Dual 1019 or Garrard Zero 100...?

[JonL]

I've always been intrigued by the Zero 100 tonearm concept and would like to have one just to futz around with. If I had unlimited time to pursue my hobbies I'd like to try to build a high quality DIY tonearm using the same concept. In my mind the only theoretical deficiency in the articulated headshell idea compared with a linear tracker is that the articulated headshell is still subject to skating forces, and the forces are variable with tonearm position (because the angle of the headshell changes with tonearm position). Dealing with the skating force is probably easier from a design perspective than dealing with the mechanical complexity, friction, and control of a linear tracker though. I often wonder why no other manufacturers successfully marketed a similar but higher quality design.

 

[typesix]

Used to have its less expensive cousin, the Zero 92 mated with Shure M91ED. The only problem was in tracking warped records. The high tonearm mass would actually leave the arm/cartridge assembly hanging in mid air on some warps before dropping back onto the vinyl.

 

[Nat]

For those of you who really want to get rid of tracking error in all its guises, there was a very small production run tonearm that not only pivoted to maintain perpendicularity to the groove, but it also pivoted to maintain parallelism to the record. I think the designer responded here or at Vinyl Engine to questions about it that arose when one was sold on eBay. I think the name began with L, but maybe someone with better memory can call up the name.

 

[Grainger49]

I sold both tables. The Dual is better. The Garrard doesn't really track that well, the arm is too massive. If you have a cartridge that works well with the Dual arm it is not likely to work well in the Garrard. But if you have a higher compliance cartridge that doesn't perform its best in the Dual it should work better in the Garrard.

Almost to a man the board votes for the Dual. I think you have your answer.

 

[secretguy]

To the OP...I have a Garrard GT55, which has a MUCH improved version of the zero tracking error arm...and even on it, I wouldn't play any records that are irreplaceable. Just my opinion, although backed by common knowledge.

 

[Nat]

I, too, have a GT 55 -- I'd forgotten. In many ways a nice table, though the bearings are somewhat sloppy, I think in actual use they are okay, but I wouldn't put a low compliance cartridge in it. But on mine, at least, if you rotated the platter by hand, for example when cleaning a record, the speed control would relentlessly move -- I couldn't figure out why, since its hard to believe the induced watts would be that powerful. Annoyed the heck out of me, so on to the shelf it went.

 

[audiojones]

Hello everyone,
I just got an offer by a friend's Dad to trade my Dual 1019 for his Garrard Zero 100. Both tables work well...should i do it?
I like my Dual 1019 but I don't know much about the Garrard Zero 100.

I really like the Zero 100 but I think I'd stick with the 1019. I've had a number of Zero 100 tables over the years, some were really great and some were just slapped together carelessly. The older ones that were well put together were a joy to own and use, but the later ones with slipshod build quality were more like a BSR than a Garrard. BTW - I've always found the Zero arm to track and behave very nicely with a Shure M91ED or M75ED type II cartridge and stylus combo.

The 1019 was always well built and (IMHO) is more of an audiophile table. It's got a nice heavy platter and a very quiet motor (not that a properly built Garrard Synchro-Lab motor is anything to sneeze at). The 1019 is also a great table because it doesn't suffer from the typical Dual automatic arm return mechanism problems that plague the 1200 series.

One of the most common issues with the 1019 that you need to watch out for is the headshell wiring and contact shoe corrosion. I have found that by soldering in new cartridge leads and cleaning the contacts with a fiberglass bristle brush (including the jack plate underneath) the hum and dropout issues usually disappear completely. Be very careful with the headshell, it's practically unobtainable anymore (not the same as the one used in the 1200 series).

Anyway, keep the 1019 would be my advice. You can usually find inexpensive Zero 100 turntables on Ebay if you decide to check one out.

 

[teac4010]

Don't know how to respond gracefully to this picking apart of my comments. But obviously tracking error is real --

Glad we agree.:yes:

what I was trying to get at is that in theory, the solutions to it are perfect, but in practice they all introduce complexity and very often other problems which may be as bad as the error being corrected.

... i would venture to say that tracking errors are THE MOST MENTIONED errors associated with single pivot tonearms. Tracking errors sound terrible, to me.:thumbsdn: I hear no tracking errors with the Zero!

So: If you are going to specify that users will always align cartridges perfectly, and that the bearings in the arm are perfectly adjusted (a notion that will cause considerable hilarity among owners of moderate priced british products of the 70s) and that all users knows how to clean them and how often, then okay.

...... I would hope so, doesn't everyone maintain their turntables? :yes:

And I guess that if you believe that arm mass and resonances don't matter,

........ they do matter and that's why there are countless combinations of cartridges/stylus/isolation materials/record clamps/mats/etc/etc for all record playing things. Right? I've never noticed arm resonance with the Zero.

or can be fixed with different solutions (unspecified, but it odd that if they exist, everyone isn't using them), than there's no debate here.

......... I'm not selling anything so who cares anymore? :thmbsp:

However, I can make an inexpensive Zero tracker reveal all the inherent shortcomings in vinyl recordings without adding anything undesirable and that's what some people are interested in. :thmbsp:

Peace. Regards.

 

[Grainger49]

Let's try to help the OP rather than prove our points.

 

[Rybeam]

Looking at the wide, wide world of tone arms and tables I get the impression that "zero tracking error" is not all that important, other wise tone arm manufactures would address it.

All decent arms would be linear if it was really important.

Grab the Dual.

 

[JonL]

Looking at the wide, wide world of tone arms and tables I get the impression that "zero tracking error" is not all that important, other wise tone arm manufactures would address it.

All decent arms would be linear if it was really important.

Grab the Dual.

I think "zero tracking error" IS important, and the reason all decent arms aren't linear is because it is far easier to make an excellent pivoting arm - even with its tracking error - than it is to make an excellent linear tracking arm. It's kind of a case that the cure can be worse than the disease. Nonetheless, I agree with your conclusion that the Dual is likely the better arm and the better table.

 

[INDIANSCOUT]

What?

I suppose I will be the only defender of the Garrard Zero-100c. I bought mine new in 1974 and this table has played better than other tables I have owned. I now own only two TT. One is a Technics SL-1200 with a Shure V-15 type III(was fortunate to store several before they were all sold out). I use this for stereo records. My Z-100 is used for the difficult task of playing quadraphonic SQ, CD-4 and QS 4-channel records. The "Z" is the only one that picks up the signals from these quad records accurately and the sound is audible. I use an Audio-Technica AT20ss(super Shibata) cart. I use a Sansui QRX-9001 that has been rebuilt and upgraded to reproduce the decodings correctly. My "Z" has been excellent and I service it occasionally. It has never given me any problems and continues to used almost daily. I may have gotten the only great one but mine IS great and although I have owned Dual, I found that the "Zero-100" to be perfect for difficult tracking with quad records. I would never give it up for any other table. I have used the new brands like VPI, Linn and Rega but I think many of these old vintage tables are better at least in reproducing audiophile sound.