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Zilch's AK Design Collaborative - Econowave Speaker

Well Satcom, it's hard to make any informative suggestions as to what to do with that box without knowing the dimensions to determine the internal volume.....which when working in reverse at designing a speaker is a fixed value and the woofer needs to be chosen for bass extension in a given volume. My first thoughts when looking without knowing would be to make a new baffle for the front of that box and laminate over the existing one, but before doing so add some internal bracing with scrap hardwood across the sides and one or two from the front to back. The existing hole says turn me upside down to get the woofer closer to the waveguide, which i'd mount on top of the existing box with the lip overlapping the top of the new baffle.....better alignment of the drivers acoustic centers. After cutting a new hole for the right woofer, stuffing or dampning can be added to the inside through the hole. A port hole can be added later once the right diameter port is determined (dependant on box volume and woofer parameters of course!)

So there's a starting point for you on a journey to join the Ewave Elite. A steady methodology following those that have gone before you in this thread is the road to Nirvana.
 
The baffle's already flush front, and a waveguide may fit above the existing woofer opening without making a new one. What's the diameter of that, the distance to the top of the cabinet, and the cabinet width? Are those ports behind the little grilles? If so, how big are they actually? Are there ducts behind them? Also provide the internal dimensions of the cab.... :yes:
 
Well here's what they looked like before they were...em....gutted?
I had a pair similiar when i was in high school. They were pretty darn good speakers for their day.

pioneercs1.jpg


That's a 15" woofer so i'd say rough dimensions are 18x30x12 or about 2.8 cuft.......perfect for just about any of the Ewave trap cab 12" woofers. The existing hole's too big for a 12" so i think a new baffle's in order.:yes:

You could mount the WG IN the existing box as Zilch said, but i like the look of the top mounted variants.....
 
If that's an opening for a 15" woofer, the first thing I'd be thinking to do is recess a 12" in it with a split speaker ring and hope there's enough room for the QSC waveguide above it.... :thmbsp:
 
My kids will go gaga over those when they are 54 years old. Those are going to be rare....in that good of shape.
 
790 pages, wow where to start?!

This is a very interesting solution, and I wonder if it might be something that would work out for what I'm working on.

I'm putting together a mono radio system for my office. I've got a Fisher FM-50 mono tuner, and I'm going to use a small tube amplifier likely from a console, 10-20W in power.

I've picked up an old Hammond extension speaker cabinet, which is 21.5"x11x16.5 with a 12" speaker fitted. It is a simple open back cabinet.

Although on the small side, it does have a good bit of room above the 12 driver for another driver.

I have been considering changing out the existing Rola 12" speaker with something like an EV 12TRX or other coaxial, which I'm sure would sound fine.

But this project intrigued me.

So, I wonder if I were to put a 12" driver like an EV PS-12, then one of these "econoguide" tweeters, how that would sound in this little open backed cabinet.

Has anyone done something similar?

Also, does someone have a link to a page in this or another thread that summarizes the final confuration/specs for the econowave parts?

Thanks,
Al
 
Don't see why is wouldn't work. I assume you meant EV SP 12. We are playing with a pair of those right now in this app. The concern of some (not me) is that the SP12 will not go high enough to blend well with the WG. However, I've had SP12s in OB with a tweeter crossed at 3500hz and see no problem crossing them over at 1600hz.
 
djnagle said:
Don't see why is wouldn't work. I assume you meant EV SP 12. We are playing with a pair of those right now in this app. The concern of some (not me) is that the SP12 will not go high enough to blend well with the WG. However, I've had SP12s in OB with a tweeter crossed at 3500hz and see no problem crossing them over at 1600hz.
Click to expand...

:lurk:
 
SP12 with Econowave versus 12TRXB coaxial

djnagle said:
Don't see why is wouldn't work. I assume you meant EV SP 12. We are playing with a pair of those right now in this app. The concern of some (not me) is that the SP12 will not go high enough to blend well with the WG. However, I've had SP12s in OB with a tweeter crossed at 3500hz and see no problem crossing them over at 1600hz.
Click to expand...

Ah great, and yes I meant the SP12, probably SP12B due to the open cabinet :thmbsp:


I'd be very interested in hearing if anyone has compared an SP12(b) with Econowave solution to a single coaxial 12TRXB solution. I know the T35 is considered a somewhat harsh and limited tweeter, but I wonder how vast the difference is audibly as compared to the Econowave solution especially when considering the advantage of the "point source" coax function of the 12TRXB.

