit ac power on signal integrator
two: C1, C2 0.22uf /10v (0.22uf/50v) 598-DSF050J224 $0.50 ea over-current integrators. polyester film capacitors!!!
two: C3, C4 330uf/25v (330/25) 647-UPW1E331MPD $0.51 ea
one: new part 512-1n4004 conventional rectifier 1a 400v $0.06 ea

eventually I will add the Q designations on each of the replacement transistors as well:

page 9 post 124
sx-1010 AWH032 amplifier board x 2 boards
Q1 Q2 Q3 2sa726 to-92 bce : 512-KSA992FBU (ln)to-92 ecb 120v .05a .5w 100mhz 150-800hfe
Q4 2sb528 to-202? bce : 512-KSA910YBU to-92 ecb 150v .05a .8w 100mhz 40-240hfe
Q5 Q6 2sc1451 to-39 npn ebc : 512-KSC2310YBU to-92 ecb 150v .05a .8w 100mhz 40-240hfe
Q8 2sb528 to-202? bce : 512-KSA1220AYS to-126 ecb 160 1.2a 20w 155mhz 35-320hfe
Q7 2sd358 to-202? bce : 512-KSC2690AYS to-126 ecb 160 1.2a 20w 155mhz 35-320hfe
Q10 2sa740 to-220 bce : 512-KSA940TU_Q pnp to-220 bce 150v 1.5a 25w 4mhz 40-140hfe
Q9 2sc1448 to-220 bce P: 512-KSC2073TU npn to-220 bce 150v 1.5a 25w 4mhz 40-140hfe
Q12 2sa733 to-92 ecb : 512-KSA992FBU (ln)to-92 ecb 120v .05a .5w 100mhz 150-800hfe
Q11 2sc945 to-92 ecb : 512-KSC1845EBU (ln)to-92 ecb 120v .05a .5w 100mhz 150-800hfe

C4 : 647-UPW1V100MDD ($0.11 ea) 10uf 35v (quantity:3) ****** two for the power amp
C1 : 5989-100V.68-F (0.67 each) 0.068uf 100v (quantity:3) ***** two for the power amp


I went and dug up what I needed from previous posts to get you going..

edit: I missed C8, 330uf 6v times two. drat...

 

[D.E.K]

Very well. There are a lot of obstacles to overcome till I get to the PA boards. Let's see if I will be able to tackle the PP Board first without frying it to kingdom come, damaging any components, blowing up the whole unit etc. Tomorrow I will try to find some of that isopropyl alcohol locally, I don't like that residual rosin one bit. And I will study the components a little more and make sure that I got everything right as to what part goes where, polarities etc. After the final confirmation from you, I will head down to the basement and bury myself into the receiver. As for now, I will call it a night. I will be talking to you tomorrow.

 

[D.E.K]

Do you think I should use alligator clips (heat sink purpose) on the transistor leads between the body and the circuit board? Out of experience, I might hold the hot iron on the leads longer than expected, I doubt it though, leading the transistors to fry. Or can they take a nice bit of heat if it came to that?

 

[D.E.K]

I'll pass on the alcohol, the smallest amount they sell is 1 Liter (I'd wander around drunk for weeks with that) and nevermind the alligator clips, the board is going to be much harder to work on than I expected. I thought it was larger. I haven't the slightest idea of the location of the new part (512-1n4004 conventional rectifier 1a 400v )?!?!?

 

[D.E.K]

The supports are pinched gently in above the board until the board will slide up top the pinch point and the board wiggled up a bit to the pinch point, repeating at each of the corners in a circular fashion, working around the corners gradually.

Get the board into a comfortable position for front and back access and then try not to flex the wires. I work on the receivers with them on their sides, transformer down, on a lazy susan turntable. Your best acccess should be directed at the solder side of the board. Be careful not to drip solder elsewhere into the unit.

Match up the values (uF) of the can shaped capacitors old to new (it's printed right on them and what I was looking for with the list - like 330uF 25v not 647-UPW1E331MPD) and notice that there is a stripe on each of the cans which denotes the negative terminal. As you remove the old, look for a plus(+) silk screened / printed on the board by the other capacitor wire, and put the stripe of the new cap in the same place.

