ADC's Bricks
- Thread starter wualta
- Start date
Doug G.
Lunatic Member
Yeah, I just wanted to take plenty of time to see what it sounds like with the stock stylus first.
Hey, I could be a jen-you-whine audiophile. "The ADC model 220 cartridge requires a 48 year break-in period before it settles into reproducing violins like flowers blooming before you."
Doug
Hey, I could be a jen-you-whine audiophile. "The ADC model 220 cartridge requires a 48 year break-in period before it settles into reproducing violins like flowers blooming before you."
Doug
Doug G.
Lunatic Member
Those scoundrels!
The package in that ad is the same one I still have that mine came in. Hmm, that means I may have paid the higher price for mine in 1969 but I believe Olson had it on sale.
And if you got it with the Brazilian Rosewood box, the French crystal inner case, the set of three precision screwdrivers for mounting, the pure gold hinges and clasp, and the silk slip case, it was $389.00! (salute to Mr. Rodrigues)
Doug
The package in that ad is the same one I still have that mine came in. Hmm, that means I may have paid the higher price for mine in 1969 but I believe Olson had it on sale.
And if you got it with the Brazilian Rosewood box, the French crystal inner case, the set of three precision screwdrivers for mounting, the pure gold hinges and clasp, and the silk slip case, it was $389.00! (salute to Mr. Rodrigues)
Doug
Yep and the sun is about the size of a quarter.
Luckyorleans
Super Member
I have a 10E MKII in good shape but would like to see about trying a new stylus. Finding the R-12 stylus for it, or an elliptical generic, is slim pickings. Are there other stylus models that are compatible? The MKIV are easy to get, including originals at VofM but not stock for the MKII.
This is a new one for me and appreciate the help.
The original stylus is in good shape but like to look at comparing it to a new one.
This is a new one for me and appreciate the help.
The original stylus is in good shape but like to look at comparing it to a new one.
I know that urge well.
The R-11E and R-12E are the styli made for the 10E (originally 10/E) and the one-year-later replacement, the 10E Mk II. They're both very hard to find unless you want to spend big money. They do have one interesting talent, however-- they weigh just enough so that if you zero-balance your arm (teeter-totter type, not the "dynamic balance" type) with the stylus removed, then slide the stylus on, you'll achieve ADC's recommended 0.75g VTF.
Sadly, the later Brick styli you mention won't fit your 10E Mk II, at least not without cutting off the "wings", and then there's the problem of providing a magnet for them, since the 10E's body doesn't have one. I don't know of any R-11/12 generics.
So I say start a running search on eBay or the equivalent(s) and meanwhile enjoy your 12E stylus. You can try getting a conical R-20 (meant for the original big red 220) if your R-12E is sounding worn; they're not hard to get hold of. The blue R-9E is basically an elliptical R-20, but not as easy to find. The gray R-5/E would be a closer match for the 10E body, but it too is not an easy find, plus when Stereo Review tested it in July 1968, 2.5g VTF was needed to make it track well. Not horrible but certainly not optimum.
The R-11E and R-12E are the styli made for the 10E (originally 10/E) and the one-year-later replacement, the 10E Mk II. They're both very hard to find unless you want to spend big money. They do have one interesting talent, however-- they weigh just enough so that if you zero-balance your arm (teeter-totter type, not the "dynamic balance" type) with the stylus removed, then slide the stylus on, you'll achieve ADC's recommended 0.75g VTF.
Sadly, the later Brick styli you mention won't fit your 10E Mk II, at least not without cutting off the "wings", and then there's the problem of providing a magnet for them, since the 10E's body doesn't have one. I don't know of any R-11/12 generics.
So I say start a running search on eBay or the equivalent(s) and meanwhile enjoy your 12E stylus. You can try getting a conical R-20 (meant for the original big red 220) if your R-12E is sounding worn; they're not hard to get hold of. The blue R-9E is basically an elliptical R-20, but not as easy to find. The gray R-5/E would be a closer match for the 10E body, but it too is not an easy find, plus when Stereo Review tested it in July 1968, 2.5g VTF was needed to make it track well. Not horrible but certainly not optimum.
Last edited:
stratokaster
Mental toss flycoon
Is there a consensus on what is the best replacement stylus for the X/XE series (220 etc)? I have a body somewhere but its original stylus is damaged.
The 550XE's stylus (the R-50XE) the one with the orange dot. This was the most expensive of the beige Bricks (beige = part of the 220X/XE family, ie, not a 25/26/27 or a 10E Mk IV) and had the highest compliance, so remember, either viscous-damped or lightest-possible arm for this stylus if you want to max its potential. If you need lower compliance, get the blue-dot R-90XE or a green-dot 220XE or the red-dot conical 220X.
By the way, Audio did a quickie test of the 25 and 220XE in Feb 1971. Note the treble extension and the location of the peak of the 220XE (below, left):
Gramophone tested the 550XE, 990XE and 220X, along with the 25, also in Feb 1971. Above center and right are the curves for the 550XE and 220X, respectively.
Last edited:
stratokaster
Mental toss flycoon
Thanks a lot! Hope I will be able to find them.
Stratokaster: One place to look is one I've had good luck with for the past five years. Look for 104-DE and select which color dot you want.
Luckyorleans
Super Member
Super, thanks for all the info again. I was hoping that one of the 220 (R-20), etc. would be a compatible later gen but the 10E family is older than I first thought. A search has been set up!
