Is Rock and Roll Dead???
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I'm listening to a German band, The Notwist. They put on one of the most interesting "rock" (its more electronic, but there are guitars) shows I've seen. At one point a Nintendo Wii controller was controlling much of what was happening sound-wise.
I realize that somewhat obscure electro-rock-indie-whatever isn't for everybody. And that's what I like about music today. I don't have to like what 500,000 other people like.
Jack Lord, you and I, for example, are always in a bit of a tiff about my dislike of the Beatles. Or rather, my simple lack of worship of them
. Maybe its just the different musical atmospheres we grew up with, then. DIY was big when I was in college. You made the music you wanted to hear, because nobody else was making it. And everybody had a band, not a band they played in but their own band almost, that they were really into. Mine was Galaxie 500, FWIW. That band broke up in 1991. Last year, the guitarist/singer went around with his wife, and did a couple of shows where they just did Galaxie 500 songs (though they had their own different band, and had been in a band called Luna together). So every Galaxie 500 band came out of the woodwork to see them, and it was fantastic. Like a high-school reunion,but with people you'd never met. Just a small common interest. And there was something special about it because this was "our" band. We didn't share it with 10 million people. It wasn't U2, where every kind of person on the planet would show up. No, a certain type of people like Galaxie 500. And if you did, you were more or less family.
I played a Galaxie 500 song at an open mic night and some dude I didn't know just hugged me afterwards for playing it. You don't get that for playing a Stones song.
Kids these days aren't much different than that. They don't want their musical cultural movement. They want their musical family.
If anybody really wants to understand where rock went, and why those types of bands aren't big now, I highly recommend "loudQUIETloud: A film about the Pixies" and "Tell Me Do You Miss Me", a documentary of the farewell tour of the band Luna. Another great one, about aging as an independent musician, specifically in the modern punk rock world is "The Other F Word", about being in a punk rock band and becoming a father, juggling the reality that you aren't going to change the world or fill stadiums, with a love of the music, and a love of not wanting to do what you did when you were 20.
I realize that somewhat obscure electro-rock-indie-whatever isn't for everybody. And that's what I like about music today. I don't have to like what 500,000 other people like.
Jack Lord, you and I, for example, are always in a bit of a tiff about my dislike of the Beatles. Or rather, my simple lack of worship of them
. Maybe its just the different musical atmospheres we grew up with, then. DIY was big when I was in college. You made the music you wanted to hear, because nobody else was making it. And everybody had a band, not a band they played in but their own band almost, that they were really into. Mine was Galaxie 500, FWIW. That band broke up in 1991. Last year, the guitarist/singer went around with his wife, and did a couple of shows where they just did Galaxie 500 songs (though they had their own different band, and had been in a band called Luna together). So every Galaxie 500 band came out of the woodwork to see them, and it was fantastic. Like a high-school reunion,but with people you'd never met. Just a small common interest. And there was something special about it because this was "our" band. We didn't share it with 10 million people. It wasn't U2, where every kind of person on the planet would show up. No, a certain type of people like Galaxie 500. And if you did, you were more or less family. I played a Galaxie 500 song at an open mic night and some dude I didn't know just hugged me afterwards for playing it. You don't get that for playing a Stones song.
Kids these days aren't much different than that. They don't want their musical cultural movement. They want their musical family.
If anybody really wants to understand where rock went, and why those types of bands aren't big now, I highly recommend "loudQUIETloud: A film about the Pixies" and "Tell Me Do You Miss Me", a documentary of the farewell tour of the band Luna. Another great one, about aging as an independent musician, specifically in the modern punk rock world is "The Other F Word", about being in a punk rock band and becoming a father, juggling the reality that you aren't going to change the world or fill stadiums, with a love of the music, and a love of not wanting to do what you did when you were 20.
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I think the genre of stadium rock has run its course. People are too busy now, or they just want to dance.
Sounds like something I'd like to read.
The thesis would depend on the criteria for "good rock". So much of what sold heavily and filled concert halls and stadiums back in the day is stuff I have little interest in revisiting now while some of the stuff out of the mainstream from the same timeframe remains artfully constructed and engaging.
I feel the same about too much "classic" film. So much from "the Golden Age" is claptrap, though bits here and there are excellent.
My thinking is that only about 10% of any art media really stands the test of time, worthy of the name "classic".
I'd be as interested in what the author would think "measures up" as fails.
I went to hundreds of concerts in my younger days and saw pretty much all the biggies and while I realize many of them were very skillful musicians, performers and entertainers, most were not "artists" in my sense of the word, lacking any real timeless message, or absent that (which is valid) any primal spirit. I saw a lot of great performances of truly mediocre forgetable material that sold in the millions.
That 10% rule for me seems to apply to art of all types and ages. Good is awfully subjective, but mass appeal sure ain't any measure that I can see.
