Homework Assignment:
Someone model it in comparison to 4430's 5 cuft. and post the findings....
Zilch's AK Design Collaborative - Econowave Speaker
- Thread starter Zilch
- Start date
Tuned to 27 Hz in 184 liters (~6.5 ft^3):
F3 of right at 30 Hz.
27 Hz tuning, 142 liters (5 ft^3):
F3 of about 35 Hz.
Regards,
Gordon.
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2235 in 6.5 to 7 ft^3, with a port tuning of around 22-24 Hz, with a few dB of boost at around 23-24 Hz ("assist"- centered just a tad above the port tuning frequency), gets darn close to 20 Hz with decent power handling. No, it won't "thump" at 40-80 Hz like the same woofer in a smaller box, but IMHO, it's loud enough and sounds REALLY good down there...
Regards,
Gordon.
Regards,
Gordon.
BlueFlyingV
Tin Knocker
Just got myself 4 HPM-100's. Im pretty sure at least one pair is going to get the E-Wave treatment. :yes:
hhibrownsbac
Super Member
Thanks GordonW and Zilch, that info made up my mind to go with it. Its probably gonna be closer to 6CF after bracing but it still should be right. I also might try out this Behringer 3400 I got a month ago (and still havent fired up)till i get a better grasp of tweeking these EW crossovers. Now if JBL would just hurry up and send me my waveguides, hehehehe. Maybe they will get here before the weekend as Im curious to see how these B&C DE610s are gonna work out.
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borus
Luthier tube guy
Ok guys
While working on the Jbl Ewaves I got these advents that are suppose to be /1's but the crossover does not seem right. Neither does the box but I needed the advent woofers for the DQ-10's I got with the wrong woofers. The fried egg tweeters are green and will be sold. As a experiment I put some KLH woofers and tweeters in one box and A/B'd them vs the other box with Advent parts. They matched up vary well. So I'm changing the boxes to be pseudo KLH-6's. I think the Crossover design for the <95 will work OK but I am sure it will need some tweaking. Any thoughts ???
Borus
While working on the Jbl Ewaves I got these advents that are suppose to be /1's but the crossover does not seem right. Neither does the box but I needed the advent woofers for the DQ-10's I got with the wrong woofers. The fried egg tweeters are green and will be sold. As a experiment I put some KLH woofers and tweeters in one box and A/B'd them vs the other box with Advent parts. They matched up vary well. So I'm changing the boxes to be pseudo KLH-6's. I think the Crossover design for the <95 will work OK but I am sure it will need some tweaking. Any thoughts ???
Borus
Try it and see. I do have a KLH-6 woofer here if you get into difficulty.
Russellc
Addicted Member
I love that driver! I didnt realize it was in an "undersized box" with the B 380. Isnt it about 5 cu ft as well? I guess its more flexible than I knew.:yes:
Russellc
doucanoe
Registered Audio Abuser
I think I have the right thread this time so here goes, cut and paste from the wrong one 
Hey Zilch/Jack,
I finally gathered up enough pieces parts to cobble together the high efficiency woofer crossovers and got one side done this morning. I only wanted to do one side so I could compare and contrast with my makeshift crossover.
Thought I had it sounding pretty good as is, but after listening to them all afternoon now, I would have to say my tempo. falls flat (pardon the pun) in comparison.
Fun project, Nice work fellas!
RC
Hey Zilch/Jack,
I finally gathered up enough pieces parts to cobble together the high efficiency woofer crossovers and got one side done this morning. I only wanted to do one side so I could compare and contrast with my makeshift crossover.
Thought I had it sounding pretty good as is, but after listening to them all afternoon now, I would have to say my tempo. falls flat (pardon the pun) in comparison.
Fun project, Nice work fellas!
RC
As Zilch mentioned, JBL got away with this, by using an "assisted" alignment... effectively, a "pseudo-B6", using electrical boost in the rumble-filter/EQ highpass inside the BX63/BX63A crossover supplied with the B380 and B460.
In these, the box is a little small, the port tuning is quite low (IIRC, around 23 Hz?), and there is boost applied (IIRC, around 25 Hz?) by way of making the rumble filter highpass high-Q... causing a "peaking" of 1-2dB above flat in the electrical response response of the crossover just above roll-off, which handily "props up" the trailing-down woofer response approaching the port frequency... making the response virtually flat right down to the port frequency (23 Hz, IIRC).
Of course, this requires a bit more power from the amp at very low frequencies... but, with a woofer system of around 93dB sensitivity, a little more power might mean you need 160 watts rather than 120 watts to knock the pictures off the walls...
Not a big increase in power needed. A good tradeoff, IMHO. Regards,
Gordon.
doucanoe
Registered Audio Abuser
borus
Luthier tube guy
Update to Zilch
"I do have a KLH-6 woofer here if you get into difficulty"
These woofers I'll be using are from new KLH Fives My old "5's" have much heaver woofers IIRC the "6's" and "5's" shared the same woofer in the later group manufactured. This is way I said Sudo 6's as they are really 2 way Fives with Waveguides on the top end. Still might need the help though. Will have pics buy the weekend.
Borus
"I do have a KLH-6 woofer here if you get into difficulty"
These woofers I'll be using are from new KLH Fives My old "5's" have much heaver woofers IIRC the "6's" and "5's" shared the same woofer in the later group manufactured. This is way I said Sudo 6's as they are really 2 way Fives with Waveguides on the top end. Still might need the help though. Will have pics buy the weekend.
Borus
Russellc
Addicted Member
Buried in this thread somewhere Wayne P posted a chart of several values and their amount of attenuation. If someone finds it, might not be a bad idea to post a link to it on page 1. I'll see if I can find it again, I've looked it up several times!
Russellc
Wayne Parham
Active Member
RRC networks and component values
Here 'tis:
Might be useful to link my Crossover Document too, because that's what the E-Wave crossover is based on. It shows various network topologies used in speakers like these and compares them using Spice. I've seen it posted in this thread too, way back when Jack and Zilch were first ironing out the E-Wave crossover. But it's probably pretty much lost in the archives.
I think my Crossover Document is useful not only as a study in various network arrangements but also for historical perspective, because it shows how and why I came up with the RRC approach for constant directivity horns. Prior to that, passive crossovers for CD horns were much more complex, using transformers, peaking coils and/or other LRC approaches to obtain the desired transfer function. I pioneered the RRC approach that's now used in the E-Wave crossover and other similar designs (including my own, of course).
Here 'tis:
Might be useful to link my Crossover Document too, because that's what the E-Wave crossover is based on. It shows various network topologies used in speakers like these and compares them using Spice. I've seen it posted in this thread too, way back when Jack and Zilch were first ironing out the E-Wave crossover. But it's probably pretty much lost in the archives.
I think my Crossover Document is useful not only as a study in various network arrangements but also for historical perspective, because it shows how and why I came up with the RRC approach for constant directivity horns. Prior to that, passive crossovers for CD horns were much more complex, using transformers, peaking coils and/or other LRC approaches to obtain the desired transfer function. I pioneered the RRC approach that's now used in the E-Wave crossover and other similar designs (including my own, of course).
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doucanoe
Registered Audio Abuser
Wayne, I have been going over your crossover paper for the past few weeks now trying to get a better handle on my next project. Ron S. had forwarded the url address to me well over a year ago now. The speaker project I was working on at the time took a turn in a different direction so I put in down for the time being.
With that complete, I am in the process of starting another project using the JBL 2226 and 650Hz round Tractrix in a two way with some version of the 4 Pi x-over.
Needless to say, I have had my head back in your crossover doc. again :yes:
Great work and thanks!
RC