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Heathkit W6 testing and issues

Happy ending indeed! I never knew these were a Williamson variation. I might keep an eye out for them myself!

ETA: OTOH, looking at the prices, I'll stick with my homebrew S-271-S Williamsons. ;-) I wonder what your friend paid for them.
 
Sorry I'm late to the party, but thought I'd give some reference data from one of my W-6M units for comparison. For the purposes of this conversation, the amplifier is completely stock, with the single exception being that the Damping circuit is disabled, and the fractional Ohm load resistors associated with it are shorted out. With only insignificant differences, the results very similar and in keeping with that of its mate. In keeping with the test standards of the day, all testing was done on the 16Ω tap. Very good tubes were installed, with new matched Sylvania tooled 6550A output tubes set for a balanced 65 mA quiescent current. The relevant results include:

1. Operating from a 117 vac line, the amplifier would develop just over 70 watts RMS at the onset of clipping from 20 Hz to 20 kHz (72-74 watts).

2. Frequency response (biggest area of deviation with the unit of this thread) was -0.1 db at 20 kHz, and down 1 db at 53 kHz. From my notes, the response of this amplifier mate's was also down similarly at this frequency (-0.75 db).

3. The amplifier is absolutely stable into a cap only load, with no value up to 1.0 uF causing any tendency towards (or even being close to) outright oscillation. No value was tested over 1 uF.

4. Into a non-inductive 16Ω resistive load at 1 watt, a 10 kHz square wave is very square, with no top or bottom ringing displayed (pic provided). This too is at odds with the amplifier presented.

With the exception of #2 above then, the tests of my amplifier are in full compliance with the specifications published by Heath. They indicate that the HF response of the amplifier is within +/- 0.5 db of 70 kHz, which neither of my partially restored amplifiers will do -- although a very slight tweak to the phase advance cap would likely resolve that. Partially restored means all components are good or replaced and matched as necessary, but the new work is only tacked in place at this point for testing purposes. A permanent restoration effort is in the works for later this year.

It would appear that the specification of HF response is the sticking point for the amplifier presented in this discussion. With an effective flat response out to over 100 kHz, there is less control of circuit response being applied -- for whatever the reason -- either as compared to the Heath specifications, and certainly my own units as well. The 390K input network, 910pF/1K step network, and 10K/47pF NFB network components control the HF response of the amplifier, and are all still currently in place. Other variables include the output transformer, which is a bonafide Peerless model 16431, and construction of the amplifier (lead dress), which is well in keeping with the instructions in the manual. If the build and network components in the subject amplifier are the same as in mine, yet response is so much greater, then the likely variable relative to this discussion is the output transformer, which if ture, would be extremely unusual for true Peerless products.

I'm hardly suggesting that the transformer in the subject amplifier is defective or has been tampered with (can restuffed?), but with such a difference between Heath specifications/my unit's performance, and this amplifier's performance relative to HF response, HF transient response, and power output -- for the typically near identical performance normally produced from Peerless products -- it is certainly worth a thought, all else being equal.

Granted, the effort of this discussion is chasing that nth degree of performance, so from a practical standpoint it may all be academic anyway, but the differences are noted herein for reference.

The W-6 amplifier is the one Heath really got right. Absolutely superb and properly applied transformers, low impedance power supply, Class AB2 drive capability, a well executed stability scheme that got the job done without throwing the baby out with the bath water, and specifications that by in large are quite accurate. There are a couple of minor points I will address in my own restoration efforts, but straight out of the box, the Heath W-6 set a performance standard that to my knowledge, no other amplifier of similar type design can approach.

Dave

Below: A 10 kHz Square Wave from the W-6, produced as described in #4 above.

SAM_4272.jpeg
 
After all of my experiments with this amp I have it back to the original circuit component values. The 10kHz square shows a small leading edge peak but not much and very well controlled. Possible this is because I used the 8 ohm output for my testing. I don't have a good 16ohm load. Have another 8 ohm NI resistor in my Mouser cart for future measuring. I didn't try a cap only load but 0.1uF across 8 ohms was very well damped out.

Yesterday our listening session was very fun. The amp was clear, clean, detailed but never harsh and plenty power for great dynamics. It may just be the amp that has it all. I've been communicating with a seller that has a pair of these plus a 3rd parts unit. I expect to hear from him tomorrow to finalize the deal.

Dave, thanks for revisiting my thread with your amp results.
W6 #1 10kHz sq 10k 24p fdbk and 390k input 1k 910p shelf.jpg
 
The owner of the W6's came to reclaim them tonight. We had about 2 hours of listening to them. They are glorious sounding and powerful. The only change I made in the end was removing the damping circuit. Happy ending. Might have to get a pair for myself. Thanks to all for the comments, advice and encouragement.
John
I have wondered as to how good a refurbish pair sounds.
 
Looks I'm getting my W6's. Seller is giving the total tomorrow and I'll get them ordered. It will be two complete units and a parts unit which is missing the OPT. Then I'll have another restoration project on my hands.
 
Are you buying those for your own use? I wouldn't know what to do with 70W/ch. Well, maybe for the 1812 Overture. :)

Jack
 
After hearing them I think even at lower power levels the are really a good PP amp. And somewhat uncommon so I figure someday the shouldn’t be too hard to sell if it comes to that.
 
I don't tend to need big power either but bass heavy music really loves the wattage.
My speakers were designed to help overcome that issue. My main amp for years was about 4W/ch. Only occasionally could I detect something amiss in the bottom end. Amplifiers that I use now in the 25-35W/ch range have completely overcome it. The speakers are 95dB sensitive, and while that might not sound like anything special, they're flat at that level to nearly 20Hz. It really makes a difference.

Jack
 
My speakers have moderate sensitivity at 92dB. They have a very small footprint as they are a tall narrow tower. They also are advertised to reproduce bass into the 20's. My room isn't big enough for large speakers. When listening to these amps the other day I noticed that they have a very clear but unfatiguing sound quality even at loudness levels that I won't use very often.

Another point is that since retiring I've been having sort of a second childhood with tube amps as the focus. Just too much fun working on them, learning, restoring, and trying them to see how they present differently. I'm not done yet but don't know how many more years I can enjoy this or even do this. Just can't stop right now.
 
Hi Dave,
Is the W6 restoration still in your sights for this year? I have a pair of my own to restore now but would sure like to see what you find.
Best wishes,
John
Have you started yours yet? When you do will you document it all so others can benefit from your experiences.
 
Surely. I have helped a friend with his W6's and now he has 3 pair. He is having a local tech rebuild them to match his first pair. When I do mine I will take plenty of pictures.
 
I am looking forward to this progress as I have a pair that I would like to optimize to the best performance.
 
I am guessing that W7-M came after the W6-m from a design point and production model. Was the W7-M supposed to be Heathkits idea of an improvement over their W6-M? Just wondering, as the W6-M looks like it would be the better of the two.
 
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