Dance is good but I can't for the life of me remember anything recent that made me want to get up and dance. Good music to me makes me want to do one of three things: listen intently, sing along (or play it myself) or dance. And if it makes me want to dance, I probably like it best of all. "Dance music" these days? Meh.
beginnersluk
Active Member
The problem faced now a days is fads trends and POPularity. the 50s, 60s, 70s, 80s, and 90s, saw a major generalization of musical style and each "ushered" in the next era of hits where as now in the 2000s you may listen to any given musician, band, artist or what have you and liken it to something that came before it. Having no originality left we can no longer generalize an artist as the best. Todays music is just a great big mashup of all that came before it and it boils down to individual taste. I am 23 years old, and you ask me to name the biggest and the baddest and the stones will still pop in my head on top
The problem faced now a days is fads trends and POPularity. the 50s, 60s, 70s, 80s, and 90s, saw a major generalization of musical style and each "ushered" in the next era of hits where as now in the 2000s you may listen to any given musician, band, artist or what have you and liken it to something that came before it. Having no originality left we can no longer generalize an artist as the best. Todays music is just a great big mashup of all that came before it and it boils down to individual taste. I am 23 years old, and you ask me to name the biggest and the baddest and the stones will still pop in my head on top
I grew up with the Stones and never saw the attraction. Then one weekend they played across the street from my home so that I just had to open my windows and sit in my sonically-vibrating easy chair like my own private night club to decide, "Hey, they are pretty good." (I loved living there across the street from a big amphitheatre. One long Labor Day weekend, there were 40 big-name bands night and day. And fireworks, to boot.
)
beginnersluk
Active Member
I regret being born in this era lol, I would have gladly drove around the U.S throughout the 80s just to listen to bands. I do like modern rock I mean don't get me wrong but there is not as much flash to live performances anymore.
Thanks for the tip on Kill Tour Idols, I just ordered a copy.
As usual I found some of the book reviews of this work to be amusing.
Here is one of my favorites:
"In "Kill Your Idols," Jim DeRogatis finds fellow rock critics to contribute scathing reviews of rock albums, most of which are widely considered to be classics. At first, this makes for some fun reading, unless it's an album that you particularly like that's being raked over the coals, often by one who doesn't seem to be terribly knowledgable about that artist or album in the first place. "
Why would a critic (or anyone else) have to know anything about the artist or the particular work in question to have a valid opinion on the music ?
As usual I found some of the book reviews of this work to be amusing.
Here is one of my favorites:
"In "Kill Your Idols," Jim DeRogatis finds fellow rock critics to contribute scathing reviews of rock albums, most of which are widely considered to be classics. At first, this makes for some fun reading, unless it's an album that you particularly like that's being raked over the coals, often by one who doesn't seem to be terribly knowledgable about that artist or album in the first place. "
Why would a critic (or anyone else) have to know anything about the artist or the particular work in question to have a valid opinion on the music ?
Some of us who lived it sorely miss it. But some of us who lived it occasionally missed it even then, even if we had front-row center seats.
My best friend and I bought tickets to the only reunion of Eric Burdon with the original Animals. I sold a beloved car to finance the trip. We bought lots of drugs and drove 1,000 miles. Got there a day early. Spent that day doing lots of drugs and partying with his cousins and rafting a river. Camped out all night and partied into the next day till the concert.
The moment my ass hit the front-row center seat, I died. The band noticed and those who were there told me the band commented about it and played louder and louder and louder in an effort to wake me up. To no avail.
I woke up when the last roadie was carrying the last amp off the empty stage.
Even my parents thought that was a disgrace. Both thought The Animals' "House of the Rising Sun" the end-all be-all of music regardless of genre. (I requested it for both funerals, but no soloist knew it! If I could have dragged my concert grand to the cemetery, I'd have done it myself. Like they say about if you want it done right...)
Anyway, that's maybe my biggest regret in life. Sleeping then, of all times.
My second-biggest musical regret was when Long John Baldry drank himself into a stupor and didn't crawl onto the stage so I could hear him do "The King of Rock 'N' Roll" and "Black Girl".
But I've enjoyed pretty much all the big names up through the mid-80s when concert tours seemed to fall off the cliff. I'll never forget standing about four feet from Annie Lennox singing "Cool Blue" in full moonlight, hearing her voice pre-amplification. What incredible skin she had! Unqualified "diva", nor Jethro Tull in the Aqualung tour, and so many others.
I have a zillion slides from concerts I should scan sometime. (Don't hold your breath.)
Hiking up my old-man pants under my arms, "You kids don't know what you missed".
MannyE
Exterminate!
Don't despair! Concerts are coming back. I don't know if this has been covered in this thread what with Muse and all :yes: (for the record...I like em) but we can thank MP3s for making concerts a more viable enterprise.
I was not able to go see Pink Floyd when The Wall came out due to being 12 years old but last year I had the chance to see them. Here in Miami which is an afterthought for most bands (Wed or Thursday shows) they had to add another night. Heck there was even a chick that tripped so hard, she missed the whole show! (mid life crisis anyone?).
