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Pioneer M-22; Worth a Repair Attempt?

It's alive!!!

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Apologies for the terrible quality -- in my excitement, I accidentally took a video rather than a picture (this is a screenshot). I started by desoldering the trimmer I thought was bad, but upon removing it and measuring it out of circuit I realized it was actually fine. Still not 100% sure what happened there; I tested it so many times that I doubt it was bad probe contact. I did have to bend the leads a bit so it would fit and I think the wiper may not have been making contact with the solder, since it was barely long enough to reach through the PCB. I re-mounted both trimmers in the opposite direction, so now they will be adjusted from the top, which is fine since I removed the PCB covers.

Once that was done, I re-mounted the boards and connected everything but the outputs. Threw it on the DBT with two 150w bulbs and flipped the switch -- there was a flash of light as the caps charged (I had completely drained them before working on it) but after that the bulb went dark. The best part: all three relays activated, and no smoke! I was beginning to wonder if my re-wiring of the soft start circuit was the culprit, so this was a big relief. @merlynski unfortunately the alligator clips for my 1k resistors were delayed by FedEx and I was too impatient to wait, so I went straight ahead and connected the outputs. Again, all three relays latched in the expected order, with only a faint light from the two 150w bulbs. Left it on the DBT for about 10 minutes and no smoke or increase in current draw. Had to stop because it's getting late, but I'm going to be setting bias and offset tomorrow and hooking it up to my sacrificial speakers (disembodied $20 full-range drivers from Parts Express) to see if it'll actually make music. @merlynski thanks a million for all the help, I've learned a ton and had a great time working on this thing.
 
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Ok, gave it full wall power today and it appears to be working fine. Was able to run it for about 30 mins with no shutdown, also able to set bias and DC offset. This thing is so damn hot with bias set -- it's like working on a space heater. Leaning over the heatsinks to perform adjustments is quite uncomfortable.

Also, it's very difficult to get bias and offset adjusted with a high degree of precision because the measurements are so temperature-dependent. I aimed a fan at the amp and the DC offset quickly shot up from +-5mv to 50mv. Bias also decreased by 30-40mv. I'm assuming normal temperature and airflow variation from room to room could easily produce 10-20mv of variance in both bias and offset.

The only thing left to do is give it a listen. Gonna throw it on the test drivers tomorrow and then plug in my headphones assuming all goes well (which it should at this point).
 
Alright, it's fixed! Listening to my Stax now with an SRD-7 transformer box and it sounds great. No pops, no crackles, no background noise or hiss. For whatever reason, the Stax sound much thicker and meatier on the M-22 than with my Sansui Six or my NC400 monoblocks. And it's not a minor difference -- I normally run the Stax EQ'ed with about 3db of lower midrange boost and 3db of high treble reduction. Within a second of listening, I could tell the EQ would no longer be necessary. Differences in amp tone seem to be very pronounced with the Stax, perhaps because it's a weird load for a speaker amp. Anyways, I am very pleased with this combo and will definitely be running the M-22 as my main headamp from now on. Thanks to everyone who helped get this beast up and running!
 
I hope you don't mind me jumping on this thread as I've been following it, I've begun to restore my Pioneer M22 and like you I have no softstart relay and no wires going to or from it, it was completely removed? I'm not sure if it was taken from factory or a previous repair? I feel like it must have been taken out, i'm guessing it really needs it put back in!

So far I have made good progress, I have replaced all the known failing parts, 105 degree capacitors all round, new rectifiers, bourns trimmers, new thermal pads for the transistors, cleaned all terminals and replaced paired transistor where needed to help stabilise the bias and dc offset.

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I also decided to go overboard and replace the PSU caps but I had to make my own.

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So I am pretty much there guys, the only thing concerning me is this soft start! Can anyone help guide me with replacing it as I am sure it is needed! Thanks
 
My M-22 is in storage at the moment (left in NYC due to corona), but here are some pictures of the replacement soft start relay wiring. Used the schematic (from HFE service manual) to figure out the connections. Apologies for using multiple wires of the same color -- the only solid-core wire I had was brown.

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Pictures aren't the greatest -- I will try and post a diagram of the wiring tonight. BTW, great work with that filter cap mounting solution and enjoying your posts in the DIY Audio Facebook group. Got to spread the M-22 love around!
 
I just whipped up a quick relay wiring diagram, but first: do you have a European (230v) M-22? If so, your amp never had the soft start relay -- it's unnecessary due to the lower inrush current.
 
I just whipped up a quick relay wiring diagram, but first: do you have a European (230v) M-22? If so, your amp never had the soft start relay -- it's unnecessary due to the lower inrush current.

Mine is 230v version, so yes must be European version.

Aaaaahhhh this is excellent news, thank you Alex I can finally finish the amp now!

Thanks for the kind words on the filter caps seems to be popular on FB.
 
To address my own paranoia about giving incorrect advice, I found this in the SM. So you're definitely safe if you have the European version.

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Two things I learned while testing my M-22: first, make sure bias is set to minimum before turning the M-22 on. The bias pots allow for very high current draw if set too high. Second, you can use a DBT, but the amp draws so much current at idle that you'll need high-power bulbs. I had success using two 200w bulbs. Two 150w bulbs would probably work but anything lower and it may not come out of protection. Even with 200w bulbs, expect a brief flash as the filter caps charge.
 
I'm guessing it's European as its 230v version.

Thing is my board has the parts installed on it for the soft start circuit. It also looks like where the original relay was the screws are threaded meaning something was in there?

Cant be sure though, I guess the only way I can test it is to have an amp/volt meter and see what the current draw is on switch on, if its really high then I may just have to install one.

I'll keep you posted.

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Guys just my luck, so fired the amp this evening everything is as it should be, the I only issue I have is my output relays aren't engaging aaarrrgghhh.

I used these as replacements

Omran My2n

https://www.mouser.com/ProductDetai...Ee0xWmeNOnTfsn9b1n4pFBQVQzQifh1RoCzHYQAvD_BwE

They seemed to be a smililar spec but they don't seem to engage.

Should i try and source these ones?

https://www.digikey.co.uk/product-d...div/G4W-1112P-US-TV8-HP-DC24/Z5210-ND/1815530

Thanks almost there just can't see why the ones I installed aren't engaging
 
Hmm, have you tried checking the voltages on the relay? I used the Omron MY2 and had no issues, so I suspect there's something else going on.
 
Also, RE the European version: there should be a tag on the bottom where the power cord enters the chassis that has the voltage iirc. If not, you can take a picture of your transformers and I can probably figure it out using the SM. I would be very careful -- if you have the Japanese or American versions and you're running at 230v you're going to have some seriously unhappy components.
 
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Finally success ordered G4W-1112P-US-TV8-HP-DC24 and installed them, they worked with no problems!
 

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@vishalk Congrats, great to see another M-22 overhauled! I set mine to a little less than 850ma and it does get very hot. This is a crude measure, but touching the heatsinks for more than a second was painful. And I was using the M-22 in relatively cool conditions, so I can only guess what it's like with a hotter ambient temperature. You may have done this already, but I would allow at least 20 minutes for the amp to heat up before making the final adjustment -- bias and offset drift a lot depending on the temperature, and if you set based on the cool temperature you might be over-biased once it gets hot. I pointed a powerful fan at my M-22 while making adjustments and everything changed by like 100mv.
 
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