Zilch's AK Design Collaborative - Econowave Speaker

[Bauhausler]

More e-waves

Still plugging along, I see. I've been away from the ewave stuff for a while but will be getting back to it. I need to build at least 1 more pair and my dentist has a pair of NL Advents he's had since college. It would be interesting to ewave those and stack them up against his JBL 4411s.
I scored 8 more D210Ti (the older specimen) relatively cheaply. One pair has already gone to GeoFed for use in the wood horn build project. I'm ordering some PH612 today. Back-ordered again. Thanks to you guys this may be the most popular DIY waveguide of all time.
I've been listening to the DQ-10waves with the QSC waveguides and B&C DE-10 drivers, all with the stock 8 Ohm Ewave crossover. Nothing to complain about here.

 

[Brett]

Any input/opinion on E-waving Celestion Ditton 15? Been offered a pair with an intermittent tweeter.

I'll watch with interest if you do, as I have a pair sitting around with good tweets that need the scabby boxes replaced. Not sure which WG to suggest though.

 

[oldskl]

Still plugging along, I see. I've been away from the ewave stuff for a while but will be getting back to it. I need to build at least 1 more pair and my dentist has a pair of NL Advents he's had since college. It would be interesting to ewave those and stack them up against his JBL 4411s.
I scored 8 more D210Ti (the older specimen) relatively cheaply. One pair has already gone to GeoFed for use in the wood horn build project. I'm ordering some PH612 today. Back-ordered again. Thanks to you guys this may be the most popular DIY waveguide of all time.
I've been listening to the DQ-10waves with the QSC waveguides and B&C DE-10 drivers, all with the stock 8 Ohm Ewave crossover. Nothing to complain about here.

How are the 103/3,s going?

 

[Bauhausler]

How are the 103/3,s going?

Er... I had forgotten about those. I guess they're on my 'to do' list after fixing a pair of Curcio Dynaco MK IIIs for a friend (fried boards), rebuilding my Accuphase E202 amp and developing a tube amp build article for Make Magazine. So it's going to be a while.

 

[oldskl]

Your a busy beaver. I'm using mine with a full octave EQ and even that makes big difference. I'm trying to decide weather to hold out for a kube or get a 1/3 octave EQ.

 

[Bauhausler]

Somewhere on AK I posted the curve for that equalization. I don't think there's anything there that a 1 octave EQ wouldn't cover. I paid $100 for the Kube on That Auction Site and figure it was worth it. I'll run mine with the Behringer DEQ2496 but bought a Kube in case I ever sell them.

 

[oldskl]

Somewhere on AK I posted the curve for that equalization. I don't think there's anything there that a 1 octave EQ wouldn't cover. I paid $100 for the Kube on That Auction Site and figure it was worth it. I'll run mine with the Behringer DEQ2496 but bought a Kube in case I ever sell them.

Yes I got that info from the thread and used it to set the EQ. Thanks that curve info really helped out. Do you think a 1/3 octave eq will make alot of difference over the 1 octave eq?

 

[fastbike]

It's a little simplistic, but if your cab can fit the waveguide and you stick w/ a woofer of the same size as the original, you won't be too far off. It gets more complicated if you're building a cab from scratch or sticking a very different driver in the cab.

The real beauty of Ewave is that it completely meets its original design criteria. It's effectively a 2 way module. The compression driver/waveguide, crossover appropriate to woofer impedance and sensitivity, and any woofer, and you're good to go. The one woofer criteria you need to watch is that the woofer will play beyond the 1600 Hz crossover (i.e. no/few subwoofer drivers). Other than that you're virtuallu guaranteed good to great sound.

The Standard Ewave (w/ PE cabs) for $400 the pair is hard to beat for cost/simplicity/results.

Unfortunately, my eyes tend to glaze over when looking at mathematical formulas beyond basic algebra. I'm probably not going to know the Thiele/Small parameters of the drivers, so I guess the best bet would be to do an OAC (observe and copy)... see what cabinets have been used successfully and follow along. Although I did see a set of old JBL 2800's which are two-way and have rather spacious cabinet fronts for mounting that Selenium tweeter.

 

[oldskl]

These are the my newest E-waves using the cabinets and woofers from a pair of AR TSW-610's. The cabinets are sealed and the crossover on the woofer is 900 hz. The walnut panel on the fronts were the bottoms and the tops are now the bottoms. The sound is pretty nice but I think I put too much fill in the cabinets so I will experimenting with that.

