• The move to the new server is done. There are some software and database maintenance updates in process. This has us passing the hat around to help out. We appreciate any donations. Seriously, even a dollar helps. The payment page may be found here - https://www.audiokarma.org/support.html

So That's A Decent Direct Drive Table? OK I Will Take It

I hope it works out well for you Piggy.

Start another thread when you have had time to evaluate it. Remember like all non-suspended turntables, you are also listening to how they deal with vibrations that travel through the surface they stand upon. That includes all of your current stable.

Your next mission should you choose to accept it, is to investigate how they all sound when isolated to one degree or another.

My brain self-destructed five seconds ago....
 
theophile said:
... how they deal with vibrations that travel through the surface they stand upon.
My brain self-destructed five seconds ago....
Click to expand...

Audiophile should probably living on a solid ground or start to build a house made out of concrete instead of a house made out of wood.

Yes technics JITTERS in this case.

*I'm slowly disappearing as I said the jitter part*
LaLala... I'm a sinner now.
 
Congratulations on your purchase, Mr. Pig. It is always fun to experiment and see how far you can take the sound with a new table. :thmbsp:

From what I have seen in my few months here at AK, you document your journeys well and in a very entertaining manner.

I look forward to reading more about your SP-10 journey.
 
It is true that the Art of Sound probably has more Technics owners and fanboys than other forums. However, it is useful for information on setting up the SL1200, for example, once you've moved beyond the hyperbole.

I'm interested in what seems to me to be the odd one out, the AR. It was never close to the level of the other turntables, so if you wanted a belt drive of equal performance you'd be looking at Pink Triangle, Linn or Roksan, probably in that order. I appreciate the AR is essentially a different turntable under marcmorin's guiding hand, which means you probably really need one of the three I mentioned to have a true vintage comparison.

So, maybe now is not the time to be thinking about cutting back on your collection :).
 
jomondz said:
Audiophile should probably living on a solid ground or start to build a house made out of concrete instead of a house made out of wood.

Yes technics JITTERS in this case.

*I'm slowly disappearing as I said the jitter part*
LaLala... I'm a sinner now.
Click to expand...

My lounge room has a concrete slab floor.
 
No need for Mr. Pig to go to some other site just because he has a Technics, we enjoy his post right here.
 
jomondz said:
Me pig,

As a recently-updated-generic-type (1210 M5G) technics owner and hater-lover, the secret to the "singing" technics is hidden on the plinth.

What I did was removing the black rubber inside of the 1200 and it started to sing.

Untill recently, I hate messy bolts and things laying around. So, I decided to re install the hard black rubber back into 1200.

To my surprise, everything sounded dead and the bass sounded unnatural. While it doesn't sound as enjoyable without the inner hard black rubber, I can hear subtle sound.

Tonight, I'm planning to re-remove that rubber.

Oh, the feets are isomoe. The silver ones sounds better and more lively than the black ones.

Power transformer is removed from the body of the turntable and replaced with outside SMPS 20VDC supply.

Electronic circuit is/are optimized for "perfect" AC performance. Consequently, there is no enough starting torque, so, I have to turn the spinning table manually and let the speed "stabilize" and then drop the tonearm.

Hope that the "plinth magic" would also apply to those radio station technics as well to Garard.
I wish I had a garrard 401. The 401 looks sexy and modern although I believe it is very sensitive to what plinth is it paired with.

I wish you Good luck on the Technics journey you have choosen to experience.
Click to expand...

Those are some interesting observations. I never have owned a SL 1200, but rather the SP 25 and 15. As I recall they had the option of a rubber gasket between the plinth and the drive unit. I experimented with bolting it rigidly against the plinth and using silicone washers between the drive unit and plinth. Never did get the sound I had hoped for, but I have to say I loved the fit and finish and operational feel of those tables. They left enough of a positive impression that I am willing to allocate some greenbcks for the SP 10 and see if it can go where I need it to. Over the years I have read various threads where owners have traded in their LP 12 or TD 124 for the SP 10 and been satisfied, so I would say that has me intrigued. Is it possible?

Anyways, back to the dampening.....I had always felt that the frame transferred too much energy from the motor to the arm/cartridge portion of the table. Yet you are removing frame dampening and getting improved results. Not sure what to think of that at all, it seems counter intuitive to what we do in audio.....but hey if its what works i certainly think that is cool! I know there are people who advocate the remote locating of the 1200 power supply, or even an upgraded one like the Time Step. Do you happen to have any pictures of your table after your modifications?

Take care, and its cool to hear that your table is working so well for you.

Regards
Mister Pig
 
grottyash said:
It is true that the Art of Sound probably has more Technics owners and fanboys than other forums. However, it is useful for information on setting up the SL1200, for example, once you've moved beyond the hyperbole.

I'm interested in what seems to me to be the odd one out, the AR. It was never close to the level of the other turntables, so if you wanted a belt drive of equal performance you'd be looking at Pink Triangle, Linn or Roksan, probably in that order. I appreciate the AR is essentially a different turntable under marcmorin's guiding hand, which means you probably really need one of the three I mentioned to have a true vintage comparison.

So, maybe now is not the time to be thinking about cutting back on your collection :).
Click to expand...

