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FF/REW fix ctf-8282,9191,1000 RXA-581, NOT DIY

Not really, I'm not sure how fine of a dimensional control as well as smooth finish is available, and then we are back to the original stresses the way the part was designed.
The band "fix" is permanent, overrides the "defect", and I had several hundred made in a custom manufacturing run. Unfortunately, other parts need adjusting to fit this in, otherwise
my life would be a bit easier in not having to do the clutch repairs.

I DO have hopes about OTHER parts that 3D printing could reproduce.
 
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Another plaintive call for HAAALP! I have a minty 9191 here. MTF's clutch installed and the pivot lightly lubricated. Also a fresh WJOE motor tire seems to be working excellently. The motor, of course, cranks beautifully. FWD works like a horny beast--but RWD still slows down and dies after an enthusiastic start, with about 10% of the tape remaining. It appears that the idler on the clutch is unable to turn the lefthand spindle in RWD and on PLAY the righthand spindle doesn't rotate. I lubricated both spindles carefully, avoiding the nylon/felt/nylon clutches on them. The tension spring is at the most distal position and the solenoid successfully unbrakes both spindles on FWD/RWD. I also lubricated and checked the counter worm gear, and finally removed that belt to take it out of the drive sequence temporarily. What am I missing? Both spindles, when unbraked, turn relatively unfettered. I'm sure this has been an issue over and over--could someone point me to the discussion that will help me? Thank you all very much in advance.
 
JCHaywire said:
Another plaintive call for HAAALP! I have a minty 9191 here. MTF's clutch installed and the pivot lightly lubricated. Also a fresh WJOE motor tire seems to be working excellently. The motor, of course, cranks beautifully. FWD works like a horny beast--but RWD still slows down and dies after an enthusiastic start, with about 10% of the tape remaining. It appears that the idler on the clutch is unable to turn the lefthand spindle in RWD and on PLAY the righthand spindle doesn't rotate. I lubricated both spindles carefully, avoiding the nylon/felt/nylon clutches on them. The tension spring is at the most distal position and the solenoid successfully unbrakes both spindles on FWD/RWD. I also lubricated and checked the counter worm gear, and finally removed that belt to take it out of the drive sequence temporarily. What am I missing? Both spindles, when unbraked, turn relatively unfettered. I'm sure this has been an issue over and over--could someone point me to the discussion that will help me? Thank you all very much in advance.
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Well JC I'm waiting to receive a rebuilt clutch for my 1000. I also ordered a belt and pulley kit from WJOE for it. I don't know if he has parts for your 9191 but maybe that's what it needs. Can't really help anymore than that.
 
The motion sensor belt was just a tad too snug. When I put on one a couple millimeters longer, ET phoned home, the I called the hogs, and we circled the wagons. Everything works great. MarkTheFixer is a fixer indeed.
 
strat1953 said:
do you have the rubber tire that drives the ff and rew parts for the cf8282? its worn and not grabbing the ff and rew wheels.let me know where i can find it strat1953@aol.com
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My non-commercial personal replacements are short segments of rubber (fuel type) hose with the appropriate small inner diameter and wall thickness, super glued on.

Other than that I haven't looked too hard for overt replacements.

Also "worn and not grabbing" is what happens to it when the clutch cracks and effort to turn it multiplies beyond capacity, grinding down the drive tire.

So if you have gotten a "fixed clutch" but still have a ground down drive tire, it's time to mosey on over to a Home Depot to look at their rubber hose assortment.
 
Well, son-of-a-biscuit, was about to throw this 9191 out the window due to the rw/ff issue. I replaced the belts and idler tire and still wasn't working correctly. Never would have thought it was a cracked clutch. Guess I will have to tear it down again. Well Mark, you may get another clutch soon, no way I am going to attempt that repair with this deck.
 
Mark if I may, the plastic cylindrical bushing that you put the brass sleeve over, it appears to be part of the lower plastic house as in 1 mold? what does the bottom look like? part RNK-188? what is the inner and outer diameters of the plastic cylinder that cracks?
 
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The inner details of the base is complex, it includes a spring RBH-239, spring cup RNK-190 and mating tabs for the slots in the RNK-190

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My CT-F1000 has no play but a tiny bit of FF and REW. The belts look good. Suspecting the clutch, I disassembled it down to the point of pulling off the press fit cap. It won't budge and as they might have been glued together by someone, I want to be more sure of clutch slippage description in the event I could leave it alone. The assembly spins on the metal shaft fine with light finger touch while the "two" halves with the felt separating needs a medium 2-finger grip to spin them in opposite directions. Is that close to normal proper friction?
 
Nice description. Sounds reasonable but the rubber wheel on the ff/rew motor could be worn down, and that could be your point of motion loss.

The whole assembly should have an up and down clearance of about 1 mm when mounted on the end of the arm, when the small weaker spring below the clutch is pressing it up into the stack that is retained by the 1.5mm e-clip.
Sometimes the ff/rew speed is affected by friction in the tape movement sensor, the belts or the mechanical counter. Flush sensor & counter with faderlube, keep the belt path contact surface path unlubricated.
 