Sometimes the locations where the circled orange cap are, use electrolytic caps instead of those, which can stay.. Those are solid caps that don't deteriorate and can stay. Until eyes are on the caps, you never know what they used. The replacement film caps and the orange caps don't have a polarity - almost everything else does.

The transistors are read C - B - E with the lettering facing you,the flat facing away, and the leads facing down. The E for the transistor symbol has the arrow, and the B is the line that the arrow is pointing away from (for an npn transistor, on a pnp the arrow points AT the line) and the C is the other line connecting to the B.

Every component that is removed on the board (4 caps and 2 transistors) has a replacement.

Like I said we get the protection working, then we start on the amp.

Okay, I am clear on the C - B - E leads though the "Arrow" you mentioned, I don't know about. The only thing I see on the board under the transistors are green circles that resemble arrows:

First, I don't know how to take a reference point on the arrows and second, they are smudged with white matter that makes them really hard to see. Below on ZeroJunk's Board the green arrows under the transistors are much more visible:

 

[D.E.K]

Okay, bare with me here. I'm studying, I'm studying.

Knowing what transistors I have are PNP and what ones are NPN, I now can figure out what leads go where. IF I can see the arrows on the board, like I said, they're not very visible.

 

[ZeroJunk]

Well, the orientation is on the schematic you posted. Just remember you are looking at it from the bottom.

 

[markthefixer]

two:Q6, Q7 522-ZTX1056A $1.51 ea NPN TO-92E ebc 150v 3a 1w (Vce(sat)=0.3v @ 3a) 120mhz 30-1200 hfe relay driver transistor

eventually I will add the Q designations on each of the replacement transistors as well:

page 9 post 124
sx-1010 AWH032 amplifier board x 2 boards
Q1 Q2 Q3 2sa726 to-92 bce : 512-KSA992FBU (ln)to-92 ecb 120v .05a .5w 100mhz 150-800hfe
Q4 2sb528 to-202? bce : 512-KSA910YBU to-92 ecb 150v .05a .8w 100mhz 40-240hfe
Q5 Q6 2sc1451 to-39 npn ebc : 512-KSC2310YBU to-92 ecb 150v .05a .8w 100mhz 40-240hfe
Q8 2sb528 to-202? bce : 512-KSA1220AYS to-126 ecb 160 1.2a 20w 155mhz 35-320hfe
Q7 2sd358 to-202? bce : 512-KSC2690AYS to-126 ecb 160 1.2a 20w 155mhz 35-320hfe
Q10 2sa740 to-220 bce : 512-KSA940TU_Q pnp to-220 bce 150v 1.5a 25w 4mhz 40-140hfe
Q9 2sc1448 to-220 bce P: 512-KSC2073TU npn to-220 bce 150v 1.5a 25w 4mhz 40-140hfe
Q12 2sa733 to-92 ecb : 512-KSA992FBU (ln)to-92 ecb 120v .05a .5w 100mhz 150-800hfe
Q11 2sc945 to-92 ecb : 512-KSC1845EBU (ln)to-92 ecb 120v .05a .5w 100mhz 150-800hfe
at...

Those pictures are useful guides, but in some cases the lead order is different, which is why I usually list the original transistor's arrangement and the replacements arrangement. Highlighted in red in the quote.

edit:

HOLY COW!!!!!!! Lookit all those SALT RINGS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I've never seen it like that before.

edit2: and those DREADED baby blue Sanyo caps!!! 0.22uf 10v (.22/10) shows up clearly on them!! Oh that POOR ABUSED sx-1010..... (no reflection on you D.E.K - just that place on the planet)

 

[D.E.K]

Are we sure they are salt rings? If they are, that means someone, some MORON, threw it into a corner by the ocean where the conditions are extremely damp. I might as well get that 1 Liter of alcohol and start cleaning once I desolder all the parts THEN solder the new ones on.

 

[markthefixer]

I haven't the slightest idea of the location of the new part (512-1n4004 conventional rectifier 1a 400v )?!?!?