Thanks again!
Al
 
Those Hammond cabinets sealed up would only be 1.3 cu. ft. empty. They would look great with matching cabinets on top for the JBL waveguide, like baby 19's! I have two of them. Now you got me thinkin' ----
 
little-al said:
Ah great, and yes I meant the SP12, probably SP12B due to the open cabinet :thmbsp:


I'd be very interested in hearing if anyone has compared an SP12(b) with Econowave solution to a single coaxial 12TRXB solution. I know the T35 is considered a somewhat harsh and limited tweeter, but I wonder how vast the difference is audibly as compared to the Econowave solution especially when considering the advantage of the "point source" coax function of the 12TRXB.

Thanks again!
Al
Click to expand...

I'll give you my point of view on that. I've owned lots of T35s. I now have none. I've build 4 pairs of ewaves & have 2 more in the works. It's not even close.
 
I have built 4 sets of ewave now and find them too an exceptional platform to design from and listen to! The simplicity and blend of a well built two waay now in an affoardable take home4 package!.

Actually I think the ewaves take the classic design/idea of the Altec 19's, shrinks it and with new acoustic lens and driver technology make it even better soniclly and much more affoardable. Speaker evolution- ya gotta love it!
DC
 
djnagle & all,

I can support the positive comments about the BOFU. They can be a lot better that any $19 (on sale) driver has a right to be.

I performed a "whizzerectomy" on my set, removed the dustcap, added a wooden phase plug and an ND20FB-4 tweeter through ~2 uF cap.

http://www.parts-express.com/pe/sho...35&FTR=nd20fb-4&CFID=4215716&CFTOKEN=24871455

I use them in "Curvy Changs", an example of which can be seen in this thread:

http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/full-range/172745-curvy-chang-build.html

Mine can be seen in this thread:

http://techtalk.parts-express.com/showthread.php?p=1526374
 
Hey truth, do you have pix of your "whizzerectomy"? I used the JBL 6x6 and think highly of them. I think the combo of those and the BUFO would be a good bookshelf
 
djnagle said:
Hey truth, do you have pix of your "whizzerectomy"? I used the JBL 6x6 and think highly of them. I think the combo of those and the BUFO would be a good bookshelf
Click to expand...

Can you point me to some info on the JBL 6x6? And, how does it compare with the performance of the 12x6 commonly used in the econowave? Thanks!
 
roymail said:
Can you point me to some info on the JBL 6x6? And, how does it compare with the performance of the 12x6 commonly used in the econowave? Thanks!
Click to expand...
Part number and ordering info on the System Information page linked from the first post.

90° x 90° dispersion pattern, better mated with smaller woofers and crossed a bit higher than the standard eWave. I plan on doing another serious analysis/application of it in PCD, as my first attempt was aborted due to cabinet edge overhang directivity issues.

A Zilchster favorite, I mate it with D2500Ti, typically, though D220Ti works as well. JBL's drivers require a different HF comp filter; to use those, clone the factory crossovers.

[$6 each.... :) ]
 
GordonW said:
Revision in my next personal E-wave project!

Got a pair of Pioneer HPM-1100 15" woofer frames... had broken polymer-graphite cones, but the voice coils and spiders were in perfect condition. I found out that replacement cones for the Yamaha 3803 15" pro-audio woofer are a PERFECT fit... and they're curvilinear (bell-shaped) paper cones. Same composition as what I used in the EV SRO-15 woofers in the BiggiE-wave and in my Seeburgs, essentially. That, with the same felt dustcap (4.5") that I used in the others, and some sticky dope on the fabric surrounds... I'm in business!

With 3" voice coils, these should seriously kick some @$$. Have determined that they play smoothly up to around 2KHz on axis. :thmbsp:

Regards,
Gordon.
Click to expand...

Gordon,

I have a set of HPM 1100 woofers also with broken graphite cones and the voice coils/spiders work well. I would like to recone these and use for eWave project. So you are saying this could be done and would be all right to use?

I asked Parts Express the cost to recone these woofers and they gave me a figure of $60 per woofer which I didn't think was too bad (especially since I can deliver and pickup). Do I have to make sure they use a specific cone (i.e. Yamaha 3803 15" pro-audio woofer) to make them decent for Ewave usage?

I plan on using them in the original HPM 1100 cabinets with a possible 12" circular waveguide like this Dayton H12RW 12" Round Waveguide 1" Threaded or something better?
 
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