Minneapolis Riots ?

[hjames]

Last night on the TV news (prob CBS), they showed a camera from a store across the street as Mr Floyd was escorted across a street
from his car to the police car, he did not seem to be violent in any way. He slipped or fell down at the police car (or was tripped - could not tell)
and from there it was the other video of the officer with his knee on Mr Floyd's neck.

 

[RobRoy]

Heather: Here a C+P of the portion of the article you've asked about:

"The arrest of Mr. Floyd took place on Monday evening. The Minneapolis Police Department said in a statement that officers had responded to a call about a man suspected of forgery. The police said the man was found sitting on top of a blue car and “appeared to be under the influence.”

“He was ordered to step from his car,” the department’s statement said. “After he got out, he physically resisted officers. Officers were able to get the suspect into handcuffs and noted he appeared to be suffering medical distress.”

(..... further down in the article .....)

The bystander video shows a white Minneapolis police officer pressing his knee into a black man’s neck during an arrest, as the man repeatedly says, “I can’t breathe,” and, “Please, I can’t breathe.”

The video recorded in Minneapolis on Monday shows that after a few minutes, the man, lying face down in the street with his hands cuffed behind his back, becomes silent and motionless; the officer continues to pin the man to the pavement with his knee.

Bystanders plead and curse, begging the officer to stop and telling him the man’s nose is bleeding. Another officer faces the people gathered on the sidewalk. An ambulance medic arrives and, reaching under the officer’s knee, feels for a pulse on the man’s neck.

The medic turns away, and a stretcher is wheeled over. The arrested man is then rolled onto the stretcher, loaded into an ambulance and taken away.

The video did not show what had happened before the officer pinned the man to the ground by his neck."

Not that it has anything to do with this state, but I have to comment on your last sentence. You are absolutely right. Remember Rodney King? They just kept showing people the last few moments where cops were pounding the guy. They didn't show the high speed chase or him attempting to get one of the cops guns, and the fact that thanks to being high on PCP, he was almost uncontrollable, by several cops.

The press was being like the little brother that keeps hitting you and trying to take your candy and when you finally smack him, yells, "MOM! BILLY HIT ME!"

 

[Pio1980]

I have been affiliated with the local F.O.P. for 40 years.
I have known most of the officers in the area.
80% of them were all good guys
10% of them were ok but you could tell they had issues.
the last 10% I stayed away from the best I could. they
were the arrogant elitist jerks you did not want to encounter.
a lot of them got fired over the years but their are still some out there.

The FOPs defense of the jerks is why I quit donating to any of them.

 

[reddodge053]

 

[RickeyM]

Those rioting looting and burning are not honoring George Floyd. The peaceful protesters were. Some saw a chance to steal & destroy and some others became a mob and followed along. I'm not entirely sure there were not outside agitators present but that still doesn't excuse it.
The initial police response (highly dubious these days) says he resisted arrest. The police call resisting arrest anything from simply pulling away from them on up to a fistfight as resisting arrest. The security cam video released showed Mr.Floyd complying and the store owner said he saw no resisting either. Resisting or not once they had the cuffs on him and had him on the ground he was not resisting. He was then under control. Pinning someone down with a knee on their neck for nearly 10 minutes is asking for injury. That was just punishment.

 

[Pio1980]

You just described the American revolution.

Right, an uprising responding to chronic flagrant abuse of authority.

 

[RobRoy]

Right, an uprising responding to chronic flagrant abuse of authority.

Yep. It's right there in the Declaration of independence, as summarized in this line: "But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security."

 

[hjames]

Not that it has anything to do with this state, but I have to comment on your last sentence. You are absolutely right. Remember Rodney King? They just kept showing people the last few moments where cops were pounding the guy. They didn't show the high speed chase or him attempting to get one of the cops guns, and the fact that thanks to being high on PCP, he was almost uncontrollable, by several cops.

The press was being like the little brother that keeps hitting you and trying to take your candy and when you finally smack him, yells, "MOM! BILLY HIT ME!"

So, view the video footage below from across the street that shows the whole arrest.
There were 3 people in the minivan. 2 got out peacefully and moved offcamera.
Its obvious that no one got violent.
but the result was the murder of an unarmed, restrained man. Allegedly for forgery?

Absolutely nothing like your little brother story, who was not murdered.

https://kstp.com/news/surveillance-video-shows-events-leading-up-to-george-floyds-arrest/5742404/
Security camera footage of what led up to the arrest. No sound.

 

[Pio1980]

Not that it has anything to do with this state, but I have to comment on your last sentence. You are absolutely right. Remember Rodney King? They just kept showing people the last few moments where cops were pounding the guy. They didn't show the high speed chase or him attempting to get one of the cops guns, and the fact that thanks to being high on PCP, he was almost uncontrollable, by several cops.