Well, some INVENTIVE individual glued a clutch and sold the deck w/o warning.

It finally came apart, but not at the glue lines, and it is wrecked. Irrecoverable.

So go ahead, glue it and wreck it. Wear your "independence" with pride. Doom the deck.
 
I was recently given a challenged CT-F1000 by a friend and although the clutch appears intact at this time I sent it to Mark for him to modify as a preventative measure. The deck is currently in pieces and I figured it just made sense to do now rather than having to deal with a failure later.
 
I sent my F9191 clutch to Mark and it was back in my hands two weeks later. Some new rubber, the "MTF" clutch, and now my deck mechanically performs like brand new. Thanks again Mark! :beerchug:
 
markthefixer said:
I have internationally mailed parts (bias diodes, belgium), not that expensive.

The sleeve wouldn't survive, there's a risk when installing it (I end up doing a bit of filing on both to get them to fit each other) plus the cutting for cylinder clearance needs the specialized tools. It isn't a profit motive, I'd rather just have posted the procedure and been done with it. But after some soul searching, I concluded that the danger of inexperienced attempts destroying the clutch would approach the 50 - 50 point. Even with my extreme care, I have ended up supplying replacements to clutches I busted.
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So the chances of getting a sleeve is out of the question? I have a 9191 that is doing this for awhile. Or can a suggestion be made as to where assistance can be had to build the clutch
 
markthefixer said:
Surprise!!!! Sproingggg.......
That tight friction fit between the post and the top button got WEAK!!! The assembly now does NOT float over the arm, instead the force of the big spring causes everything to bind - and tear up (formerly irreplaceable) expensive rubber on the drive motor's tire. Some early fixes tried to drive the frozen idler by increasing a spring size elsewhere, to increase the force of the motor drive tire onto the idler. Fail. Tear up that drive wheel really quick. Another fix tried to LIFT the binding surface of the botton of the idler ABOVE the arm. Fail. Still kills that drive tire.
View attachment 204854



The problem? Look at the post, there's a vertical CRACK in the post, and the part of the button that went down inside the post now just expands the post, rather than generating friction. The nylon dried out and lost some strength, and there IS a lot of tension there, so the nylon just split. The fix, a brass sleeve made out of brass tubing. Reinforces the entire post, the nylon is no longer in tension, it is in COMPRESSION. PASS.
Of course it's a lot of fun cutting something smaller than a pencil eraser, making sure the ends are square (not tilted or wobbly) and getting rid of any burrs inside which would make it impossible to get on, and any burrs on the outside that would make it impossible to get the idler B on. We're talking clearances of 0.001 inches. A lot of machining is 0.005 clearance... AND THEN, to make life miserable, KEEP from knocking the tube out of ROUND while doing all of this... fun...
but I figured it out. Die makers files, stuff like that...
View attachment 204859




BUT TANSTAAFL: there ain't no such thing as a free lunch..........
That sleeve increases the diameter of the post, and we DO get a freebie, the spring holder (green circle) clears it (edit - NOPE!! it gets bored out too because the button's outer wall expands). BUT the B idler doesn't fit over it. OK, easy enough... open up the hole in the B idler to restore the original clearance (the RED circle) - the sleeve isn't THAT thick..... well... close but no cookie...... LOOK AT THE BUTTON, on the Left.
Here comes the HARD part.
View attachment 204852


See the "halos", the green circle with the red circle inside of it, we'll get back to them. There is a tall nub that fits INSIDE of the idler B post, THAT'S the friction fit. The green cylinder drawn above it means that not only is the diameter correct, it is the all important friction fit surface that we must PRESERVE AT ALL COSTS.

Then there's the wall around it, forming a groove that the idler B post fits into, OR USED to fit into, until the brass sleeve was added.... OUCH.... so, options: 1. remove the wall, or 2. increase the groove's width (make that wall thinner) WITHOUT hurting the inner surface of the groove. Now we're back at the "halos", the red circle is the outer face of the groove, that must be made wider. The distance between the red halo part and the green halo part will end up being 0.008 inch ( eight thousandths of an inch ) when I'm done cutting..... So, I made another tool. It was a real %^$#^%%^%$ to make.... If I ever have a fire, I'm gonna grab that tool BEFORE the computer....

Note: the shavings around the button and in the groove are the result of stopping in the middle of the groove cutting to take a picture.

Success: this is what a good clutch looks like, the button is holding it all together without the assistance of the center shaft. So far I have done two (edit: aug 2017 - probably over 50 by now). I will do these clutches like I do the STV-2H, STV-3H, STV-4H diodes. I get and fix the broke ones...
View attachment 204855


and this is what good versus bad looks like when on the arm, the one on the left is good, the one on the right is binding.
View attachment 204870

this picture was taken FIRST, before the clutch on the right was repaired, all the other pictures are THAT CLUTCH being repaired.... I now have NO binding clutches.

EDIT - STILL here and fixing, even during "hiatus", as of SEPTEMBER 2020!!
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