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It's not just stereos that the kids don't want.

stereoguy70 said:
The manufacturers and design engineers have done this by design now. Ask a kid today if they are interested in electronics. Most will say yes. Then ask them if they understand how it works or how to fix it, they will look at you like you have three heads. "Fix it? Why would you fix it when you can get another one so cheap?"
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And in the next breath, they'll be talking about how "green" they are.
 
bhunter said:
And in the next breath, they'll be talking about how "green" they are.
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Well, they have to work with what's available, affordable and doable within reasonable time with the presently available means. And while one can fairly easily improvise furniture, try improvising a smartphone... I.e., one has to stay fair and consider that the consumer can only buy what's available and affordable for him and maintain, repair and make himself what's not far out of his possibilities in every respect. And in case of communication, IT and entertainment electronics there additionally is the problem of pretty fast technical advance and shifting standards - in combination with repair being comparatively costly today, as soon as one can't do it oneself anymore to save at least on the cost of labour, and also because it often requires more and more special/new tools.

I'd rather put more blame on the industry. I mean, have you for example ever heard users explicitely demand for notebooks with glued-in, non-swappable batteries? And notebooks with integrated optical drives also already appear to be a dying breed now. Or try to still get a decent, current feature-phone. Or look at how the digicam market has already changed since the smartphone has become popular...

Problem for the buyer today also often is missing actual variety in his "affordable" price-range, often combined with a confusing choice of almost-the-same-but-note-quite products. E.g., if your AMD or Intel on-CPU-video isn't enough you basically get the choice of a confusing variety of AMD/ATI or Nvidia based graphics cards from a variety of manufacturers, which basically only minmally differ in terms of the cooling solution. And as soon as you buy that card, you can be sure it'll be outdated/far surpassed in three years... *sigh*

Greetings from Munich!

Manfred / lini
 
motorstereo said:
Having inherited a couple of "collectors" collections over the years has made me very determined to not do this to the ones I love when it comes my turn. What may mean the world to someone doesn't necessarily mean that it's a priceless heirloom to me. There's no doubt lots of my treasures will be looked at in the same fashion so I try hard to keep my collecting down to a bare minimum..
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Sounds right
 
stereoguy70 said:
Refer back several pages to the point that someone made about this being a throw away society now. Not many people bother to get modern equipment fixed. Why? Two reasons. Not enough people are trained in how to fix them, and the equipment from the get go was never designed to be serviced. It is so miniaturized now and the way it is manufactured pretty much prevents the average service tech to be able to fix it. The tools that you need to replace the tiny surface mount components on a circuit board are so specialized and expensive, never mind the difficulty in even attempting a repair. Components are rarely replaced on a board anymore, they replace the whole board! And that's even when you can get the parts. Yes, there are people out there that attempt it...there is a niche market for repairing older iPhones, iPods, and such, but that is a fringe element and not the norm. This is why its easier to just "throw away" the old broken one and buy a new one these days. The manufacturers and design engineers have done this by design now. Ask a kid today if they are interested in electronics. Most will say yes. Then ask them if they understand how it works or how to fix it, they will look at you like you have three heads. "Fix it? Why would you fix it when you can get another one so cheap?"
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Unfortunately this is the sad reality of current manufacturing.

I once blew a video card in a laptop. Luckily I knew a guy who could fix it, however the only way to replace the video card was to replace the entire motherboard. Still cheaper than a whole new laptop at least.

When I last upgraded my phone in December, Verizon gave me some credit onto the monthly bill for turning in the old one. I at least hope that phone ended up somewhere other than the landfill...
 
DaveVoorhis said:
Quoted for truth.

I teach (mostly) millennials at university level. Whilst others point out the differences between millennials and us old farts, I note that almost exactly the same percentage of them are hard-working and capable as there were among my colleagues as when I was a university student in the mid 1980's. The difference, if any, is that far fewer of my students are engaged in the single-minded pursuit of wine (or beer), women and song that characterised my youth. Millennials tend not to be the partiers that we were, and they're sometimes called "generation sensible" for good reason.

