Dual Binding Posts a Marketing Gimmick?
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62vauxhall
Addicted Member
It would be one more line item to put on the brochure’s feature - benefit list.
pauldrewry
Super Member
Some like to use tube power for the tweeters and ss power for the woofers.
Blue Shadow
Waiting for Vintage Gear from this century
Dual binding posts are a pair of binding posts set at 0.75" apart on center and easy to find on many of the parts sites. Using a dual banana plug on these is an easy way to hook up the speakers. But since they are binding posts sometimes called 5-way binding posts, they can accept single bananas, dual bananas, wire, spades and other types of ends.
I know what you mean, two sets of inputs, two sets of dual binding posts that allow biwiring or biamping so back to that discussion.
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swechsler
Frog Whisperer
Because that will turn away the vast majority of potential buyers. Even with a cheap DSP, you still need preamp outputs and a pair of amps. Although there are also some AVRs that are capable of using two unused surround channels, it's also a lot more complicated than just a single amp and single cable.
Having said that, there have been some high end speakers that require an active crossover. The Infinity IRS III/V and IRS Beta come to mind.
Which is a damn good idea with Klipsch. Helps tame that nasty top end.
Poultrygeist
Lunatic Member
With dual binding posts you won't realize all the benefits of bi-amping as long as the internal crossover is still intact.
homebrew
Super Member
Using dual binding posts for bi-wiring or bi-amping only works if the internal crossover is also separated into woofer components and tweeter components. Otherwise they're just a gimmick.
I'd also be skeptical of including a DSP network in the average consumer speaker system. Most people don't place their speakers in their optimum position. How can they be expected to properly adjust crossover slopes and crossover points correctly?
I'd also be skeptical of including a DSP network in the average consumer speaker system. Most people don't place their speakers in their optimum position. How can they be expected to properly adjust crossover slopes and crossover points correctly?
JoeESP9
ESL's & tubes since 83
If the speaker comes with jumper straps on the dual binding posts it's most likely they are separate connections for treble and bass.
sqlsavior
Lunatic Member
Separate connections for treble and bass do not remove the associated filters in the crossovers. Sure, it's possible to design systems with two-stage filters, but the goal is usually to eliminate the high-level one, rather than add to it. Richard Vanderstein seems to sincerely believe in bi-wiring. I think it's for the birds.
I vote gimmick.
I vote gimmick.
Twin binding posts - real or gimmick......................... My response - Largely GIMMICK.
But, here's why.
Inside a 2 way loudspeaker with a passive crossover you have 2 electrical tuned filters. One low pass for the mid/bass and one high pass for the tweeter. These are tuned to 'crossover' at a particular frequency and are also set so that the effective sensitivity of each driver is matched at the input to the filters by the manufacturer to give what the best sound they can (with, presumably, extensive testing). So let's have a look at this.
Bi-wiring. You run 2 speakers cables from a single amplifier, one to each filter and driver. You have apparently separated the 2 drivers (and the respective filter) from each other for improved sound. The only separation is the resistance of each speaker lead. Compared to the impedance of the driver and the inductor(s) in the speaker the impedance (resistance) of the cable should be negligeable. Gains - minimal if any, and it costs you another pair of speaker leads.
Bi-amping. You run 2 speaker cables from 2 power amplifiers, both of which are carrying a full range audio signal. The 2 amplifiers must have the same gain, otherwise the balance designed into the passive filters will be upset and the speakers will sound different, The idea of using a SS amp for the mid/bass and a tube amp for the treble may have some validity provided that you can guarantee that the gain of both amps is identical at all frequencies - not possible without sophisticated measuring equipment.
Active amplification - Forget it, unless you remove the passive filters.
Those are the facts as far as I can see them.
Please make up your own mind.
.
But, here's why.
Inside a 2 way loudspeaker with a passive crossover you have 2 electrical tuned filters. One low pass for the mid/bass and one high pass for the tweeter. These are tuned to 'crossover' at a particular frequency and are also set so that the effective sensitivity of each driver is matched at the input to the filters by the manufacturer to give what the best sound they can (with, presumably, extensive testing). So let's have a look at this.
Bi-wiring. You run 2 speakers cables from a single amplifier, one to each filter and driver. You have apparently separated the 2 drivers (and the respective filter) from each other for improved sound. The only separation is the resistance of each speaker lead. Compared to the impedance of the driver and the inductor(s) in the speaker the impedance (resistance) of the cable should be negligeable. Gains - minimal if any, and it costs you another pair of speaker leads.
Bi-amping. You run 2 speaker cables from 2 power amplifiers, both of which are carrying a full range audio signal. The 2 amplifiers must have the same gain, otherwise the balance designed into the passive filters will be upset and the speakers will sound different, The idea of using a SS amp for the mid/bass and a tube amp for the treble may have some validity provided that you can guarantee that the gain of both amps is identical at all frequencies - not possible without sophisticated measuring equipment.
Active amplification - Forget it, unless you remove the passive filters.
Those are the facts as far as I can see them.
Please make up your own mind.
.
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Because of customers.
Absolutely. Manufacturers need people to have a simple upgrade path.............and buy more gear.
Customers would set it up wrong, blowing up speakers. Things have to be idiot proof.
If bi-wiring or bi-ampng have any benefits they would be as applicable to small speakers as to big speakers. Not everyone is convinced.
But yes, I agree that dual posts have become expected and manufacturers have to offer them or risk being perceived as down market.
invaderzim
Super Member
My thought exactly. Probably more of manufactures trying to please those that base part of their opinion on if the speaker has dual posts than trying to fool people into thinking it is something special.
Every test I've seen of Klipsch bookshelves show they are about average for efficiency; 8 dB or so below what they claim. Apparently they use a different method for figuring their speakers efficiency that makes them look better.
