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Confused about wattage...

Adda said:
But there is no rule of thumb when it comes to volume control positions, it all depends on the system.

You want to be right so bad that you are not reading what we are saying.

What if someone made a preamp and decided to put a volume control in it, that even at max, provided so much headroom, that the preamp wasn't stressed at all?
Makes a lot of sense to make it that way, the preamp couldn't take damage from excessive volume, or EQ'ing, and have low distortion levels, no clipping no matter what you do, as long as proper source equipment is used.
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I don't want o be right, I am right. Even if an amplifier were designed as you say, would it still not have ample headroom at the 2:00 position? As stated, this is ONLY a rule of thumb. You kids need more hobbies.
 
Kingshead said:
I don't want o be right, I am right. Even if an amplifier were designed as you say, would it still not have ample headroom at the 2:00 position? As stated, this is ONLY a rule of thumb. You kids need more hobbies.
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Ok ,lets say that a preamp is made for paper specs, rather then real world performance.

It is rated at lets say 1.5v (distortion figures and so on are measured at 1.5v), but the specs say it outputs up to say 8v.
At a 2:00 position, this preamp may already be clipping, if source equipment with a strong output is used, even without an EQ.
 
Adda said:
Ok ,lets say that a preamp is made for paper specs, rather then real world performance.

It is rated at lets say 1.5v (distortion figures and so on are measured at 1.5v), but the specs say it outputs up to say 8v.
At a 2:00 position, this preamp may already be clipping, if source equipment with a strong output is used, even without an EQ.
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If you're attempting to say an electronics engineer would design an amplifier so that it reached maximum rated output at let's say 10% of its rotation on the volume pot then went into clipping then I say he needs to look for a new line of work.

Of course there are sources that output very high signals, and this is exactly why I stated in my very first post about this if you bothered to read it, "rule if thumb" and he would hear obvious signs of distortion if the amp was clipping. Save time, read my first post.
 
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Kingshead said:
If you're attempting to say an electronics engineer would design an amplifier so that it reached maximum rated output at let's say 10% of its rotation on the volume pot then I say he needs to look for a new line of work.
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No I'm not, I'm saying it's rated at 1.5v, but outputs a maximum of 8v, and may very well work fine, no clipping as long as source equipment that doesn't exceed the preamps rated input sensitivity is used, even at max volume, but with higher distortion of course (then at rated output).
 
Kingshead said:
The problem with turning the volume that high, then boosting all the tone controls is you have more than likely exhausted all of the amps headroom (reserve power), this leaves nothing in reserve for dynamic parts of the music. The amp will have no other choice than clip the signal. This is what I was referring to about the 2:00 maximum position rule of thumb. With the tone controls set to flat the 2:00 position still leaves enough amplifier power in reserve for dynamics.

For you trolls, this in no way implies any speaker can handle any amplifier if the 2:00 position isn't exceeded.
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I'll turn those down some and see if it still sounds good, but like I said at flat it just doesn't sound good at all when I'm at the other end of the room. After looking at it, I'd say where the volume is set would be closer to between 12:00 and (12:30?)
 
Adda said:
No I'm not, I'm saying it's rated at 1.5v, but outputs a maximum of 8v, and may very well work fine, no clipping as long as source equipment that doesn't exceed the preamps rated input sensitivity is used, even at max volume, but with higher distortion of course (then at rated output).
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Edited my last post while you were posting, do yourself a favor and read my first post.

All the nit picking, does someone have lice?
 
Kingshead said:
If at any time you here the woofer begin to bottom out then of course turn it down, it should be obvious if something in the system is being over driven.
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You'll get a lot of distortion before the woofer bottoms out, and depending on the system, the volume control could be anywhere at that point.
 
Adda said:
You'll get a lot of distortion before the woofer bottoms out, and depending on the system, the volume control could be anywhere at that point.
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"It should be obvious if something in the system is being over driven" how else would you know when your theoretical system has reached it's clipping point, or have you blown out numerous speakers due to not being able to tell something was being over driven. As I said, you kids need more hobbies.
 
Kingshead said:
"It should be obvious if something in the system is being over driven" how else would you know when your theoretical system has reached it's clipping point, or have you blown out numerous speakers due to not being able to tell something was being over driven. As I said, you kids need more hobbies.
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I agree, so the rule of thumb must be, if you get excessive distortion, turn down the volume.

I already have too many hobbies...
 
The reason I gave the OP the rule of thumb, if you will notice his two amplifiers are fairly conservatively powered and he might be tempted to crank the volume knob all the way before the woofers show obvious enough signs of stress for "him" to notice before damage occurs from clipping.
 
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Kingshead said:
The reason I gave the OP the rule of thumb, if you will notice his two amplifiers are fairly conservatively powered and he might be tempted to crank the volume knob all the way before the woofers show obvious enough signs of stress before damage occurs from clipping.
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The same rule still applies.

But yes, the Sansui is a rather weak amp, and already distorts 1% at it's 12w rating.
Not a good candidate for a lot of EQ'ing unless very very efficient speakers are used.

The Scott seems fine with it's 60w rating, but how efficient are those speakers?
 
mrkmpn said:
. by the time I got to my couch it just wasn't right.
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This statement I believe clears it all up. The reason you're not happy with the sound is more likely room interaction. Try repositioning the speakers, maybe relocating your listening position, maybe some room treatments. I would start with speaker location first.
 
Kingshead said:
This statement I believe clears it all up. The reason you're not happy with the sound is more likely room interaction. Try repositioning the speakers, maybe relocating your listening position, maybe some room treatments. I would start with speaker location first.
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You could very well be right :thmbsp:
 
Kingshead said:
The reason I gave the OP the rule of thumb, if you will notice his two amplifiers are fairly conservatively powered and he might be tempted to crank the volume knob all the way before the woofers show obvious enough signs of stress for "him" to notice before damage occurs from clipping.
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Actually I've never cranked either all the way up. The highest is usually about 12:00 or just a tad over. Any higher than that gets to be way too loud for my little house. Many times I just lay on the floor near the stereo if I really want to "listen" to the music, and not just hear it. Alot of the time I'm listening with headphones if anyone's watching TV.
 
mrkmpn said:
Actually I've never cranked either all the way up. The highest is usually about 12:00 or just a tad over. Any higher than that gets to be way too loud for my little house. Many times I just lay on the floor near the stereo if I really want to "listen" to the music, and not just hear it. Alot of the time I'm listening with headphones if anyone's watching TV.
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Tell us, how have the speakers been set up?

Do you have carpeted floors?
Are the speakers elevated above the floor?
Are the tweeters at ear height relative to your listening position?
Any windows near the speakers, or behind your listening position?
 
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