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Serious Compacts

chicks

chicks

Lunatic Member
EVIL, Compact ILC, MILC, Mirrorless, whatever they're called, they are quickly becoming very popular, primarily outside the US, but some folks here are getting on board.

Seems like all the majors except Canon have a system, and there are plenty or rumors about an imminent Canon release.

Their common features include the lack of a mirror, and interchangable lenses. Typically much smaller and lighter than a DSLR. The sensor is much larger that on a P&S camera, from 4/3 to full-frame.

A list of the current systems:

Nikon 1
Olympus / Panasonic Micro Four Thirds
Samsung NX
Sony NEX
Fujifilm XF
Leica M
Pentax K
Pentax Q

I use an Olympus u4/3 camera, primarily because it has a metal frame, can use MOST legacy MF lenses with cheap adapters, has the widest range of native lenses available, and was a couple years outdated, hence very inexpensive. Drooling over the Fujifilm and Leica systems, though, and of course the excellent Oly OM-D.

What are you using? No DSLR or P&S discussion, please.
 
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ic-racer said:
I'm curious, how would you focus it without a mirror or prism or rangefinder? Zone focus like a Rollei 35?
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Well, most, if not all of them have AF lenses. For MF lenses, there's the LCD display on back, or a built-in or accessory viewfinder. Usually electronic (tiny LCD behind a small lens), but some are optical. I use the accessory VF-2 viewfinder on my Oly, especially outdoors. It, and most others, has MF assist, which allows you to zoom 7X or 10X on a selected target to focus precisely.
 
Ok, so you can zoom in with the little screen in the back and try to focus 35mm camera lenses like that. I even wondered if lenses are being made for these cameras because, if you believe the text on every 35mm lens I see on ebay, 35mm manual-focus camera lenses are the only lenses that fit these cameras. :)
 
Panasonic/Leica and Olympus make a pretty wide variety of AF lenses for the u4/3 format, and there are several third-party lenses available, too, mostly MF, and just about any MF SLR lens can be used with inexpensive adapters. Zeiss makes some VERY expensive video lenses for the format.

The Sony NEX can use AF Minolta lenses with a motorized adapter. One of the Pentax MILC's apparently accepts any PK mount lens.

As much as I like the Fuji, it's currently limited to three new lenses, last I checked.

Focussing with the VF-2 in bright sun is pretty nice. Here's a 100% crop from a hand-held shot taken this morning with a legacy Minolta Rokkor-X MD 50/1.4.

1337559106697.jpg
 
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I have a Panasonic 4/3's but I purchased primarily to use my Leica lens on it. It is not as small as my Canon S95 and my D700 is more versatile.
 
Well, after seeing the price for that Panny lens, and reading the reviews that are already out, there's no doubt it's as serious a lens as the equivalent Canikons, but a bit out of my price range. :sigh:

No problem, lots of fabulous MF lenses in the thrifts, like this nice fast Minolta I picked up for next to nothing.

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I would really like to get the new Olympus OM-D E-5, but I'm going to wait and see if the price will come down a bit after it has been out a while. The reviews and talk about this camera have all been pretty positive! It is supposed to be one of the fastest focussing digital cameras available now.
 
Bought the E-P2 at about 1/3 of initial retail, 'cause I bought it 3 years after intro, and it was replaced by the faster, better E-P3. I can wait another 3 years to upgrade. All my lenses will still be usable. Maybe by then I'll be able to take halfway decent pics. ;)
 
I've got the Olympus PEN E-PL1. For 250 bucks now it's a steal and a nice camera. Easy to use and good pictures.

 
When it comes to cameras I like compact. It's easier to lug it around to far off places and I actually take pictures.

Here is my Olympus OM-2n SLR I got in 1977 next to my LUMIX GH2 I got last summer. The GH2 is a pretty serious camera.

OLY-LUM.jpg
 
sanford12 said:
I've got the Olympus PEN E-PL1. For 250 bucks now it's a steal and a nice camera. Easy to use and good pictures.
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Yep, cheap as a P&S with a much larger sensor and the ability to change lenses. What's not to like? $129 for a factory demo body @ Cameta.
 
Another good sign for the u4/3 format - German lensmaker Schneider announced a new line of lenses for the format, starting with this 14mm f/2.0. Pretty sure it'll be priced way out of my league.

SK_JPG2012_MFT14_750.jpg
 
I got the Sony NEX-5N when it first came out around a year ago and I have been constantly amazed ever since. The NEX's have been famous for a couple of years but they are only 4/3 sensors. With the 5m they went full size and they actually let in more light than a mirrored SLR. The pictures are a leap ahead of my high end P&S's. You can point and shoot and with the optional fixed lens it does fit in a pocket! The pixel density is so good that cropping substitutes for some zooming and still comes out netter than my other cameras. I also got the optional 18/200 lens with steady shot. I know that its run on the top is almost over and that there is a lot of good new stuff coming this year but still not a lot of full size sensors with large lenses. I was watching Nova a couple of nights ago and saw David Pogue (gadget and tech writer for the NY Times) using one. One thing that I love is that the flash can work in Burst mode. There is a manual/auto focus mode that will focus for you but if you are not happy with the results you can fine tune it with the focus ring.
 
I am fascinated by the EVIL style cameras, but have held off for a number of reasons, not least of which was my budget. My secondary consideration was what I'd honestly use an EVIL camera for.

However, I am honestly interested in experimentation. To that end, I am trying to sell off the last of my film camera bodies - hopefully retaining a few classic manual focus lenses - so that I can buy an EVIL style camera.

Here are my criteria:

1) Has to mount Canon FD/FL lenses without an optical lens inserted and have infinity focus capability.

2) EVF capability. For me, focusing on the back simply isn't going to happen. My eyesight has finally reached a point where it is uncorrectable for reading distance; I have to take off my glasses to read, period. I will not take off my glasses to take a photo.

3) Prefer APS-C sensor size over 4/3. Nothing against 4/3, they make lovely images, but if I'm going to use my classic Canon MF lenses, I don't my my 50mm to become a 100mm. Having it become a 75mm is bad enough, but I can probably live with that.

4) Prefer good High-ISO images. The more the merrier, although this is further down on my list for a reason.

5) Lower cost. Of course, the closer I get to 1-4, the higher 5 will be.

Given all of that, I am seriously leaning towards the Samsung line of EVIL cameras, specifically the NX10/NX11/NX20 series. The NX10 can be had cheaply now, but I'm not sure it would give me much that I don't already have with my Pentax K-r or K200D, except the capability of mounting Canon FD/FL lenses. Might be worth it just for that.

The Sony NEX series would also work, but costs more, and the newer/better models appear not to have EVF capability, so I'm leaning away from those. Also, they appear to be more menu-driven than knobs and buttons. I'm old, I like knobs and buttons. Mentioning my poor closeup eyesight once more, I detest having to whip off my glasses to squint at an LCD menu.

I think the Pannys and Olys are brilliant! I especially like the new OM-D, it's fantastic. But it's a system camera; if I were to go that route, it would basically mean moving away from Pentax just based on not having three of everything, and I love my Pentax system too much for that.

I am also keeping a close eye on the new rangefinder-type cameras, from the Fujifilm X-100 onwards, including the interchangeable lens models. Prices are a bit dear at the moment, but should they remain popular, more will enter the market and eventually prices will drop. I have to say that I'd love to have an X-100, without further qualification, but I believe my budget will force me to pass on that.

My number one goal in all of this would be to put my Canon FL glass back into regular use on a digital camera. If I could do that, nirvana. I've got a Canon FL 58mm f/1.2 that wants to be digital. I can hear it calling me.
 
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