Why re-cap speakers?

[F1nut]

When I recapped a pair of fully working Tandberg tl1610 just as a precaution after reading that it should be done, I broke the crossover pcb when trying to loosen the fixing screws and slipped with the screewdriver... Could fix it by some bypass cables and emergency soldering. Working in a not too purdy hillbilly-fix way. Soundwise no difference with new caps.
Lesson learned.
If it aint broken - don´t fix it.

If you can't hear a difference going from electrolytic caps to film and foil it's not the new caps that are the problem.

 

[drbiggles]

Capacitors are also a protection device. They filter out damaging frequencies. When they get old, the esr rises and they leak. Drivers begin to see frequencies they werent designed to handle. You can also overdrive them trying to hear the highs, and possibly fry them. If i dont appreciate the sound with the new caps, i try another brand or type.

Biggles

 

[Joe6805]

They filter out damaging frequencies...Drivers begin to see frequencies they werent designed to handle.

If i dont appreciate the sound with the new caps, i try another brand or type.

Very true. The “driver seeing frequencies they weren’t meant to see” is the only reason I’m considering recapping my Mach 3s. They sound great for the most part, but how do you ever KNOW that the cutoffs are where they intended?

Regarding the “trying another brand or type”, that part is harder for me to personally get behind. Not only does that become expensive (especially given some of the caps people recommend here), but the worst part is, some speakers are a chore to get to the x-over boards on. I hate the thought of trying a cap, hating it, and having to pull the woofers a bunch of times. Not sure how many tries you get with wood screws in particle board before they strip, etc.

I’d love to be one and done and upgrade to poly caps. For me though, the biggest worry is trying an “expensive” poly cap and hating it. The problem there lies in that, not only is everyone’s taste different, but so is their hearing and perception. So what some say sounds great, may be too bright or harsh for others. Sibilance is one thing that drives me NUTS, but again, how do we say “this cap won’t cause it for sure”?

Just my thoughts .

Joe

 

[F1nut]

Very true. The “driver seeing frequencies they weren’t meant to see” is the only reason I’m considering recapping my Mach 3s. They sound great for the most part, but how do you ever KNOW that the cutoffs are where they intended?

Regarding the “trying another brand or type”, that part is harder for me to personally get behind. Not only does that become expensive (especially given some of the caps people recommend here), but the worst part is, some speakers are a chore to get to the x-over boards on. I hate the thought of trying a cap, hating it, and having to pull the woofers a bunch of times. Not sure how many tries you get with wood screws in particle board before they strip, etc.

I’d love to be one and done and upgrade to poly caps. For me though, the biggest worry is trying an “expensive” poly cap and hating it. The problem there lies in that, not only is everyone’s taste different, but so is their hearing and perception. So what some say sounds great, may be too bright or harsh for others. Sibilance is one thing that drives me NUTS, but again, how do we say “this cap won’t cause it for sure”?

Just my thoughts .

Joe

Read this, which I've found to be spot on.

http://www.humblehomemadehifi.com/Cap.html

 

[drbiggles]

Very true. The “driver seeing frequencies they weren’t meant to see” is the only reason I’m considering recapping my Mach 3s. They sound great for the most part, but how do you ever KNOW that the cutoffs are where they intended?

Regarding the “trying another brand or type”, that part is harder for me to personally get behind. Not only does that become expensive (especially given some of the caps people recommend here), but the worst part is, some speakers are a chore to get to the x-over boards on. I hate the thought of trying a cap, hating it, and having to pull the woofers a bunch of times. Not sure how many tries you get with wood screws in particle board before they strip, etc.

I’d love to be one and done and upgrade to poly caps. For me though, the biggest worry is trying an “expensive” poly cap and hating it. The problem there lies in that, not only is everyone’s taste different, but so is their hearing and perception. So what some say sounds great, may be too bright or harsh for others. Sibilance is one thing that drives me NUTS, but again, how do we say “this cap won’t cause it for sure”?

Just my thoughts .

Joe

The issue is, one brand doesnt fit all. What works for one set of drivers, wont necessarily work for everything else.

Biggles

 

[Joe6805]

Read this, which I've found to be spot on.

http://www.humblehomemadehifi.com/Cap.html

Thanks! Had stumbled upon that recently, but wasn’t sure if it was accurate. Nice to know it is.

Someone had suggested Clarity PX to me in another thread once. Do you know from experience if they’re overly bright or sibilant?

The issue is, one brand doesnt fit all. What works for one set of drivers, wont necessarily work for everything else.

Biggles

Another great point, which further complicates things haha. Biggles, have you used Clarity PX series?

Thanks guys,

Joe

 

[F1nut]

Thanks! Had stumbled upon that recently, but wasn’t sure if it was accurate. Nice to know it is.

Someone had suggested Clarity PX to me in another thread once. Do you know from experience if they’re overly bright or sibilant?



Another great point, which further complicates things haha. Biggles, have you used Clarity PX series?

Thanks guys,

Joe

I haven't used the PX type, but the CSA type is not bright or sibilant by any stretch.

 

[Joe6805]

I haven't used the PX type, but the CSA type is not bright or sibilant by any stretch.

Good to know, thanks!

Hate to sound dumb with terms, but see the link you provided mentions a few terms I’m not overly familiar with. Says some could use more “transparency”?

Do see that the Clarity SA says the “S and T” in vocals is “plasticy”. Is that another word for the sibilance I despise, or something different?

Put Mundorf E-Caps in another pair of Realistics I had, and loved them for the most part. Warm sound, and no sibilance. Would be nice to go with something that lasts longer though, and the Mundorfs are only 50v. The Mach’s are all 50v also, with the exception of the tweeter caps. They use 2 poly caps in series, 3.3 uF and 250v each. Not sure why, or if they’d be worth messing with since they’re already poly?