 

[Zilch]

Very cleverly integrated, and nicely finished, Oldskl. I like your design very much! :thmbsp:

650438/10647=61.0912​

 

[oldskl]

Very cleverly integrated, and nicely finished, Oldskl. I like your design very much! :thmbsp:

650438/10647=61.0912​

Thanks, the midrange with this woofer combo sounded the best to me of all the woofers I tried. I will eventually up grade to the STD E-wave kit with the Dayton woofer.

 

[von.ah]

Those look really cool. Slick switcheroo! What little cab is that on the waveguide?

 

[GordonW]

My next Ewave will probably be similar to oldskl... I just got a pair of relatively-nice Advent Maestro cabinets with good woofers, but no mids and tweeters. Now to figure out how to re-configure the baffle...

Regards,
Gordon.

 

[shrinkboy]

i need some help from e-wavers-- my project is here: http://www.audiokarma.org/forums/showthread.php?p=3639945#post3639945 and i am not happy with the way the speakers sound. when first installed in the system, i was favorably impressed, but also recognized i was confronted with something i'd never experienced before either, so i just decided to listen and absorb for several weeks, and have come to the conclusion that there is something i'm not happy with.

i will also add the following: i have tinnitis, and in addition to this, have a more recently acquired sound damaged ear that rings and buzzes on certain upper mid-range tones, and about which i can do nothing. i've noticed some speakers irritate it worse than others- car speakers, computer speakers are the worst offenders. except for now, the jbl/selenium setup in the ewaves...ring-y ding-y.

and bass seems hollow and recessed, with a tendency to boom. i don't have test gear, don't know anybody who does. but, i know that with good dome tweeters, i don't get the ring-y ding-y buzzes. and what to do about the bass boom? i've not encountered that in my room before.

i've tried to figger what might be going on here. i know that i have my signal paths correct in both speakers. however, i have wondered if the jbl l14a's i'm using are the ones that have reversed polarity, and if they are, would that cause the recessed sound...?

with the tweeter ring, i'm stumped. the l-pads dont seem to do anything that my damaged ears can hear...but i can't hear any change on anything with an l-pad. i checked on my rehabbed AR 2ax's just to make sure. and i switched my AR's back into the system just to have a frame of reference, and my reaction was 'ahh...relief' when playing the same program material....

i'll stop for now...ideas?

 

[Zilch]

LE14As are negative polarity and should be reverse connected for optimum coherency.... :yes:

 

[shrinkboy]

THANK-ya!! Zilch...what about the ring-y ding-y's?

 

[Zilch]

Subjective tinnitus is not well understood, but is commonly (though not exclusively) linked to noise-induced hearing loss, the deficit being coincident with the ringing or whistling frequency, and it may be excited by sounds containing that same portion of the spectrum. A day of loudspeaker testing without hearing protection can set mine off for weeks.

I view this as an occupational hazard of late. HOLMImpulse warns you of the dangers of high-intensity high-frequency noise energy with every click of the "Measure" button. Our ears do have some built-in protection ability, but it is limited, and does not respond fast enough to limit or mitigate the effects of instantaneous noise impulses.

EconoWave has full-spectrum flat response, and I have to be cautious about SPL levels. If I crank them up, it is only for brief periods. The risk in these and other speakers having similar output capability lies in the fact that they will play distortion-free at very high levels, and it's easy to exceed safe limits with no distortion cues to provide warning. The trusty RadioShack SPL meter sits within easy reach at my normal listening position, rarely reading higher than 85dB, the NIOSH and OSHA limit for 8-hour exposure.

Live performance levels of rock music WILL damage hearing and excite tinnitus.... :yes:

 

[donprice]

with the tweeter ring, i'm stumped. the l-pads dont seem to do anything that my damaged ears can hear...but i can't hear any change on anything with an l-pad.

I'll apologize in advance for some obvious answers...sorry!

Turning the L-pad down all the way should completely shut off the horn. That should be very easy to hear with almost any source material. If you can't shut off the horn, it is wired wrong or the L-pad is shorted or ????

No idea why it would be more annoying than another style tweeter unless it is louder.

Get a second opinion on the sound quality if you haven't already.

 

[shrinkboy]

i am going to start by reconnecting the woofers as Zilch suggests, and see if somehow the woofer was interfering with the tweeter as it crosses over into the upper midrange...and i know from having double triple quadruple checked that the l-pads are connected correctly...

 

[oldskl]

Those look really cool. Slick switcheroo! What little cab is that on the waveguide?

Elaborate please. Are you talking about the small cabinet around the waveguide? Or the small speaker sitting on top of the TSW-610 in the picture of it, if so that is the AK Indignia.