In fact, they seem to be turning into the young adults that our parents always wanted us to be.

Despite that, there are a small number of my old-fart colleagues who are quick to pick out the exceptions -- the handful of ill-prepared, fragile, flighty, whiney, helicopter-parented, over-dependent "snowflakes" among the millennial bunch -- and claim that they're all like that.

They're not. They're absolutely not. They're mostly good people, and the future is in good hands.

The thing is, there were always a handful of ill-prepared, fragile, flighty, whiney, helicopter-parented, over-dependent "snowflakes" around, but somehow it seems easy for some of us old farts to forget they were among our peers too (and still are!) and erroneously believe they're unique to a younger generation.
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I think there is a lot of truth in this.

I do carpentry, reno, and handyman work. One of my best customers/clients is a millennial.
He has a real estate 'ticket', and buys 1 and 2 bedroom condos that are kinda dumpy. Knows exactly what needs to in order to flip them for a profit, and gets in there and does it.
He also knows what he can do and what he can't. What he can't usually gets pushed towards me.
And when neither of us knows? Yeah, we google it. No shame in that. It's no different than getting on the phone and asking my grandfather.

Heck, the more I think about it, I could probably apply your percentage thing above to the millennials I'm related to. Such a mix there.
 
Nightwisher said:
Unfortunately this is the sad reality of current manufacturing.

I once blew a video card in a laptop. Luckily I knew a guy who could fix it, however the only way to replace the video card was to replace the entire motherboard. Still cheaper than a whole new laptop at least.

When I last upgraded my phone in December, Verizon gave me some credit onto the monthly bill for turning in the old one. I at least hope that phone ended up somewhere other than the landfill...
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Could he not just mount a video card and use it? PCI slot?
 
DaveVoorhis said:
Quoted for truth.

I teach (mostly) millennials at university level. Whilst others point out the differences between millennials and us old farts, I note that almost exactly the same percentage of them are hard-working and capable as there were among my colleagues as when I was a university student in the mid 1980's. The difference, if any, is that far fewer of my students are engaged in the single-minded pursuit of wine (or beer), women and song that characterised my youth. Millennials tend not to be the partiers that we were, and they're sometimes called "generation sensible" for good reason.

In fact, they seem to be turning into the young adults that our parents always wanted us to be.

Despite that, there are a small number of my old-fart colleagues who are quick to pick out the exceptions -- the handful of ill-prepared, fragile, flighty, whiney, helicopter-parented, over-dependent "snowflakes" among the millennial bunch -- and claim that they're all like that.

They're not. They're absolutely not. They're mostly good people, and the future is in good hands.

The thing is, there were always a handful of ill-prepared, fragile, flighty, whiney, helicopter-parented, over-dependent "snowflakes" around, but somehow it seems easy for some of us old farts to forget they were among our peers too (and still are!) and erroneously believe they're unique to a younger generation.
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Thats the problem, we see some bad examples of the latest generation, millennial in this thread, point a finger at them and then say that is the way they all are now. I never had any rug rats myself but my wife did from a former marriage. Two sons who are now in their mid 20's. The youngest of the two is productive, helpful, has a good job with a career etc. He calls us up once in a while and we know he doesn't need anything. The other is waydifferent. Self centered to the extreme, a part time job with low pay, sleeps in a converted cargo trailer in his dad's driveway, he rarely calls us and if he does it is about some crisis he needs to talk through, usually someone said something that hurt his fragile ego or railing about the injustices in life.. About the only way my wife can see what he is up to is through Facebook and then the life he paints is what he wants the world to see. Pictures of himself in nature, snowboarding, fishing in his boat,living the good life.

Two examples from the same household, could not be more different, Yet I see a little of their parents in each of them too. On picked up a different set of values is all. But to look at either as what their generation is all about is ridiculous. We are all individuals, making our own waythrough life, just like it has always been. And who is to judge either of them really? What is success?
 
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Nightwisher said:
Unfortunately this is the sad reality of current manufacturing.

I once blew a video card in a laptop. Luckily I knew a guy who could fix it, however the only way to replace the video card was to replace the entire motherboard. Still cheaper than a whole new laptop at least.

When I last upgraded my phone in December, Verizon gave me some credit onto the monthly bill for turning in the old one. I at least hope that phone ended up somewhere other than the landfill...
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The phones usually do get recycled.....be it into a program for the "less fortunate" or for other programs like that. Most of the time though, phones & other electronics get harvested by recycling companies for the precious metals in the pc boards. Sad, but a necessary evil as well.
 
DaveVoorhis said:
Quoted for truth.

I teach (mostly) millennials at university level. Whilst others point out the differences between millennials and us old farts, I note that almost exactly the same percentage of them are hard-working and capable as there were among my colleagues as when I was a university student in the mid 1980's. The difference, if any, is that far fewer of my students are engaged in the single-minded pursuit of wine (or beer), women and song that characterised my youth. Millennials tend not to be the partiers that we were, and they're sometimes called "generation sensible" for good reason.

In fact, they seem to be turning into the young adults that our parents always wanted us to be.

Despite that, there are a small number of my old-fart colleagues who are quick to pick out the exceptions -- the handful of ill-prepared, fragile, flighty, whiney, helicopter-parented, over-dependent "snowflakes" among the millennial bunch -- and claim that they're all like that.

They're not. They're absolutely not. They're mostly good people, and the future is in good hands.

The thing is, there were always a handful of ill-prepared, fragile, flighty, whiney, helicopter-parented, over-dependent "snowflakes" around, but somehow it seems easy for some of us old farts to forget they were among our peers too (and still are!) and erroneously believe they're unique to a younger generation.
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Yes....

That maybe true amongst those that can go to college. But let's be honest, less than thirty percent of any generation goes to college. It's about what the majority of a generation has to deal with that leads to the distraction of partying. In a perfect world as wished by educators in public school.....all children go to college and live happily ever after, but that's not reality. I ended up in the low income neighborhood of East Side San Jose where crime became rampantly participated in just to survive. There just wasn't enough jobs after the resession of 1981, then the vocational schools disappeared, then gangs appeared where no gangs where before. I couldn't visit my friends like before without being shot at and returning the favor. Then there was a war between the Vietnamese gangs and the Chicano gangs. That's why I joined the Army, just to save my life. Life is what the common folk have to deal without help from the government and in fact everything that is happening is due in part from the lack of involvement from the government. Just look at the opiumate crisis, why aren't the pharmaceutical companies made to create treatment centers to help people that the pharmaceutical companies have destroyed. Instead our new government has just made a new law that puts more junkies in prison for a longer time making slaves out of them in which investors profit. Then people wonder why poor people get hostile with the police and police shoot and kill people. I'd rather be shot dead than be a slave in prison also. Please, people that go to college are the privileged few and this country is about what the rest of us go through and no one wants to consider what the poor have to go through in high crime neighborhoods cause no one wants to pay more taxes. The situation in Detroit, Houston, LA County, Chicago, and half of New York State did not happen by accident.....

That's why they have the saying in the hood....the game is a crying shame !!
 
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Djcoolray said:
That maybe true among those that can go to college. But let's be honest, less than thirty percent of any generation goes to college. ...
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That is a serious problem. Education is a step toward curing a host of ills -- poverty, prejudice, terrorism, criminality, etc. -- and anything that limits access to it, whether financial barriers or societal attitudes, contributes to those problems.
 
DaveVoorhis said:
That is a serious problem. Education is a step toward curing a host of ills -- poverty, prejudice, terrorism, criminality, etc. -- and anything that limits access to it, whether financial barriers or societal attitudes, contributes to those problems.
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Only for those that are able to go to college....
 
Djcoolray said:
Yes....

That maybe true amongst those that can go to college. But let's be honest, less than thirty percent of any generation goes to college. It's about what the majority of a generation has to deal with that leads to the distraction of partying. In a perfect world as wished by educators in public school.....all children go to college and live happily ever after, but that's not reality. I ended up in the low income neighborhood of East Side San Jose where crime became rampantly participated in just to survive. There just wasn't enough jobs after the resession of 1981, then the vocational schools disappeared, then gangs appeared where no gangs where before. I couldn't visit my friends like before without being shot at and returning the favor. Then there was a war between the Vietnamese gangs and the Chicano gangs. That's why I joined the Army, just to save my life. Life is what the common folk have to deal without help from the government and in fact everything that is happening is due in part from the lack of involvement from the government. Just look at the opiumate crisis, why aren't the pharmaceutical companies made to create treatment centers to help people that the pharmaceutical companies have destroyed. Instead our new government has just made a new law that puts more junkies in prison for a longer time making slaves out of them in which investors profit. Then people wonder why poor people get hostile with the police and police shoot and kill people. I'd rather be shot dead than be a slave in prison also. Please, people that go to college are the privileged few and this country is about what the rest of us go through and no one wants to consider what the poor have to go through in high crime neighborhoods cause no one wants to pay more taxes. The situation in Detroit, Houston, LA County, Chicago, and half of New York State did not happen by accident.....

That's why they have the saying in the hood....the game is a crying shame !!
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Why does going to college or not need to come into play? Can't people without degrees get their **** together, regardless of generation? Sure they can. I know I did.
 
restorer-john said:
Back to basics? Yep, sure. Take away their stupid phones, ipads and internet connection and their "DIY spirit" is gone. They have NO idea. They didn't just watch and listen to a master craftsman and learn. They didn't read any books on the subject they are going to become expert on. I guess they hope to learn by osmosis?

They can't make or do chit. It's funny to watch. I see young men taking their bikes to the bikestore to get a tube replaced, they call the breakdown service to change a tire and if their lawnmower won't start- they buy a new one!

Here's the process for a millenial's DIY project:

Step 1: Ask Google.
Step 2: Copy someone else's project.
Step 3: Feel proud they bodged up something that looks like crap and hardly works.
Step 4: Do a 'maker' video and upload it for others to 'like' and copy.

Bahahaha. :)
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LOL... that's funny.

Dude. Just because they don't pick up a Chilton's when they need to change a fuel pump doesn't mean they are morons. First off, Chilton manuals are expensive and youtube is free. A few years ago, when I wanted to change the fuel pump in my Road Runner, I pulled out my trusty repair manual (cost...over $200) and went to youtube as well. There is no substitute for watching someone do something. Something as simple as a mechanical fuel pump on a mopar big block has some important details which guess what?? WERE NOT in the manual. The guy that posted the video made mention of some very important positioning that I would have never known.
 
MannyE said:
LOL... that's funny.

Dude. Just because they don't pick up a Chilton's when they need to change a fuel pump doesn't mean they are morons. First off, Chilton manuals are expensive and youtube is free. A few years ago, when I wanted to change the fuel pump in my Road Runner, I pulled out my trusty repair manual (cost...over $200) and went to youtube as well. There is no substitute for watching someone do something. Something as simple as a mechanical fuel pump on a mopar big block has some important details which guess what?? WERE NOT in the manual. The guy that posted the video made mention of some very important positioning that I would have never known.
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Funny, my first car, when I was 16 was a side swiped 64 Plymouth Sport Fury with a big block 426 MoPar that needed a fuel pump (among a whole slew of other things as well as a door and quarter panel).. In 1971 we didn't have anything really to go on, shopped for parts at the wrecking yards etc, but we muddled through. However if You Tube had been in existence way back then I surely would have made use of it!
 
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