Hi Grotty

Yeah I got a hankering for those other tables too. I have fond memories of Listening to a Valhalla equipped LP 12 with Ittok and Trioka on it during my college days. The local stereo store was kind enough to let a broke ass kid listen to it when no one was around. Beautiful table. I hear the Roksan Xerxes had issues with plinth sag, so I have always stayed away from them, and they aren't very easy to find in the states. Same thing with PT, and they were known to have reliability issues to boot. But I am tempted by them when they show up.

I try to be open minded about my audio gear, especially analog stuff. That is why I am waiting on this modified AR XA to arrive. The frame of lacewood is almost done, and then some serious work can start on it. I am willing to see what Marc creates, as I am not going t discount the experience of a talented engineer with lifelong experience with analog playback. If you think about it, this is the way many great small turntable manufacturers start, and I certainly wouldn't discount an early offering from SOTA or VPI for instance. So I am really looking forward to that table too.

As I said in a previous post, I am quite optimistic this is going to be a sweet table. I have to say i really loved the controls, feel, and fit and finish of the SP 25 and 15, otherwise I wouldn't spend the money to give this a shot. It helps to know that I can get my cash back out if it doesn't work for me....but on the other hand.....if it does.....well I could move some other tables on if I want to. I am the first to admit that the mechanical controls of my idlers are clunky in comparison, and the feel of them is definitely inferior to the Technics. But then again, it is about the sound...so we will see how it all turns out.

But I count myself fortunate to be in the right place at the right time to be able scoop up a few of this record playing machines. It certainly is informative to hear them do their thing, and not just think I know what they can do. In the years I have had to revise my opinion of what certain tables can do, and have gained a respect for many a vintage one.

Regards
Mister Pig
 
costerdock said:
Yes! I'm a bigtime Technics fanboy as per your derogatory comments - and proud of it - and do not hide behind a fake animal username. I fell for your opinion - and spent some cash on a table I didn't need - but that is on me for not trusting my own ears. Good luck with your review.
Click to expand...

How come on this site when Technics is mentioned in a thread you come in and pick a fight with anyone who may not like one or more of the models?

Really dude it's very tiresome and you should know that.
 
costerdock said:
Just my experience arguing with this guy for the last 3-4 years. I do not value his opinion. I'll say no more.
Click to expand...

So in other words you stalk his threads and comment on this site. Thanks for admitting what othes can see clearly and you really should stop... meaning you have no reason to post in this thread any longer unless it's for thread crapping.

PS: I don't need a reply..:no:
 
shelly_d said:
That is an impressive list of equipment. I went to the Vinyl Engine database to learn a little more about your stable, have been a little surprised at what you say about the SP15 and 25. Here is what I learned about the 3 Technics:

sp10 mark II : -73dB rumble, .025% wow and flutter
sp15 -78dB rumble, .025% wow and flutter
sp25 -78dB rumble, .025% wow and flutter

The SP10 is actually 5 dB nosier then the both the 15 and 25, with the same speed accuracy. I believe all of them meet tighter specs then either the Thorens or Garrard but I don't have the specs on those to compare, so that is only a personal opinion without any supporting documentation. In any case, the 2 Technics you tried and moved on from were very fine performers indeed so I have to wonder if it was the turntable you were dissatisfied with or the tonearm/cartridge/preamp that led to your dissatisfaction.

Just speculation on my part here. I'm sure that you will have fun with the SP10 when you get it.

Best of luck with it.

Shelly_D
Click to expand...
Am I wrong here?

I thought that a lower rumble number was better?

"Rumble
The measure of the low frequency (many tens of Hz) noise contributed by the turntable of an analogue playback system. It is caused by imperfect bearings, uneven motor windings, vibrations in driving bands in some turntables, room vibrations (e.g., from traffic) that is transmitted by the turntable mounting and so to the phono cartridge. A lower number is better."

From here, but still, i thought this was indeed how it works.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Audio_system_measurements#Analog_electrical
 
frying-bacon.jpg
 
Anyway, I hope the new table is very much to ya' liking, Mr. Pig :)

I was just chatting to someone with one, and they love theirs :thmbsp:
 
Frank Sol said:
Mr Pig , have you said which arm you will be using or undecided?
Click to expand...

I haven't quite decided. this whole thing came together in a quick time frame, and I wasn't really searching for a SP 10. i liked the idea of the possibility, but I was realizing that finding them isn't as easy as I once thought.

I like the idea of one of the Technics arms as I have friends who think highly of them. But I hear finding one in proper condition is not easy, and the costs are rising on them too. But I think this could be a bang up table, so I don't want to skimp either.

So perhaps my second choice would be one of these. I would opt for the 12" version.

494551-project_xtentionevolution_12cc_tonearm_fiber_carbonlike_new_condition.jpg


I also need a plinth, and am thinking of getting a 4" thick piece of acrylic water jetted for this. there are stacked plywood plinths for them also, with sand loaded in chambers. That might be an option.

But the first step is to get the table here safe and sound. My recent amp purchase proved that is not always the case.

Regards
Mister Pig
 
If you haven't already, you may want to read here http://www.theanalogdept.com/sp10_mule.htm. Steve also has a thread on diyAudio that follows this work in more detail as it progressed. I mention it because he's a TD-124 fan, so that's a reference point you both have in common that can help guide your project.

Also, I have a nice double-wall box here that I used expanding foam packs to hold the table, platter, and power supply with plenty of cushion along with a motor bracket that I used to ship my table from Boulder to NYC when I moved. You're welcome to use it if you want to pay the shipping to get it your seller, and return it to me when you're done.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom