High Definition Vinyl?
- Thread starter DustyOldPile
- Start date
But I hope I'm wrong.
Arthur Smith
Super Member
And, how many more times the price? #marketinggimmick
Audioraven
Well-Known Member
Double the fidelity is a very bold claim.
I think it will be interesting to see what exactly they are able to do with this technology. But, I don't think they've actually made a record this way yet. I would imagine that the press release was written by marketers and not by scientists, so there is likely hyperbole (not fact) driving the 30% better verbiage. After reading this it sounds like its nothing more than (though not trivial) a laser cut version of the DMM process (albeit the inverse). By directly cutting (via laser) the pressing disk (negative of the record) several steps wherein error and or contamination can creep in seem to be slated for elimination. Theoretically this would be a good thing. It also sounds like they have more control over the cutting process such that more groove modulation can be introduced without reducing recording time (thus x% "louder") than the somewhat archaic and very mechanical cutting process now used. Who knows … its patented but not tried and true. But, it is very exciting to consider the possibility that manufacturing steps can be eliminated thus reducing chances of error and contamination that lead to degradation of sound.
That's was I gathered from reading the posting. Skipping several process which due to the chemicals involved with plating and washing you reduce some of the hazardous chemicals, and then just go straight to burning a groove in the main stampers. But by using a laser your able to get a much more focused cutting process, increase the resolution or more precise modulation cutting, all the while having a PC control groove spacing which increases the capacity. We have seen in the past better capabilities using the old cutting process, some being the old Soundstream on the Telarc labels, but they were mainly limited to a few titles. I think it would be great to have some new super audio vinyl released, and I doubt it will be cheaper, but if they produce some with great titles (mainly great classical preformances
) what harm could it do?
twiiii
Lunatic Member
Depending on the radius of the contact surface of the stylus will determine the capability to track the new grooves. The developer can modify the groove to allow cartridges with certain parameters to operate at their maximum capability, while others to a lesser extent and some capabilities not be approached. Groove manipulation rather than audio modulation manipulation. But isn't it the same thing? I suppose so, But it will depend on the engineers as it always has to provide the most accurate manufacturing process. Hopefully the engineers won't have damaged their ears in the past while listening to old obsolete analog vinyl records.
DustyOldPile
Vinyl Goddess
I was thinking that this sounded a lot like the claims and conversations around Quadraphonic that I remember reading as a kid in stacks of old stereo rags in the library. Special cartridges, backwards compatible, big claims and promises, tempers flaring, pushing and shoving, etc.
“We adjust the distance of the grooves, we correct the radial/tangential errors, and we optimize the frequencies,” Loibl continued. “You could say we ‘master’ the topographical data,
This is the bit that I find interesting. Sounds like a lot of decision-making to me. The thing about decisions is that they aren't always made for the better. I kinda feel that the less room there is ( or the more difficult it is ) for people to tinker the better.
This is the bit that I find interesting. Sounds like a lot of decision-making to me. The thing about decisions is that they aren't always made for the better. I kinda feel that the less room there is ( or the more difficult it is ) for people to tinker the better.
Going back even further, wasn't the RCA Dynagroove system promoted as a process improvement that would deliver better fidelity for all? Those of us with long memories remember how that one turned out.
tnsilver
Stereo Puppy
30% more capacity + 30% louder - reads 'compression' in my book. Haven't these people fu$%#d up the CD industry with exactly the same idea in what is known as the 'loudness wars' that basically makes recent CD's intolerable? What other frequencies do you need on an LP that's not already there? It goes all the way from 20Hz - 20KHz. Anyone here thinks they can hear anything that's not in that range? Unless they come up with a new 'stereohedron' stylus, I say they should leave the poor things alone and go screw with video formats, home theatre gear and PCM devices.
Oh... and just in case any of you plan on replacing your old 'normal' LP collection with these new 'HD' disks... I'm buying.
Oh... and just in case any of you plan on replacing your old 'normal' LP collection with these new 'HD' disks... I'm buying.
My prediction for this technology is that (if it move from concept to reality) is that it will produce Vinyl LP's that are as good as the best that we have available now (clean, click and pop free pressings) and do so more consistently. I can't imagine that it will take the LP beyond the very best examples available today, but you never know. A laser cut has the potential to be cleaner and clearer (especially at higher frequencies) and eliminating a couple of the mechanical steps reduces the "generation" factor which MAY lead to a better LP. I echo concerns about messing with the cutting angle, etc., but it would seem to be commercially smart to stay with the current conventions so that the millions of turntable owners already out here can buy and use (to excellent effect) the product they will be producing. I mean, nobody will want to change cartridges or change VTA or anything else just to play these new LP's - will they?
30% louder speaks to dynamic range to me. CDs have the potential to outperform vinyl. The deciding factor is how the recordings are mastered. Compression is not required if mastered properly.
Enjoy,
Rich P
Enjoy,
Rich P
I wonder if anyone has thought about improvements to the composition of the material used. From the start their has been some changes from Wax, to Shellac, to vinyl, but I wonder if with todays advances, a better vinyl material might be something to look at. Something with that could reduce friction, decreased wear properties, More scratch resistant, you know a super vinyl. Maybe injection molding of some type.
I missed the part about what makes it "HD". The laser cutting is better than cutting shellac? Make some stampers that way, they can be regular LPs. Analog is "HD", claims of "HD" immediately bring to mind 192kHz...
lini
just me...
30 % louder would be a pretty modest gain of not quite 2,3 dB more... Nothing to get excited about, I'd think - and also a pretty modest claim, when expressed in dB...
Well, and 30 % more run-time wouldn't seem out of reach to me, either, as the different cutting process would probably cause a lot less print-through, so that the groove spacing can be narrower.
Twice the fidelity, however... well, I'd doubt that. Especially as it's hard to apply some sort of scaling to audio quality or any other human perception.
Greetings from Munich!
Manfred / lini
Well, and 30 % more run-time wouldn't seem out of reach to me, either, as the different cutting process would probably cause a lot less print-through, so that the groove spacing can be narrower.
Twice the fidelity, however... well, I'd doubt that. Especially as it's hard to apply some sort of scaling to audio quality or any other human perception.
Greetings from Munich!
Manfred / lini
damacman
Resident Psycho
You guys crack me up sometimes. Technology does march on. Why isn't it plausibe that a new improved format based off of the LP isn't possible here in 2016?
I say we don't yet know enough to form an opinion. I say we hear it before we judge it. I for one am grateful that the vinyl revival has opened up doors like this.
What if ...
I say we don't yet know enough to form an opinion. I say we hear it before we judge it. I for one am grateful that the vinyl revival has opened up doors like this.
What if ...
I, for one, and if the format proves viable, would be more than happy to add another player to the stable. I have a superb 8-track in the main rig. I have a Revere tape cartridge player waiting to be restored and added to the rig. When I find a decent laser disk, it will go in there. I am no source snob. I love my music, and my rigs provide the ability to enjoy a large variety of sources. I say, "Go for it."
Enjoy,
Rich P
Enjoy,
Rich P
I am not totally against a new format, though in years past this statement would not be true. Yes, you are right. We will have to wait to see if these broad claims this company is making will pan out, but I think many of us here have lived through these sort of marketing claims in the past.