So, just finished reading all 9 pages of this thread. Very interesting read!
But now it’s near the end of 2019, and original styli are more scarce than ever. Even Gary at VOM has exhausted his supply of original styli for most ADC carts.
Before I found this tremendously good thread on the pre-1973 ADC carts, I had bought a 220X cart, missing the cantilever. I bought an EVG 220 Stylus from VOM, 0.6 conical, and transplanted it’s cantilever into the original 220X pivot block. It fit perfectly, and plays beautifully. Along the way I bought several brands of aftermarket styli; several produce no sound whatsoever, as the flux lense transmits no magnetism at all! An iron wire bread tie won’t even attract to it. Others are weak, such as the $8 style-tone unit I bought 2 weeks ago. It produces half volume. The EVG Japan unit from VOM plays perfectly. That 220X far exceeds my expectations! Paid $20 for it on eBay.
But now it’s near the end of 2019, and original styli are more scarce than ever. Even Gary at VOM has exhausted his supply of original styli for most ADC carts.
Before I found this tremendously good thread on the pre-1973 ADC carts, I had bought a 220X cart, missing the cantilever. I bought an EVG 220 Stylus from VOM, 0.6 conical, and transplanted it’s cantilever into the original 220X pivot block. It fit perfectly, and plays beautifully. Along the way I bought several brands of aftermarket styli; several produce no sound whatsoever, as the flux lense transmits no magnetism at all! An iron wire bread tie won’t even attract to it. Others are weak, such as the $8 style-tone unit I bought 2 weeks ago. It produces half volume. The EVG Japan unit from VOM plays perfectly. That 220X far exceeds my expectations! Paid $20 for it on eBay.
Not quite 2 weeks ago I bought a 10E 4 from eBay, with original stylus, for $44. Seller said untested. I figured that was worth the gamble. I had seen an old advertisement for the 10E-4 and started looking for one.
I didn’t expect much, truthfully. I cleaned the stylus, inspected it, checked the pivot block, checked continuity, mounted it on a light weight headshell, I aligned it, set the VTA to 0.7 grams, then dropped the needle.
This is using my 1977 Hitachi HT-463 table. It has a very nice tonearm, medium-light mass.
I was floored by what I heard! The needle was still sharp. No collapse of the suspension. But I did have to dial up the VTA, from 0.7 grams up to 0.8 grams.
It tracks warps, no problem. Doesn’t hog down the stylus.
This cartridge presents a very deep, wide soundstage, and has that ADC effortless quality, while presenting tight and deep bass and very detailed mids and crisp, liquid highs.
Before putting this 10E-4 cart on, I had spent weeks listening to either the XLM MKII Improved, or the NAD 9300 cartridge. The 9300 sounds much “richer” than the XLM.
But this 10E-4 holds its own. It’s a very enjoyable cartridge! Listening to 3 discs, original 1959 and 1962 realeases, I was awestruck by the imaging this cart presents, and extremely vivid and 3 dimensional presentation! Different from the XLM, but every bit as nice!
So, I got a taste of what Wualta and Doug and others have experienced with these 2nd (3rd?) generation ADC carts. I’m still stunned, but enjoying it!
Still surprised at how well this cart tracks at 0.8 grams, verified by my digital tracking force gauge. So exaggerated VTF? No.
I was able to find a NOS stylus for a good price. It was packed on its side, not needle-down in the blister pack.
Next week I’ll mount it on my Denon DP45F and give it a spin.
I didn’t expect much, truthfully. I cleaned the stylus, inspected it, checked the pivot block, checked continuity, mounted it on a light weight headshell, I aligned it, set the VTA to 0.7 grams, then dropped the needle.
This is using my 1977 Hitachi HT-463 table. It has a very nice tonearm, medium-light mass.
I was floored by what I heard! The needle was still sharp. No collapse of the suspension. But I did have to dial up the VTA, from 0.7 grams up to 0.8 grams.
It tracks warps, no problem. Doesn’t hog down the stylus.
This cartridge presents a very deep, wide soundstage, and has that ADC effortless quality, while presenting tight and deep bass and very detailed mids and crisp, liquid highs.
Before putting this 10E-4 cart on, I had spent weeks listening to either the XLM MKII Improved, or the NAD 9300 cartridge. The 9300 sounds much “richer” than the XLM.
But this 10E-4 holds its own. It’s a very enjoyable cartridge! Listening to 3 discs, original 1959 and 1962 realeases, I was awestruck by the imaging this cart presents, and extremely vivid and 3 dimensional presentation! Different from the XLM, but every bit as nice!
So, I got a taste of what Wualta and Doug and others have experienced with these 2nd (3rd?) generation ADC carts. I’m still stunned, but enjoying it!
Still surprised at how well this cart tracks at 0.8 grams, verified by my digital tracking force gauge. So exaggerated VTF? No.
I was able to find a NOS stylus for a good price. It was packed on its side, not needle-down in the blister pack.
Next week I’ll mount it on my Denon DP45F and give it a spin.
Doug G.
Lunatic Member
It appears I have had the color dot thing on ADC's wrong all this time, at least for the 220 X/Xe family. I thought they meant the shape of the stylus (which, I guess they kind of indirectly do) but they indicate to which cartridge they belong. So, right now, in front of me, I have a 250 XE with a white front label on it and a 220 XE stylus on it (green dot).
Doug
Doug