It shows up on zerojunk's picture you just posted, near the Q7 transistor you circled, it's soldered to pins 9 (red wire) & 10 (tan wire).

Are we sure they are salt rings? If they are, that means someone, some MORON, threw it into a corner by the ocean where the conditions are extremely damp. I might as well get that 1 Liter of alcohol and start cleaning once I desolder all the parts THEN solder the new ones on.

The transistor symbols are obscured by the ring deposits, try a wet (water) q-tip / swab to clean it up to show the transistor symbol's arrow clearly. Swab around it, if it comes up, you have your answer about the cleaning - but I'm not sure how well alcohol cleans salt. Might just have to use several applications of water to cut the salinity in the cleaning fluid.

In retrospect, a sealed plastic bag during storage would have helped, but it's too late now.

 

[D.E.K]

Mark, this is a quote of yours:

Match up the values (uF) of the can shaped capacitors old to new (it's printed right on them and what I was looking for with the list - like 330uF 25v not 647-UPW1E331MPD) and notice that there is a stripe on each of the cans which denotes the negative terminal. As you remove the old, look for a plus(+) silk screened / printed on the board by the other capacitor wire, and put the stripe of the new cap in the same place.

According to your quote, I should look for the PLUS (+) on the board and put the NEGATIVE (-) lead of the capacitor (striped side) in there???

 

[markthefixer]

Mark, this is a quote of yours:

Match up the values (uF) of the can shaped capacitors old to new (it's printed right on them and what I was looking for with the list - like 330uF 25v not 647-UPW1E331MPD) and notice that there is a stripe on each of the cans which denotes the negative terminal. As you remove the old, look for a plus(+) silk screened / printed on the board by the other capacitor wire, and put the stripe of the new cap in the same place.

According to your quote, I should look for the PLUS (+) on the board and put the NEGATIVE (-) lead of the capacitor (striped side) in there???

Nope, plus lead to plus hole unless the factory deliberately reversed it, which is what needs to be checked...

Sorry, Bad phrasing:

Match up the values (uF) of the can shaped capacitors old to new (it's printed right on them and what I was looking for with the list - like 330uF 25v not 647-UPW1E331MPD) and notice that there is a stripe on each of the cans which denotes the negative terminal. As you remove the old cap, look for a plus(+) silk screened / printed on the board by the other(the wire further from the stripe on the cap) capacitor wire(to see if the board's markings correspond to the way the factory installed it, but if different, the actual factory installation wins), and put the stripe of the new cap in the same orientation as the stripe of the old cap.. the longer lead (on a NEW cap) or the lead furthest from the stripe is the plus lead that usually goes in the plus marked hole - unless the factory did it the opposite way - as determined by the stripe / plus orientation when you removed the old capacitor

 

[D.E.K]

No need to be sorry about the phrasing. There is a s@#*! load of stuff going on here causing some mix-ups. Anyway, I wasn't really going to put (-) lead to the (+) hole anyway unless, like you said, if that is default. As I take comoponents out, I will take photos. 1-3 photos for EACH component. Also, the salt rings are stubbarn but they are coming off with a damp cuetip. I will have to clean around each hole upon removal of the cap/transistor in that hole.

 

[D.E.K]

Here are the pictures of EACH original unit while they are ON BOARD, a basic visual guide for the beginner. This way I can see lettering on the units, what leads are in what hole, polarites etc:

C1:

C2:

C3:

C4:

C5:

C6:

Q6:

Q7:

 

[D.E.K]

The only ones that are making me nervous are the Q6 and Q7. They are three leggers and relatively small compared to the others. We'll see how it goes. I am planning on removing ALL 8 units then put all 8 replacement units in the holes (hopefully all leads in right holes) and then solder them back on in one shot without flipping over the board a thousand times. I will confirm with you while I am placing the new parts on the board and make sure everything is right. And you said the replacements for the DREADED baby blue Sanyo caps (0.22uf 10v (.22/10) which are C1 and C2 do NOT have polarity correct? I am asking because the baby blues have polarity (-) marked on them and the board itself has (+) marked on it. Just making sure.