The press was being like the little brother that keeps hitting you and trying to take your candy and when you finally smack him, yells, "MOM! BILLY HIT ME!"

Anger driven beatdowns like this were a fairly common practice, tho not ethical or legal. "Accidents" and denial were the explanations if not captured on camera. These uprisings do not spring from a potpourri scented meadow.

 

[NH-MAN]

I was a cop in the Air force, (yes we are real cops) and I was on a base with 25K people which also had the highest domestic abuse in all the military

We were trained to never escalate situations ever. If I ever kneeled on someone's neck during apprehension I would have been in Prison.

 

[noogies]

I'm pleased to see this thread still open. Congrats to the mods for their patience and tolerance.

 

[hjames]

I'm pleased to see this thread still open. Congrats to the mods for their patience and tolerance.

Congrats to all the participants who remain civil while discussing a difficult event.

 

[danrclem]

Did the people who got their stores vandalized and destroyed deserve this? Did the people who got their vehicles destroyed deserve this? Did any of the people who got their property stolen or destroyed deserve this? I want somebody to tell me what they did to George Floyd to deserve this.

 

[JimPA]

You never see a quiet riot.

 

[Pio1980]

Did the people who got their stores vandalized and destroyed deserve this? Did the people who got their vehicles destroyed deserve this? Did any of the people who got their property stolen or destroyed deserve this? I want somebody to tell me what they did to George Floyd to deserve this.

There's a certain amount of opportunism in the rage and frustration of the response to "same stuff, different day" aspects to the circumstances of abuse of authority which sparked the subsequent events. Accountability needs be universal and impartial for subjects and enforcement.

 

[chicks]

https://www.newyorker.com/news/daily-comment/the-death-of-george-floyd-in-context

 

[PPstereo]

Sometimes it's just about the job not paying well enough to attract quality applicants. And how long can a person, working as a police officer, watch injustice happen all around them and even when they DO arrest someone, they just find them back on the street the next day or week. After a few months or years of this, it can challenge the integrity of any person. It's why I can't imagine, in this day and age, aspiring to be a cop. My personal solution is to conceal carry and figure I won't need a cop unless I find myself in the middle of this sort of mayhem.

But then, this speaks to why I left Seattle for rural KY.

This absolutely nails this COMPLEX problem. There is simply no one side to it all.

Especially when both sides are often at odds with one another.

Then you mix in mental issues, which again can at times be seen on both sides.

I really feel cops dont get enough time or chance to talk with professionals and decompress.

And when theres a systemic issue of crime occurring within centralized locations. And or groups of individuals. It certainly doesnt help matters.

There needs to be a genuine effort to have a deep dive conversation into the whys of how this all plays out. Sadly I never see any real effort to
have a honest, complex conversation about this MAJOR issue. And thats a real shame. As nothing will ever change if that never happens.

But on a positive note my guess is within the next 10 years or less the new generation of cops wont be able to be tainted by bias or predispositions.
They will simply do their job and I foresee a MAJOR reduction in crime. They dont fear areas cops dont want to go. Or become intimidated.
Or overreact. Finally all those problems disappear and the job just gets done.

 

[Pio1980]

Effective community policing needs to include stable exemplary mentoring to help break the cycle and invest the community in itself and its larger environment.
Adversarial policing has the exact opposite effect, enforcing entrenched insular reactive behavior.

 

[NH-MAN]

I was a cop in the Air force, (yes we are real cops) and I was on a base with 25K people which also had the highest domestic abuse in all the military

We were trained to never escalate situations ever. If I ever kneeled on someone's neck during apprehension I would have been in Prison.

There are so many good officers out there but you dont see videos of them as they are doing their jobs well.

Then there are the others who I feel just do not get good training or just shouldn't be on the force period.

We were trained so well and there was none of this he had a gun in his hand or I felt threatened. If you felt threatened you were taught to back off and de escalate and get cover. We couldn't just shoot someone that had a gun or something in their hand you had to give them the opportunity to drop it, even if you thought they were bringing a gun up to shoot you you still couldn't yet as we had scenarios when half way up they would drop it; you had to pass these things, we had to be that good period.

Four people, right next to the vehicle, stuff them in the car and get rid of the threat. You dont screw with them on the ground which is a form of escalation as its natural for people to want to fight when held down. Cuff em get em up and stuff em. Even if they were not completely searched you can monitor them let them calm down and pull them out again to do a better search.

There are tons of police who do the right things, they just dont have video's of them.

 

[hjames]

Did the people who got their stores vandalized and destroyed deserve this? Did the people who got their vehicles destroyed deserve this? Did any of the people who got their property stolen or destroyed deserve this? I want somebody to tell me what they did to George Floyd to deserve this.

Ask the bad police officer who executed George to explain. Its all on his back, him and the previous bad cops who also piled bad behavior onto a tough moment and failed badly.

Its not a logic problem, its not a tit for tat situation.

But you already knew that.