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old capacitors (in their day) vs new

these nichicon gold tune caps look like fake elnas honestly..... but they are definitely nichicon KG's.

they just look a lot like a lot of caps i could get off ebay
 
i will wager a bet with anyone that the mortality rate of caps made today wont be as good in 40 years time versus ones made 40 years ago tested today .
 
I guess overall alu can thickness influences that. Also the way the safety vent works, a weak spot in the aluminium on top.....But most of all the "there is no free lunch" thing.
Apart from that, a lot of quite new stuff is being recapped, television stuff and such, employing the cheapest caps they can get. Guess nobody takes a chance and recaps his amp using CapXon and such brands I guess.....
 
if the older caps hold up longer maybe its because they were "overbuilt"? they sure seem that way. it would make sense that capacitors underwent cheaper manufacturing processes just as everything else did as time has gone on.

can you imagine how much it would cost to build something like that mcs 3125 now a days? the chassis, faceplate, heat sinks etc... we dont see that kind of individuality in receivers anymore because it costs too much to turn a profit.

im not saying there arent capacitors available that are as good as ones built back then, im saying the majority of the caps in anything anymore are trash and the majority of the caps you can find from any supplier are cheap junk. it seems that there are so many crap caps out there that there arent very many good ones. if these nichicon kg caps really are that great then i wonder what those crap caps that are the same size with snap in terminals would be like?
 
With a scope you can measure or see the ripple. It would be interesting to compare the ripple at full power.

Craig
 
Having been curious about older caps in the past, I've tried to look them up. There wasn't much emphasis on losses back then and I've had very little luck finding dissipation factor or anything of use. Sprague had great technical notes- anybody remember the big blue 3-ring notebooks? Others, not so much, or the data books are long gone. The Japanese brands weren't sold much here, so there was never much in the way of literature.

If you look at full power ripple, that will be indicative of the cap value and, to some extent, the dissipation factor (or esr, for those using that format). There are usually circuit losses greater than the esr, but in the end, whichever cap gives lower ripple, wins. One strange caution- the measured value of very old caps often rises. Those caps will give lower ripple than fresh ones of the "correct" value, that are usually near their lower tolerance. I still replace 'em, because they're on their way out!
 
specs in part lists for older stuff can state plus 100 percent uf . modern caps seem to be at rated value stamped on them .
 
higher ripple current rating basically means it can take in and discharge a larger charge of energy within its comfort zone without heating up from what ive gathered from doin a bit of reading.

sounds like something that could have something to do with how "forceful" the sound is
 
yotems said:
thanks for your valuable contribution to this thread
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I apologize for the snide comment but this is sounding way too much like a cable thread to me. Maybe my problem.

I would be very careful on the old Japanese caps issue. I just finishing recapping a Sansui 1000A and every single oil and paper cap was bad. Every single one. And most of the electrolytics. I've been running across many Pioneer, Marantz, and other mid seventies gear with cap issues, and not just electrolytic. It's just a matter of time before the eighties stuff starts doing the same thing. Ive also replaced more than one power supply in a nice old amp because the owner thought that buying old black beauty cut outs would give them the tone they are looking for. Why people pay really good money for bad caps is something I just cannot fathom.

No one can convince me that running on original caps is better than replacing them. It's like running your 1978 car on the original Michelins because the tread is still good. I like the enthusiasm, just don't agree. I've never ever heard a recapped amp that sounded worse than before it was recapped and I've done more than I can count.

Now I have no argument with purchasing the highest quality caps one can find, especially electrolytics in the power supply. That I have no quarrel with.
 
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these cornell dubiliers i have on the way could sound horrible despite all of this, which would save someone else the time of purchasing them or any caps like them for such a task. they could sound really good too, which would save someone else the time of looking.

ggregg said:
I apologize for the snide comment but this is sounding way too much like a cable thread to me. Maybe my problem.

I would be very careful on the old Japanese caps issue. I just finishing recapping a Sansui 1000A and every single oil and paper cap was bad. Every single one. And most of the electrolytics. I've been running across many Pioneer, Marantz, and other mid seventies gear with cap issues, and not just electrolytic. Ive also replaced more than one power supply in a nice old amp because the owner thought that buying old black beauty cut outs would give them the tone they are looking for.

No one can convince me that running on original caps is better than replacing them. It's like running your 1978 car on the original Michelins because the tread is still good. I like the enthusiasm, just don't agree.
Click to expand...

i dont plan on running the rubycons again as they were leaking electrolyte. as explained in the briarsfield link though, they could test completely fine despite leaking which is why they could have been functioning alright.
 
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