I think we're going to be seeing more of this as bands rock or otherwise meet the growing demand. The only problem is that ticket prices reflect the shift from selling records to selling tickets.
I was not able to go see Pink Floyd when The Wall came out due to being 12 years old but last year I had the chance to see them. Here in Miami which is an afterthought for most bands (Wed or Thursday shows) they had to add another night. Heck there was even a chick that tripped so hard, she missed the whole show! (mid life crisis anyone?).
I think we're going to be seeing more of this as bands rock or otherwise meet the growing demand. The only problem is that ticket prices reflect the shift from selling records to selling tickets.
I think MP3's do have some beneficial effect that way. I considered rearranging my schedule on a moment's notice, the evening I discovered him online, to catch a kid from Germany two days later near Miami the last week of last year. If I'd had time to arrange in-home care for my sister, I'd have done it, but settled for a first-rate CD, for now.
There are still seriously talented artists in various genres coming up out of nowhere who can garner bookings across an ocean, just from that exposure on places like YouTube.
I'm not inclined to pay the prices the fossils command, with the exception of Pink Floyd. Some things are just worth the asking.
There are still seriously talented artists in various genres coming up out of nowhere who can garner bookings across an ocean, just from that exposure on places like YouTube.
I'm not inclined to pay the prices the fossils command, with the exception of Pink Floyd. Some things are just worth the asking.
I'm listening to a German band, The Notwist. They put on one of the most interesting "rock" (its more electronic, but there are guitars) shows I've seen. At one point a Nintendo Wii controller was controlling much of what was happening sound-wise.
I realize that somewhat obscure electro-rock-indie-whatever isn't for everybody. And that's what I like about music today. I don't have to like what 500,000 other people like.
Jack Lord, you and I, for example, are always in a bit of a tiff about my dislike of the Beatles. Or rather, my simple lack of worship of them
I played a Galaxie 500 song at an open mic night and some dude I didn't know just hugged me afterwards for playing it. You don't get that for playing a Stones song.
Kids these days aren't much different than that. They don't want their musical cultural movement. They want their musical family.
If anybody really wants to understand where rock went, and why those types of bands aren't big now, I highly recommend "loudQUIETloud: A film about the Pixies" and "Tell Me Do You Miss Me", a documentary of the farewell tour of the band Luna. Another great one, about aging as an independent musician, specifically in the modern punk rock world is "The Other F Word", about being in a punk rock band and becoming a father, juggling the reality that you aren't going to change the world or fill stadiums, with a love of the music, and a love of not wanting to do what you did when you were 20.
I've seen things you wouldn't believe. Hardcore bands at the Shoulder of Orion Club. I watched the still youthful Stones from the second row of the Capital Centre. Manitoba at CBGBs, Zappa at the Warner, Thunders at Irving Plaza, the Allmans at the Beacon. Miles and Carlos jaming together, the Dead under a haze of mushrooms. Fugazy's finale.
All those moments will be lost in time, like tears in rain. Time for Rock & Roll to die.
Nice
Where's the little dove flying away? Needs that extra touch.Nah, it's just time for stadium rock to die. It was never that good anyway, beyond a few bands.
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Some of the albums skewered include Sgt. Pepper, Dark Side of the Moon, Horses (Patti Smith), Joshua Tree (U2), Exile on Main Street (Rolling Stones), etc.
Now I admit that some of these have aged badly, and that I would not even consider owning or listening to others (Horses, Exile), I do think that Sgt. Pepper and DSOM are still interesting, even if I have not spun them recently. I have never owned any Led Zeppelin, or a lot of the music reviewed in the book, and though I did pick up a copy of Joshua Tree, I don't know where it is now. The review of that album is priceless! I don't think I could listen to it now without laughing hysterically.
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thebeez85
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
true...
I myself fall victim to favoring artists over others based on their album history...
sometimes, one should take a step back, removing themselves from the picture and base their opinion on simply the music...
they're plenty of bands "i would never listen to" and "don't wanna associate myself with" because of things like image..but damn, some of their songs and harmonies are pretty catchy...:scratch2:
Music will always be evolving...if it didn't, we'd be bored...some are bored already! me, nope! Im loving music more than ever!
-Beez
"It's all about this music".
Music critics have no more say on what's good than anybody else, in an art form like rock and roll.
Good move.
I heard way more than I cared to from my sister's room growing up. She and her husband and I agree to disagree about them.
I've never owned any and never will. But I bought my sister their whole catalogue which made her happy. I don't have to like it.
I think I even skipped them though I had season tickets for all concerts in a venue and I know my sister and her husband went. If I didn't skip it, I might not remember as they never impressed me any. Or might not remember because Everclear punch provided a good insulator from some things some Fridays in college. :yes:
Regardless of my personal strong likes and dislikes, I agree with that. It's much the same for many art forms. If it pleases someone, entertains them, or makes them think, who am I to care what floats their boat?
Nevertheless, one can enjoy a good bit of critical writing, good or bad, and maybe gain some perspective from it.
I do think they have ears, no?
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