Thanks,

Joe

 

[F1nut]

Good to know, thanks!

Hate to sound dumb with terms, but see the link you provided mentions a few terms I’m not overly familiar with. Says some could use more “transparency”?

Do see that the Clarity SA says the “S and T” in vocals is “plasticy”. Is that another word for the sibilance I despise, or something different?

Put Mundorf E-Caps in another pair of Realistics I had, and loved them for the most part. Warm sound, and no sibilance. Would be nice to go with something that lasts longer though, and the Mundorfs are only 50v. The Mach’s are all 50v also, with the exception of the tweeter caps. They use 2 poly caps in series, 3.3 uF and 250v each. Not sure why, or if they’d be worth messing with since they’re already poly?

Thanks,

Joe

Think of transparency as detail or a crystal clear window. Some like hyper detail, I don't as it doesn't sound like real music, but that doesn't mean I don't like detail, I do. I just don't like it when it screams.

Not entirely sure what plasticy means to him, but he indicates it's not bright/sibilant.

You're reading the SA comments, instead read the ESA and CSA comments.

 

[Joe6805]

Think of transparency as detail or a crystal clear window. Some like hyper detail, I don't as it doesn't sound like real music.

Not entirely sure what plasticy means to him, but he indicates it's not bright/sibilant.

You're reading the SA comments, instead read the ESA and CSA comments.

Thanks. I was just trying to get a feel for the whole Clarity line and noticed that comment, that’s all. Appreciate your help and advice!

Joe

 

[F1nut]

Thanks. I was just trying to get a feel for the whole Clarity line and noticed that comment, that’s all. Appreciate your help and advice!

Joe

Go with the CSA if using Clarity. Absolutely not bright/sibilant and not much more money than the lower end versions.

 

[F1nut]

For a real nice musical cap that doesn't cost much check out Obbligato. They have plenty of detail, but it doesn't scream at you. The only issue is their very limited values.

 

[drbiggles]

Thanks! Had stumbled upon that recently, but wasn’t sure if it was accurate. Nice to know it is.

Someone had suggested Clarity PX to me in another thread once. Do you know from experience if they’re overly bright or sibilant?



Another great point, which further complicates things haha. Biggles, have you used Clarity PX series?

Thanks guys,

Joe

Its all complicated! I have not tried the px series. That and many others are on my List.

Biggles

 

[StimpyWan]

Thanks! Had stumbled upon that recently, but wasn’t sure if it was accurate. Nice to know it is.

Someone had suggested Clarity PX to me in another thread once. Do you know from experience if they’re overly bright or sibilant?



Another great point, which further complicates things haha. Biggles, have you used Clarity PX series?

Thanks guys,

Joe

I haven't tried the Clarity PX series, but I've used their ESA and CSA series. Very warm and musical, with absolutely no sibilance. Smooth. A great cap for people who want to upgrade to film, but yet retain a vintage sound.

 

[Joe6805]

Thanks guys. Two votes for the CSA, that’s a start! Hardest part is when every guy swears by something different, it’s nice to see a bit of a consensus.

So, if you will...which poly caps are the ones that give them a bad name, being overly bright and harsh? Not only want to know what to look for, but which to avoid lol.

Thanks,

Joe

 

[StimpyWan]

Thanks guys. Two votes for the CSA, that’s a start! Hardest part is when every guy swears by something different, it’s nice to see a bit of a consensus.

So, if you will...which poly caps are the ones that give them a bad name, being overly bright and harsh? Not only want to know what to look for, but which to avoid lol.

Thanks,

Joe

Some say Solen caps are bright and sibilant. Especially, the PB series. The PB series is very inexpensive, so they get recommended fairly often. However, the PB series was designed for circuit board electronics use, and not for speakers. I think that leads to their brighter sound signature, when used in crossovers.

Also, I've used Dayton 5% film caps. For the price, they're fairly balanced in sound. Just slightly warm, with a decent soundstage. But, I found them sibilant. Even spitty at times, with an emphasis on "Esss" sounds. I added a Dayton film and foil bypass cap, which helped calm down that harshness.

 

[onwardjames]

2. What caps do you use? (Please don’t respond Dayton)

What's wrong with Daytons? Asking, because I've found them to be fine for most anything below a price point. Please elucidate.

EDIT - I plowed thru this rather ugly thread and found what I needed. Thanks nonetheless.

 

[jobrewer1983]

What's wrong with Daytons? Asking, because I've found them to be fine for most anything below a price point. Please elucidate.

EDIT - I plowed thru this rather ugly thread and found what I needed. Thanks nonetheless.

Yea as I said, I don’t dislike Dayton’s at all but feel there are others that will yield better results

Good to see ya James

 

[onwardjames]

Yea as I said, I don’t dislike Dayton’s at all but feel there are others that will yield better results

Good to see ya James

Appreciate the heads up, as I've used daytons several times.

If I get the guts to attempt a recap on my McIntosh XRT 20's, I'll step my game up.

Always good to see ya, too. New avatar, I believe ? He/She needs a mouse-snack.

 

[jobrewer1983]

Appreciate the heads up, as I've used daytons several times.

If I get the guts to attempt a recap on my McIntosh XRT 20's, I'll step my game up.

Always good to see ya, too. New avatar, I believe ? He/She needs a mouse-snack.

Yea a new avatar he (Hunter) is my orange tabby.

I’ve used a lot of Dayton caps, that’s how I know they are good but that’s what they are... good

I’m a fan of the Jantzen line, I think they are just a well balance of good top end yet not stuffy and gives the sparkle and warmth but not over done. They are not crazy $$ either it’s well worth the extra 3-4 bucks in a build.